Did Jesus walk by faith

[Goinheix]

You have totaly failed to refute the true fact that according to the Gospels; Jesus of Nazaret did not have any divine atribute at all. That is also according to the kenosis doctrine teached by Paul.

Not only that. My teaching are not contradicting:
1 any baptist statement of faith
2 any evangelic statement of faith
3 any teaching of the reformers
4 any creed of the christian church
5 any teaching of the fathers
6 any verse or text in the Bible and/or NT

 

[jbh28]

You have totaly failed to refute the true fact that according to the Gospels; Jesus of Nazaret did not have any divine atribute at all. That is also according to the kenosis doctrine teached by Paul.

Not only that. My teaching are not contradicting:
1 any baptist statement of faith
2 any evangelic statement of faith
3 any teaching of the reformers
4 any creed of the christian church
5 any teaching of the fathers
6 any verse or text in the Bible and/or NT

They disagree with all of those....

here it is again

Originally Posted by Skandelon View Post

A. Christ has SELF-EXISTENT life.

John 1:4 "In Him was life"
John 14:6 "I am the Life"
Acts 3:15 "the Prince (Author) of life"

B. Christ is ETERNAL.

Isaiah 9:6 "the everlasting Father" (or "the Father of eternity")
Micah 5:2 "whose goings forth have been of old, from everlasting"
Compare John 8:35; John 8:58; 1 John 1:2; 1 John 5:11.

C. Christ is UNCHANGEABLE.

Hebrews 1:10-12 "but thou art the same"
Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, and today and forever"

D. Christ is OMNIPRESENT.

See Matthew 28:20

E. Christ is OMNISCIENT.

See John 2:24-25 (compare Jeremiah 17:9-10);
John 6:64; 16:30; Colossians 2:3.
Examples:
Matthew 17:24-27
Luke 5:22
John 1:48
John 4:16-19
John 21:6

F. Christ is OMNIPOTENT.

See John 5:19
Philippians 3:20-21
Revelation 1:8 with Revelation 22:12-13 for identification.
Examples: Luke 4:39; Matthew 8:26-27; Mark 5:12-13; Luke 7:14-15; John 2:19-22

G. Christ is PERFECT.

(the term "perfect" as used in Scripture generally means "complete, nothing lacking")
See Colossians 1:19
Colossians 2:9-10

H. Christ is INFINITE.

See John 10:28
Ephesians 3:8
Colossians 2:3

I. Christ is INCOMPREHENSIBLE.

See Matthew 11:27
Ephesians 3:8
Ephesians 3:19

J. Christ is HOLY.

See Luke 1:35
Acts 3:14

K. Christ is TRUE.

See John 14:6
Revelation 3:7

L. Christ is LOVE.

See John 13:1
Romans 8:35-39
Ephesians 3:19
1 John 3:16 ASV

M. Christ is RIGHTEOUS.

See 2 Timothy 4:8
1 John 2:1

N. Christ is FAITHFUL.

See Revelation 3:14
Revelation 19:11

O. Christ is MERCIFUL.

See Jude 21
James 5:11 with 5:8 for identification

CONCLUSION – ATTRIBUTES

John 16:15 – "All things that the Father hath are mine" (every attribute that belongs to the Father belongs to Christ)

John 17:6 – Jesus prayed, "I have manifested Thy Name" (the "Name" of God as used in Scripture refers to God's character, that is, all that God is. Hence Jesus is saying, "I have shown what kind of a God You are. I have put Your Character on display.")

The Bible clearly teaches that in Christ all the fullness of Deity dwells in bodily form (see COLOSSIANS 2:9). LINK HERE>>>

 

[annsni]

You have totaly failed to refute the true fact that according to the Gospels; Jesus of Nazaret did not have any divine atribute at all. That is also according to the kenosis doctrine teached by Paul.

Not only that. My teaching are not contradicting:
1 any baptist statement of faith
2 any evangelic statement of faith
3 any teaching of the reformers
4 any creed of the christian church
5 any teaching of the fathers
6 any verse or text in the Bible and/or NT

You are unbelievable. You absolutely contradict Biblical teaching and completely ignore clear Scripture. I'm sorry but I am beginning to wonder more about you. You have clearly proven that you do not follow the Biblical Baptist belief. Why do you state you are Baptist? I've asked - does your pastor know about your beliefs?

 

[Goinheix]

Goinheix let me ask you this. You state that you believe that Jesus walked by faith. I am neither confirming nor denying that belief. However since you feel that Jesus did not know He was the Messiah but came to faith in that at what point do you think He figured it out?

i am not 100% sure. He "knew" it by faith before commencing hism ministery, before his baptism. How long before? I am not sure. He did birth without that knowledge or conviction. As a just born bay he was totaly unable to even understand what the Christ is. As he grew up and learned to speak, probably he commenced to hear the stories told by his parent. He intelect slowly grew and became aware of the fact he was Jew; learned abou a Christ, and eventually he realizes by faith that he was the Christ.

I hope you dont tell me that Jesus baby, the same day of his birth were omniscient and knew everything at all, including him being God, being the Christ, understanding all spoken lenguages in the planet, and the position of every star in the universe.

 

[Goinheix]

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=73249&page=11

Here we go.
God the Son is God and have all divine attributes. That has never been questioned. God the Son did emty himself of all divine attributes he has, for entering the World as Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus of Nazareth did not have any divine attributes.
Now lets check out what divine attribute you have found in Jesus of Nazareth; not in God the Son but in Jesus of Nazareth who is the incarnation (without divine attributes) of God the Son.

A. Christ has SELF-EXISTENT life.

John 1:4 "In Him was life" IT IS REFERING TO THE VERB, TO THE WORD, TO GOD THE SON; NOT AT ALL TO JESUS OF NAZARETH

John 14:6 "I am the Life" THIS IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE. TO BE LIFE IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE IN ANY LISTING. AND IT IS NOT SAYING A WORD ABOUT SELF-EXISTENCE.

Acts 3:15 "the Prince (Author) of life" TO BE AUTHOR OF THE LIFE IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE, IS NOT PROVING SELF-EXISTENCE, AND IS TALKING ABOUT GOD THE SON.

B. Christ is ETERNAL.

Isaiah 9:6 "the everlasting Father" (or "the Father of eternity")
Micah 5:2 "whose goings forth have been of old, from everlasting"
Compare John 8:35; John 8:58; 1 John 1:2; 1 John 5:11.

IT IS TALKING OF GOD THE SON. WE KNOW THAT JESUS DID BIRTH.

C. Christ is UNCHANGEABLE.

Hebrews 1:10-12 "but thou art the same" IDS REFERING TO GOD THE SON NOT TO JESUS OF NAZARETH

Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, and today and forever" 13:9 IT IS TALKING ABOUT DOCTRINE. DOES NOT MATTER HOW MANY CENTURIES HAVE PASS AND HOW MANY DOCTRINES HAVE BEEN PROPOSED, JESUS CHRIST IS THE SAME

JESUS DID GREW UP AND CHANGED. HE CHANGED SO MUCH THAT NOBODY COULD RECOGNICE HIM AFTER RESURRECTION

D. Christ is OMNIPRESENT.

See Matthew 28:20 THAT IS CLEARLY AFTER THE ASCENSION. JESUS IS TALKING OF THE SITUTION AFTER HIS ASCENCION.
JESUS WAS ALWAYS IN A SPECIFIC PLACE AND NOT IN OTHER. HE HAS TO TRAVEL. HE WAS NOT OMNIPRESENT.

E. Christ is OMNISCIENT.

See John 2:24-25 (compare Jeremiah 17:9-10);
John 6:64; 16:30; Colossians 2:3.
Examples:
Matthew 17:24-27
Luke 5:22
John 1:48
John 4:16-19
John 21:6
JEUS DID NOT KNOW TO MANY THINGS AND THAT IS A CLEAR SIGN OF NON OMNISCIENCE. IT DOES NOT MATTER HOW MANY THING HE KNEW, HE DIDN’T KNEW THEM ALL. HE WAS NOT OMNISCIENT.

F. Christ is OMNIPOTENT.

See John 5:19 THIS VERSE IS SAYING THAT JESUS CAN DO NOTHING BUT… BEING UNABLE TO DO NOTHING BUT…IS NOT OMNIPOTENCE BAT TOTAL LACK OF POTENCY.

Philippians 3:20-21 GOD THE SON HAVE A LOT OF POWER. THIS IS GODS THE SON IN THE FUTURE, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH IN EARTH.

Revelation 1:8 with Revelation 22:12-13 for identification. GOD THE SON, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH

Examples: Luke 4:39; Matthew 8:26-27; Mark 5:12-13; Luke 7:14-15; John 2:19-22

G. Christ is PERFECT.

(the term "perfect" as used in Scripture generally means "complete, nothing lacking")
See Colossians 1:19 IS ABOUT GOD THE SON, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH

Colossians 2:9-10 SAME

H. Christ is INFINITE.

See John 10:28 IT WAS NEVER QUESTIONED THAT WE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE BY JESUS IN THE CROSS. IT IS SAYING NOTHIG OF JESUS OF NAZARET BEING INFINITE

Ephesians 3:8 INFINITE????

Colossians 2:3 GOD THE SON NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH



I can continue with all the listing; but I am realizing that there is not a point on doing it. You are inteligent and could found the same answers I am giving. You didnt not becaose lack of knowledge or light, but because you simply dont want to.

In all the Gospels, in all the NT, in all the Bible there is not a single insinuation of Jesus having not even one single divine atribute. Offcourse he have it before incarnation and after ascencion. Those divine atributes he has before and after and those atributes from wich he emtied out, and the atributes he did not have during his existence inn Earth as Jesus of Nazareth.

I belive that this one is a definetive answer destroying any atempt to support the false doctrine of Jesus with divine atributes. We are done. End.

??????????????????

 

[jbh28]

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=73249&page=11

Here we go.
God the Son is God and have all divine attributes. That has never been questioned. God the Son did emty himself of all divine attributes he has, for entering the World as Jesus of Nazareth. Jesus of Nazareth did not have any divine attributes.
Now lets check out what divine attribute you have found in Jesus of Nazareth; not in God the Son but in Jesus of Nazareth who is the incarnation (without divine attributes) of God the Son.

A. Christ has SELF-EXISTENT life.

John 1:4 "In Him was life" IT IS REFERING TO THE VERB, TO THE WORD, TO GOD THE SON; NOT AT ALL TO JESUS OF NAZARETH

John 14:6 "I am the Life" THIS IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE. TO BE LIFE IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE IN ANY LISTING. AND IT IS NOT SAYING A WORD ABOUT SELF-EXISTENCE.

Acts 3:15 "the Prince (Author) of life" TO BE AUTHOR OF THE LIFE IS NOT A DIVINE ATRIBUTE, IS NOT PROVING SELF-EXISTENCE, AND IS TALKING ABOUT GOD THE SON.

B. Christ is ETERNAL.

Isaiah 9:6 "the everlasting Father" (or "the Father of eternity")
Micah 5:2 "whose goings forth have been of old, from everlasting"
Compare John 8:35; John 8:58; 1 John 1:2; 1 John 5:11.

IT IS TALKING OF GOD THE SON. WE KNOW THAT JESUS DID BIRTH.

C. Christ is UNCHANGEABLE.

Hebrews 1:10-12 "but thou art the same" IDS REFERING TO GOD THE SON NOT TO JESUS OF NAZARETH

Hebrews 13:8 "Jesus Christ, the same yesterday, and today and forever" 13:9 IT IS TALKING ABOUT DOCTRINE. DOES NOT MATTER HOW MANY CENTURIES HAVE PASS AND HOW MANY DOCTRINES HAVE BEEN PROPOSED, JESUS CHRIST IS THE SAME

JESUS DID GREW UP AND CHANGED. HE CHANGED SO MUCH THAT NOBODY COULD RECOGNICE HIM AFTER RESURRECTION

D. Christ is OMNIPRESENT.

See Matthew 28:20 THAT IS CLEARLY AFTER THE ASCENSION. JESUS IS TALKING OF THE SITUTION AFTER HIS ASCENCION.
JESUS WAS ALWAYS IN A SPECIFIC PLACE AND NOT IN OTHER. HE HAS TO TRAVEL. HE WAS NOT OMNIPRESENT.

E. Christ is OMNISCIENT.

See John 2:24-25 (compare Jeremiah 17:9-10);
John 6:64; 16:30; Colossians 2:3.
Examples:
Matthew 17:24-27
Luke 5:22
John 1:48
John 4:16-19
John 21:6
JEUS DID NOT KNOW TO MANY THINGS AND THAT IS A CLEAR SIGN OF NON OMNISCIENCE. IT DOES NOT MATTER HOW MANY THING HE KNEW, HE DIDN’T KNEW THEM ALL. HE WAS NOT OMNISCIENT.

F. Christ is OMNIPOTENT.

See John 5:19 THIS VERSE IS SAYING THAT JESUS CAN DO NOTHING BUT… BEING UNABLE TO DO NOTHING BUT…IS NOT OMNIPOTENCE BAT TOTAL LACK OF POTENCY.

Philippians 3:20-21 GOD THE SON HAVE A LOT OF POWER. THIS IS GODS THE SON IN THE FUTURE, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH IN EARTH.

Revelation 1:8 with Revelation 22:12-13 for identification. GOD THE SON, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH

Examples: Luke 4:39; Matthew 8:26-27; Mark 5:12-13; Luke 7:14-15; John 2:19-22

G. Christ is PERFECT.

(the term "perfect" as used in Scripture generally means "complete, nothing lacking")
See Colossians 1:19 IS ABOUT GOD THE SON, NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH

Colossians 2:9-10 SAME

H. Christ is INFINITE.

See John 10:28 IT WAS NEVER QUESTIONED THAT WE HAVE ETERNAL LIFE BY JESUS IN THE CROSS. IT IS SAYING NOTHIG OF JESUS OF NAZARET BEING INFINITE

Ephesians 3:8 INFINITE????

Colossians 2:3 GOD THE SON NOT JESUS OF NAZARETH



I can continue with all the listing; but I am realizing that there is not a point on doing it. You are inteligent and could found the same answers I am giving. You didnt not becaose lack of knowledge or light, but because you simply dont want to.

In all the Gospels, in all the NT, in all the Bible there is not a single insinuation of Jesus having not even one single divine atribute. Offcourse he have it before incarnation and after ascencion. Those divine atributes he has before and after and those atributes from wich he emtied out, and the atributes he did not have during his existence inn Earth as Jesus of Nazareth.

I belive that this one is a definetive answer destroying any atempt to support the false doctrine of Jesus with divine atributes. We are done. End.

Seriously, learn the quote feature I can't tell what your comments are. Jesus of Nazareth is God the Son. One in the same person. He didn't lose any attributes.

 

[Goinheix]

You are unbelievable. You absolutely contradict Biblical teaching and completely ignore clear Scripture. I'm sorry but I am beginning to wonder more about you. You have clearly proven that you do not follow the Biblical Baptist belief. Why do you state you are Baptist? I've asked - does your pastor know about your beliefs?

My pastor is a profesional who is an employee of a human organization with the name of Baptis Church. Unfortunatelly he have been educated to sing and to give nice speaches but know very litle of doctrine. I have shere with him many of my foundings and he answer with a nice smile and vague words.

Any how, not being a servant of the Lord (him), I really dont care about what is his opinion on any issue. In the baptis church were I have been baptized, where i was accepted as member. where I did assist for so many years, I found communion with my brother christians and not neceraerely we talk about christology.

 

[annsni]

My pastor is a profesional who is an employee of a human organization with the name of Baptis Church. Unfortunatelly he have been educated to sing and to give nice speaches but know very litle of doctrine. I have shere with him many of my foundings and he answer with a nice smile and vague words.

Any how, not being a servant of the Lord (him), I really dont care about what is his opinion on any issue. In the baptis church were I have been baptized, where i was accepted as member. where I did assist for so many years, I found communion with my brother christians and not neceraerely we talk about christology.

Maybe it's time to find a good church. One with a great pastor. One where the pastor knows the Bible and can teach a wayward soul.

 

[jbh28]

My pastor is a profesional who is an employee of a human organization with the name of Baptis Church. Unfortunatelly he have been educated to sing and to give nice speaches but know very litle of doctrine. I have shere with him many of my foundings and he answer with a nice smile and vague words.

At least we have you admitting it now. A good step in the right direction. You have a baptist pastor and disagree with him.... hmmm...sounds like you don't have baptist doctrine.

 

[Goinheix]

Seriously, learn the quote feature I can't tell what your comments are. Jesus of Nazareth is God the Son. One in the same person. He didn't lose any attributes.

God the Son did empty himself of all divine atributes. For the period of time that God the Son where in earth as Jesus of Nazaret he did not have any divine atributes. Before that and after that it is clear that he had all divine atributes. Quoting verses where God the Son have atributes before experimenting the kenosis dont prove that he continues to have them after the kenosis.

You have totally and absolutelly to show a single divine atribute on God the Son after kenosis. Because of the kenosis God the Son did give away all the divine atributes he had before the kenosis.

Is it that hard?
can you quote of a divine attribute of God the Son after his incarnation as Jesus of Nazaretrh?

 

[Goinheix]

Have you ever hear of Paul being short and having problems in the eyes? I have hear it and read it many time and in many places. Is it irrelevant? probably not, because it has been repeated over and over. Is it impostant to question our salvation? Not at all, but still is good to know.

My teaching do not hany impact on our salvation, or any other doctrine. It is like discussing if a christian can divorce, if a divorced man converted to christian can married. Actually is not that deep, but yet it is important.

First, we have Jesus who lived like a christian. Then we can take him as an example of what must be and more impportant of what can be our life.

Jesus did live without any superpower. He did not have any advantage over us. He did not know anything that we can know. He was not capable of anything we can not.

Jesus lived in the power of the Holy Spirit. Actually is his own spirit.

Jesus was free form the condition of sin. In difference with all other men, he was not slave of the sin. He could choose not to sin, or choose to sin, he choose not to sin. In the same manner we, now, are free for the slavery of sin.

Today, we, as christians have exactly the same conditions of Jesus to live. There is not excuse because Jesus didnt have any advantage over us.
Jesus lived by faith.
Jesus lived on pry.
Jesus lived in obedience.
Jesus lived with no supernatutal power or capacity.
Jesus lived in the power of the Holy Spirit.
Jesus didnt know the future or anything else.
Jesus - in plain talking - lived as a regular christian.

one more.
we can undeerstand if Jesus not having any divine atributes continues to be God - fully God - then we understand that God is God because He is; not for what He has. Not for what atributes He has. The atributes dont make a God. God makes the atributes. God is above the atributes and dont depend on them.

probably there is more consecuences or benefits to know how Jesus is.

 

[annsni]

God the Son did empty himself of all divine atributes. For the period of time that God the Son where in earth as Jesus of Nazaret he did not have any divine atributes. Before that and after that it is clear that he had all divine atributes. Quoting verses where God the Son have atributes before experimenting the kenosis dont prove that he continues to have them after the kenosis.

You have totally and absolutelly to show a single divine atribute on God the Son after kenosis. Because of the kenosis God the Son did give away all the divine atributes he had before the kenosis.

Is it that hard?
can you quote of a divine attribute of God the Son after his incarnation as Jesus of Nazaretrh?

John 16:30 "Now we know that you know all things and do not need anyone to question you; this is why we believe that you came from God.”

John 16:33 "But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

 

[jbh28]

God the Son did empty himself of all divine atributes. For the period of time that God the Son where in earth as Jesus of Nazaret he did not have any divine atributes. Before that and after that it is clear that he had all divine atributes. Quoting verses where God the Son have atributes before experimenting the kenosis dont prove that he continues to have them after the kenosis.

You have totally and absolutelly to show a single divine atribute on God the Son after kenosis. Because of the kenosis God the Son did give away all the divine atributes he had before the kenosis.

Is it that hard?
can you quote of a divine attribute of God the Son after his incarnation as Jesus of Nazaretrh?

Sure, I just did for the 5th time. Because you want to explain it away doesn't make them not attributes of Jesus. Jesus didn't lose any of his divine attributes. You misunderstand that term and have been proven wrong. You have no business posting here in the baptist board and I just remembered that. This is my last response to you.

 

[freeatlast]

Have you ever hear of Paul being short and having problems in the eyes? I have hear it and read it many time and in many places. Is it irrelevant? probably not, because it has been repeated over and over. Is it impostant to question our salvation? Not at all, but still is good to know.

My teaching do not hany impact on our salvation, or any other doctrine. It is like discussing if a christian can divorce, if a divorced man converted to christian can married. Actually is not that deep, but yet it is important.

First, we have Jesus who lived like a christian. Then we can take him as an example of what must be and more impportant of what can be our life.

Jesus did live without any superpower. He did not have any advantage over us. He did not know anything that we can know. He was not capable of anything we can not.

Jesus lived in the power of the Holy Spirit. Actually is his own spirit.

Jesus was free form the condition of sin. In difference with all other men, he was not slave of the sin. He could choose not to sin, or choose to sin, he choose not to sin. In the same manner we, now, are free for the slavery of sin.

Today, we, as christians have exactly the same conditions of Jesus to live. There is not excuse because Jesus didnt have any advantage over us.
Jesus lived by faith.
Jesus lived on pry.
Jesus lived in obedience.
Jesus lived with no supernatutal power or capacity.
Jesus lived in the power of the Holy Spirit.
Jesus didnt know the future or anything else.
Jesus - in plain talking - lived as a regular christian.

one more.
we can undeerstand if Jesus not having any divine atributes continues to be God - fully God - then we understand that God is God because He is; not for what He has. Not for what atributes He has. The atributes dont make a God. God makes the atributes. God is above the atributes and dont depend on them.

probably there is more consecuences or benefits to know how Jesus is.

Goinheix let me say this. I think you have a difficult row to plow because of your belief on this. While I certainly am not going to confirm your understanding as it seems too far to one side and honestly I do not even entertain the view you do, but neither can I with clear scripture refute it.

What the Lord knew, did not know, or at what point in His life He became aware of these things the scripture is silent on. Did He retain every bit of knowledge He had prior to incarnation even at birth? I don't have an absolute answer at least when looking at scripture. I do know that He stated there was at least one thing He did not know and that was the time the Father had put in His hands only.

I say all this to say this. If you feel this view you hold is accurate it might better serve you to not be so absolute with it but say this is what I believe instead of this is the way it is since there is simply no way for you to back it up in absolute terms based on scripture. Just a thought.

 

[Goinheix]

John 16:30 "Now we know that you know all things and do not need anyone to question you; this is why we believe that you came from God.”

John 16:33 "But take heart; I have overcome the world.”

Obviously that was the misinterpretation of the disciples.
Obviously it was too many things that Jesus did not know. I will not go again and again and again demostrting that Jesus was notomniscient. That have been proved enough.

 

[annsni]

Obviously that was the misinterpretation of the disciples.
Obviously it was too many things that Jesus did not know. I will not go again and again and again demostrting that Jesus was notomniscient. That have been proved enough.

ROTFL - You are dense. The Scriptures are clear. You deny them. I will pray for you.

 

[Goinheix]

ROTFL - You are dense. The Scriptures are clear. You deny them. I will pray for you.

Jesus - for example - did not know what it was giving to him at the cross. that is want thing that Jesus didnt know. That is a prove that Jesus didnt know everything.

do not insult me.
you are reported

 

[annsni]

Jesus - for example - did not know what it was giving to him at the cross. that is want thing that Jesus didnt know. That is a prove that Jesus didnt know everything.

do not insult me.
you are reported

You are like a child whining to mom. It's getting really old.

Again, I am praying that you will find the truth. You may be a believer but you have come upon some very wrong teaching which worry me. If it is from yourself, I worry for your soul. If it is from someone else, I worry for your life.

 

[Goinheix]

You are like a child whining to mom. It's getting really old.

Again, I am praying that you will find the truth. You may be a believer but you have come upon some very wrong teaching which worry me. If it is from yourself, I worry for your soul. If it is from someone else, I worry for your life.

Ok
did you run out of argument deffending the false doctrine of the omniscience of Jesus?

 

[DHK]

Jesus - for example - did not know what it was giving to him at the cross. that is want thing that Jesus didnt know. That is a prove that Jesus didnt know everything.

do not insult me.
you are reported

Jesus knew exactly what was given to him. Why do you assert things that are false.
1. He was given vinegar the first time. If I were given vinegar I would know it before it 10 feet away before it reached me. I would be able to smell it. It has such a strong acrid smell, it cannot be mistaken. Of course he knew what was being given to him at that time. You are insulting his intelligence.

2. The second time he was offered something to drink he refused because he knew what it was. It contained a narcotic, something to dumb the senses. He refused because he wanted to take the entire burden of sin upon himself--to feel the pain of it all--as the Scripture says: "to endure the cross," not just a part of it. So he refused it, knowing full well what it would do to him. You deny the Scriptures and in doing so insult the intelligence of Jesus. You ought to be ashamed of yourself.

I need to report you for false reporting of Jesus.