did the new Covenant Start in Gospels or Acts?

[Iconoclast]

There is a preparation for the new covenant....the accomplishing of the terms of the covenant...then the fulfillment of it....

The LAST PASSOVER....is THE FIRST LORDS SUPPER....

26And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body.

27And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it;

28For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins.
29But I say unto you, I will not drink henceforth of this fruit of the vine, until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father's kingdom.

 

[Mark_13]

Whatdoyouknow, the New Covenant began after Christ's death & the application of His blood in the true holy of holies. :smilewinkgrin:

For some reason I didn't see that you said it didn't begin until Christ was in the true holy of holies. So therefore my post #20 was pointless - sorry.

 

[freeatlast]

I'm surprised no one has quoted Hebrews. Hebrews is the definitive book on all things New Covenant.


And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. For where a testament is, there must also of necessity be the death of the testator. For a testament is of force after men are dead: otherwise it is of no strength at all while the testator liveth. Whereupon neither the first testament was dedicated without blood. (Heb 9:15-18)

And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us: (Heb 9:22-24)


Whatdoyouknow, the New Covenant began after Christ's death & the application of His blood in the true holy of holies. :smilewinkgrin:

michael- but when did He enter heaven, the Holy of Holies, and sprinkle the blood on the mercy seat? I am not so sure that the Hebrews passage is giving a time line pointing to death as much as I am thinking it is just describing that there must be death.
So I still ask when was the blood sprinkled on the mercy seat because I am not sure the church could start until that took place.

 

[AresMan]

I would say that the earthly ministry of Christ was a "transition" period between the Old and New Covenants. Christ taught both covenants. He still enforced the Old, but in light of the coming New.

The New Covenant was ratified in His death and resurrection.
It was inaugurated at Pentecost with the outpouring of the Spirit.

 

[freeatlast]

I would say that the earthly ministry of Christ was a "transition" period between the Old and New Covenants. Christ taught both covenants. He still enforced the Old, but in light of the coming New.

The New Covenant was ratified in His death and resurrection.
It was inaugurated at Pentecost with the outpouring of the Spirit.

Do you feel that this inauguration is the literal/official beginning of the church or do you think it happened eariler?

 

[Grasshopper]

The 40 year period between the ministry and death of Jesus to the destruction of Jerusalem and the Temple was a transition period following the pattern of the 40 years wilderness experiience of the 1st Exodus.

In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away. (Hebrews 8:13 KJV)

Hebrews written just few years before the destruction of Jerusalem.

 

[michael-acts17:11]

Do you feel that this inauguration is the literal/official beginning of the church or do you think it happened eariler?

There could be no New Testament church without the New Covenant. The New Covenant could not have been in force until the day of Pentecost when the Spirit became the everlasting seal of the promise. God's covenant did not begin somewhere in a vague transitional period, nor could it have begun before the requirements, typified in the Old Law, were satisfied. The blood had to first be applied in the holy of holies. This did not occur until after Christ's ascension.


The Five Doctrinal Foundations(Requirements) of the New Testament Church:
1. the New Covenant by the death and shed blood of Christ as the sacrifice for sins
2. the resurrection of Christ as our ever living High Priest
3. the ascension of Christ into the Holiest of Holies to present the blood sacrifice to God
4. God set Christ as the Head of the church, “which is His body”
5. the sending of the Holy Spirit as the seal of the New Covenant and as the Promise of the Father

 

[freeatlast]

There could be no New Testament church without the New Covenant. The New Covenant could not have been in force until the day of Pentecost when the Spirit became the everlasting seal of the promise. God's covenant did not begin somewhere in a vague transitional period, nor could it have begun before the requirements, typified in the Old Law, were satisfied. The blood had to first be applied in the holy of holies. This did not occur until after Christ's ascension.


The Five Doctrinal Foundations(Requirements) of the New Testament Church:
1. the New Covenant by the death and shed blood of Christ as the sacrifice for sins
2. the resurrection of Christ as our ever living High Priest
3. the ascension of Christ into the Holiest of Holies to present the blood sacrifice to God
4. God set Christ as the Head of the church, “which is His body”
5. the sending of the Holy Spirit as the seal of the New Covenant and as the Promise of the Father

That is what I was after, thank you and I agree.

 

[glfredrick]

were the 4 gospels and events recorded there still under/in Old Covenant, or were they recording for us New Covenant history/events/doctrines?

The New Covenant started when it started. It was written about in the gospels, Acts, and other epistles, of whom Paul and James were first before the gospel accounds or Acts.

 

[michael-acts17:11]

Here are a few of the verses upon which my New Covenant doctrine is founded:


Hebrews 1:3 Our sins were not purged until after Christ’s death & ascension.
Hebrews 9:8-14; John 20:17 Eternal redemption came after Christ ascended & offered His own blood in the true holy of holies (holy place)
Hebrews 9:15-17 Jesus’ testament became binding only after His death.
Hebrews 10:9-12 The Old Covenant ended at His death before He established the New Covenant.
Hebrews 10:13 Salvation was not perfected/complete until after his sacrifice
Hebrews 10:20 His flesh became the veil to the true holiest of holies.
Matthew 27:51, Mark 15:38, Luke 23:45 The covenant of the law ended when the veil was rent. The tabernacle was no longer the physical representation of the person & presence of God.
Acts 20:28 When did Christ purchase the church with His own blood?
Luke 22:19-20 The “Lord’s Supper” is a demonstration of the new Covenant in His Blood; the old covenant was in the blood of animals
Hebrews 8:1-7 Jesus could not be our High Priest & Mediator until after His ascension.
Romans 8:1-4; 2 Corinthians 5:21 When did Jesus condemn sin in the flesh and fulfill the righteousness of the law? When did God condemn our sin in Christ’s flesh?
Hebrews 1:3 Our sins were not purged until after Christ’s death

 

[Tom Butler]

There is a preparation for the new covenant....the accomplishing of the terms of the covenant...then the fulfillment of it....

The LAST PASSOVER....is THE FIRST LORDS SUPPER....

I just want to throw this out for comment.

I think Jesus and the disciples observed the Passover meal first, then Jesus instituted the Lord's Supper.

Could we say that the last Passover immediately preceded the first Lord's Supper (the New Covenant in his blood)?

 

[Iconoclast]

I just want to throw this out for comment.

I think Jesus and the disciples observed the Passover meal first, then Jesus instituted the Lord's Supper.

Could we say that the last Passover immediately preceded the first Lord's Supper (the New Covenant in his blood)?

I know that this is an important issue in terms of the covenant of grace.
How much there is a continuity from OT/NT. I have to think on this for a bit.

In the Ot all ate the passover meal....in the Nt we are told that only believers should partake of the Lord's supper.

Even padeobaptists do not all practice padeo communion....all though their position is that children of believers are in the covenant.

 

[DaChaser1]

Good answer - you've almost convinced me: the New covenant began the instant that Christ physically died.

Someone above said such discussions to pinpoint the exact moment are vain, and though I understand their point, the fact remains there is one best answer to the question posed in the OP, discernable somewhere in scripture, and the mere search for that answer often leads to broader edification.

And what I mean is, in just researching this myself, I was reminded that the New Covenant actually began and was ratified by God with Abraham (Galatians 3:15-17). So in a sense the New Covenant began in the Old Testament. All it was waiting for was it to be validated by Christ's blood, and in the meantime you had the other interim covenant based on Law.

But my only remaining question is, was Christ's physical death the actual inception, or rather was it when the holy places in heaven were sprinkled with his blood. After all the Levitical covenant didn't began the instant the sacrificial animal expired - its blood still had to be sprinkled on numerous temple items for that covenant to commence.

(Heb 9:23-24) Therefore it was necessary for the copies of the things in the heavens to be cleansed with these, but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. For Christ did not enter a holy place made with hands, a copy of the true one, but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us;

So, did the New Covenant commence when Christ entered into heaven some 40 days after his resurrection. It could even be later however. Acts begins with Jesus telling everyone to wait:

(Acts 1:4-5) Gathering them together, He commanded them not to leave Jerusalem, but to wait for what the Father had promised, "Which," "you heard of from Me; for John baptized with water, but you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit not many days from now."

So with all the allusions in Hebrews of sprinkling the tabernacle with blood, its seems very possible that "baptize" above evokes that sprinkling process as well, on human hearts.

(Heb 10:22) let us draw near with a sincere heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.

So just as the earthly tabernacle had to be sprinkled with the blood of the sacrifice before the Levetical covenant commenced, maybe Christ had to appear in the temple in heaven and also the temple of men's hearts in the form of the Holy Spirit.

(And evidently, after the resurrection, before Christ appeared in heaven, he had to go preach to the spirits in prison, so just one more thing that had to be done before the New Covenant commenced. I Peter 3:18-19)

ir order to have the death of Christ thoguh to be of full avail, to be ratified as final approval by God...

Would need to have the resurrection of Christ, as that is the completion of the 'act " of salvation!
NO resurrection, Christ still in grave, no new covenant!

 

[DaChaser1]

I would say that the earthly ministry of Christ was a "transition" period between the Old and New Covenants. Christ taught both covenants. He still enforced the Old, but in light of the coming New.

The New Covenant was ratified in His death and resurrection.
It was inaugurated at Pentecost with the outpouring of the Spirit.

Ding Ding!

have the answer, IMHO!

Gospels and Acts recorded the transistion period between the Old and new Covenants, andat pentacost, the Church age of grace "officially" was started out!

larger question is does everything said and did by jesus and Apostles in Gospels/Acts still part of the new Covenant for us to practice for today?

 

[freeatlast]

Ding Ding!

have the answer, IMHO!

Gospels and Acts recorded the transistion period between the Old and new Covenants, andat pentacost, the Church age of grace "officially" was started out!

larger question is does everything said and did by jesus and Apostles in Gospels/Acts still part of the new Covenant for us to practice for today?

WHAT???? Can you translate please?

 

[DaChaser1]

WHAT???? Can you translate please?

IF we hold that the new Covenant actually started at either the resurrection of Christ, or at pentacost, werre ALL thedoctrines/practices in Gospels/Acts tio us, at that was a transsistion period between the 2 Covenants?

 

[thomas15]

If the enterprising soul were to review a Biblical covenat such as the Abrahamic, that individual would discover that first Jehovah cuts the covenant (gen ch 15 vs 1..) then he confirms it (gen 15 vs 9) then shows the sign (gen 17) However complete fufillment still to come.


The OP question is:
did the new Covenant Start in Gospels or Acts?

A better question is when was/will the new covenant be fully instituted?

Here are the terms of the New Covenant:

Jer 31:31 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah,
Jer 31:32 not like the covenant which I made with their fathers in the day I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, although I was a husband to them," declares the LORD.
Jer 31:33 "But this is the covenant which I will make with the house of Israel after those days," declares the LORD, "I will put My law within them and on their heart I will write it; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
Jer 31:34 "They will not teach again, each man his neighbor and each man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,' for they will all know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them," declares the LORD, "for I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more."
Jer 31:35 Thus says the LORD, Who gives the sun for light by day And the fixed order of the moon and the stars for light by night, Who stirs up the sea so that its waves roar; The LORD of hosts is His name:
Jer 31:36 "If this fixed order departs From before Me," declares the LORD, "Then the offspring of Israel also will cease From being a nation before Me forever."
Jer 31:37 Thus says the LORD, "If the heavens above can be measured And the foundations of the earth searched out below, Then I will also cast off all the offspring of Israel For all that they have done," declares the LORD.
Jer 31:38 "Behold, days are coming," declares the LORD, "when the city will be rebuilt for the LORD from the Tower of Hananel to the Corner Gate.
Jer 31:39 "The measuring line will go out farther straight ahead to the hill Gareb; then it will turn to Goah.
Jer 31:40 "And the whole valley of the dead bodies and of the ashes, and all the fields as far as the brook Kidron, to the corner of the Horse Gate toward the east, shall be holy to the LORD; it will not be plucked up or overthrown anymore forever."

 

[Gina B]

At the beginning of the New Covenant aka New Testament, since that's where it picks up with the fulfillment of the prophecy of the Messiah.

 

[michael-acts17:11]

At the beginning of the New Covenant aka New Testament, since that's where it picks up with the fulfillment of the prophecy of the Messiah.

Are you saying that you believe it began at the beginning of the written record we call the New Testament?

 

[convicted1]

Well, there has always been a "church", whether it was the OT Jews or NT believers. The word "church" is derived from ekklesia, which means a "called out people". So, there has always been a "called out people".


Now, this is how I see the Grace Covenant coming in. Jesus died on the cross. On the cross He stated this, [COLOR="red]Into Thy hands I commend My Spirit."[/COLOR] Now, when He died, His Spirit went back to the Father. At this time, He poured out His blood upon the Mercy seat.