Dispensationalists: Why is This Version of Israel THE One of Prophecy?

[webdog]

Where did I say any of this???

Who said you did? If you took off the selective blinders you would see who did.

 

[Greektim]

Admins need to shut this thread down.

 

[thomas15]

Admins need to shut this thread down.

This thread is very instructive, learning a lot.

 

[preachinjesus]

Wow, this whole thread has done down the tubes. We were having a civil discussion a couple of pages ago.

Accusations and harsh words never help bring unity.

Maybe its time to close this one up.

 

[webdog]

Admins need to shut this thread down.

Actually non dispy's need to not participate since the op was not for them. If this was the case from the beginning we wouldn't have been called cultists and heretics. Learn when to not participate.

 

[thomas15]

Wow, this whole thread has done down the tubes. We were having a civil discussion a couple of pages ago.

Accusations and harsh words never help bring unity.

Maybe its time to close this one up.

My friend, as a dispy I have been called many things since I have joined here about 5 years ago but only in the last few weeks have we of like mind been called all kinds of nasty things including hate-mongers wanting to end the world by those who claim be followers and trusters of Jesus. And look at how many here are at best sitting on their hands saying nothing if not adding support and or the stupid smilly faces and thumbs up icons to their responses.

And yet here we are supposed to be Baptists and yet those who act like Presbyterians and disney characters are not called out on their behavor. I don't get it, maybe you could explain it to me I'm all ears.

 

[Greektim]

Actually non dispy's need to not participate since the op was not for them. If this was the case from the beginning we wouldn't have been called cultists and heretics. Learn when to not participate.

Don't hate on me... I didn't call anyone a name. My advice... learn to participate graciously.

Administrators, shut this thread down please!

 

[thomas15]

Don't hate on me... I didn't call anyone a name. My advice... learn to participate graciously.

Administrators, shut this thread down please!

Just living large in the "realized millinnium"!

 

[HeirofSalvation]

The only hate on this thread is coming from you and your ungodly slander of christian brethren

Really??? Grow up dude...you are like Senator Grassley during the McCarthy hearings....say something vicious, and then when the Patriot McCarthy responds.....cry like a girl...Grow up dude...You've been dominated...Accept it.....


OWW!!! OWW!!! the dispy Arminians were mean to poor widdle Calvinist me!!!! WAAAHHH!!!! :tear: No one is feeling your pain.....This was a question for Dispy's....and much to your chagrin...They answered it swimmingly...:thumbsup: You may despise it when Bible-believers are capable of giving a reasoned and intelligent response to any question that you think they can't offer...but to give the "cry-baby" routine??:tear:
OHH...Walk it off man....You haven't shed a tear in years...you don't fool anyone...Don't be dis-ingenuous merely because EVERYONE is not slavishly dedicated to your philosophy...This cry-baby thing is laughable...So is Greek's insistence that the thread be "shut down" (by Mods) merely because a couple of dispy's actually bothered to answer the question semi-articulately....Poor Icon is crying...:tear: Yeah right......and I'm a Yankee...We aren't even sending in our A-team yet...Psshaaaawwwww.....Everyone who has responded so far is a mere neo-phyte except for perhaps HANK....You have yet to tangle with the best Dispy's.....You have a lot of crying left if this is all you can handle...

 

[Iconoclast]

So from whom do you believe scripture shows the church being built?

Is it not from those who God scattered among the nations of which God elects
some for his name?

Is the New Testament the fulfillment of what God said he was going to do in the Old Testament beginning with his Son Jesus the Christ? Then electing by his Spirit a people for his name, a ruling body and the returning and establishing the kingdom of God upon the earth, binding the deceiver, that the residue of men might seek God?

The essence of Covenant salvation is:

16 And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.

This is true in all 66 books of the bible. Before Israel was a nation, before the Nt church was formed....

Is the New Testament the fulfillment of what God said he was going to do in the Old Testament beginning with his Son Jesus the Christ?

Yes....Ot Israel was only a shadow...of Christian Israel......
because.....
Jesus is the TRUE ISRAEL......and us IN HIM.

49 Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The Lord hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.

2 And he hath made my mouth like a sharp sword; in the shadow of his hand hath he hid me, and made me a polished shaft; in his quiver hath he hid me;

3 And said unto me, Thou art my servant, O Israel, in whom I will be glorified.

4 Then I said, I have laboured in vain, I have spent my strength for nought, and in vain: yet surely my judgment is with the Lord, and my work with my God.

5 And now, saith the Lord that formed me from the womb to be his servant, to bring Jacob again to him, Though Israel be not gathered, yet shall I be glorious in the eyes of the Lord, and my God shall be my strength.

6 And he said, It is a light thing that thou shouldest be my servant to raise up the tribes of Jacob, and to restore the preserved of Israel: I will also give thee for a light to the Gentiles, that thou mayest be my salvation unto the end of the earth.
7 Thus saith the Lord, the Redeemer of Israel, and his Holy One, to him whom man despiseth, to him whom the nation abhorreth, to a servant of rulers, Kings shall see and arise, princes also shall worship, because of the Lord that is faithful, and the Holy One of Israel, and he shall choose thee.

8 Thus saith the Lord, In an acceptable time have I heard thee, and in a day of salvation have I helped thee: and I will preserve thee, and give thee for a covenant of the people, to establish the earth, to cause to inherit the desolate heritages;

9 That thou mayest say to the prisoners, Go forth; to them that are in darkness, Shew yourselves. They shall feed in the ways, and their pastures shall be in all high places.

10 They shall not hunger nor thirst; neither shall the heat nor sun smite them: for he that hath mercy on them shall lead them, even by the springs of water shall he guide them.

11 And I will make all my mountains a way, and my highways shall be exalted.

12 Behold, these shall come from far: and, lo, these from the north and from the west; and these from the land of Sinim.

13 Sing, O heavens; and be joyful, O earth; and break forth into singing, O mountains: for the Lord hath comforted his people, and will have mercy upon his afflicted.

14 But Zion said, The Lord hath forsaken me, and my Lord hath forgotten me.

15 Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.

16 Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.

 

[HeirofSalvation]

This thread is very instructive, learning a lot.

That is precisely why the dissent wishes to "shut it down"...they have no intention of allowing the alternative position to speak...

 

[Iconoclast]

Really??? Grow up dude...you are like Senator Grassley during the McCarthy hearings....say something vicious, and then when the Patriot McCarthy responds.....cry like a girl...Grow up dude...You've been dominated...Accept it.....


OWW!!! OWW!!! the dispy Arminians were mean to poor widdle Calvinist me!!!! WAAAHHH!!!! :tear: No one is feeling your pain.....This was a question for Dispy's....and much to your chagrin...They answered it swimmingly...:thumbsup: You may despise it when Bible-believers are capable of giving a reasoned and intelligent response to any question that you think they can't offer...but to give the "cry-baby" routine??:tear:
OHH...Walk it off man....You haven't shed a tear in years...you don't fool anyone...Don't be dis-ingenuous merely because EVERYONE is not slavishly dedicated to your philosophy...This cry-baby thing is laughable...So is Greek's insistence that the thread be "shut down" (by Mods) merely because a couple of dispy's actually bothered to answer the question semi-articulately....Poor Icon is crying...:tear: Yeah right......and I'm a Yankee...We aren't even sending in our A-team yet...Psshaaaawwwww.....Everyone who has responded so far is a mere neo-phyte except for perhaps HANK....You have yet to tangle with the best Dispy's.....You have a lot of crying left if this is all you can handle...

Are you BI -polar ???

 

[webdog]

Don't hate on me... I didn't call anyone a name. My advice... learn to participate graciously.

Administrators, shut this thread down please!

No need for it to be shut down or in trying to censor us dispy's. Tell your comrades who are insulting and prosyletizing to stay out while dispy's answer the op and all is well

 

[thomas15]

Are you BI -polar ???

You confirm HOS point in three words better than he does in two paragraphs.

While I wouldn't be as point blank in-your-face as HOS, I'm never the less struggling hard to find points where I disagree with him with respect to the personal behavor and motives I see here as of late.

However my friend, if you could explain to me what you think accusing HOS of being bi-polar is supposed to accomplish within the context of Christian behavor I will issue my sincere and public appology to you promptly.

 

[Iconoclast]

You confirm HOS point in three words better than he does in two paragraphs.

While I wouldn't be as point blank in-your-face as HOS, I'm never the less struggling hard to find points where I disagree with him with respect to the personal behavor and motives I see here as of late.

However my friend, if you could explain to me what you think accusing HOS of being bi-polar is supposed to accomplish within the context of Christian behavor I will issue my sincere and public appology to you promptly.

Within a 24 hour period....he asked me about covenant theology, and if I could recommend any book or books on it.....

Now less than 24 hours later he is going off on a rant about everyone who believes in the theology.....people on here, people on puritanboard, Dr. White, the reformers......

Do you see that as stable Thomas??? I want to know if he struggles with being bi-polar...so i can understand such radical swings....and attacks against solid bible believers.

 

[thomas15]

Within a 24 hour period....he asked me about covenant theology, and if I could recommend any book or books on it.....

Now less than 24 hours later he is going off on a rant about everyone who believes in the theology.....people on here, people on puritanboard, Dr. White, the reformers......

Do you see that as stable Thomas??? I want to know if he struggles with being bi-polar...so i can understand such radical swings....and attacks against solid bible believers.

I'm personally unable to make such a medical diagnosis especally over the internet although it's good for humanity that you can offer that service. I'm surprised though as a medical expert you are not aware of HIPPA laws.

Since you asked: if I may offer an opinion, my experiences with the pb as a reader (they don't let my kind join, their right though) and reading the posts where they pile up on us dispies with rabid misinformation and the observation that anyone who ventures there can see for themselves that many, not all but many are egotistical and obnoxioius. And while I find much to agree with Dr. White, having read almost everything on AZ website and several of his books HOS has a valid point about him. But I personally don't defend anyones theology except my own, I just offer observations.

But one thing that bothers me about the reformers. First off, may I say I consider myself more inclined towards Calvinism than Arminism but not a full blown 5 pointer for sure. And this does go off topic, but one thing that i find disturbing about the Synod of Dort, where Calvinism was confirmed and Arminism condemed. This assembly was stacked by Calvinist and had no possible chance of going the other way and this is supposed to be the "proof" that Calvinism is correct? Excuse me? The proof is what the Bible teaches, not what some assembly of men think.

 

[Iconoclast]

I'm personally unable to make such a medical diagnosis especally over the internet although it's good for humanity that you can offer that service. I'm surprised though as a medical expert you are not aware of HIPPA laws

I did not do that. I asked him a direct question.

Since you asked: if I may offer an opinion, my experiences with the pb as a reader (they don't let my kind join, their right though) and reading the posts where they pile up on us dispies with rabid misinformation and the observation that anyone who ventures there can see for themselves that many, not all but many are egotistical and obnoxioius.

There are many solid brothers on PB.
To make wild and slanderous accusations of anti-semitism is non christian, and sin.
Non confessional persons are welcome to read, but not to post.They seek to maintain a godly web-site. Vile posts and attacks are not allowed. Open theism is not allowed. No one is forced to go on there.

 

[thomas15]

I did not do that. I asked him a direct question.

Keep digging brother, sooner or later you will strike gold (or China).

There are many solid brothers on PB.
To make wild and slanderous accusations of anti-semitism is non christian, and sin.
Non confessional persons are welcome to read, but not to post.They seek to maintain a godly web-site. Vile posts and attacks are not allowed. Open theism is not allowed. No one is forced to go on there.

You are right that no one is forced to go there and it is there right to limit who they allow to join. However, my observation is there are those who pretend to know certain things and state them as facts, things that are not correct or factual. If that is godly then we have a different opinion on what is godly.

 

[Iconoclast]

Keep digging brother, sooner or later you will strike gold (or China).




You are right that no one is forced to go there and it is there right to limit who they allow to join. However, my observation is there are those who pretend to know certain things and state them as facts, things that are not correct or factual. If that is godly then we have a different opinion on what is godly.

We do have some difference of opinion. Can you honestly say that the level of posts offered there are not more scripturally based in nature??
I am not asking if you agree with the positions....but are you saying you do not see a difference?

 

[thomas15]

We do have some difference of opinion. Can you honestly say that the level of posts offered there are not more scripturally based in nature??
I am not asking if you agree with the positions....but are you saying you do not see a difference?

Again, my observation. I'm inclined to believe that there are many here and on that other board who think that by simply reciting Scripture they are being Biblical. Anyone can find verses to butress practically any arguement or position. The catholics recite scripture to justify their doctrine and so do the cults which some here think I'm a member of one. No, we are to correctly handle the word of truth. We are to compare Scripture with Scripture. We are to test all things against Scripture. When we find something in our system that doesn't meet the test we change our system. This is using the word as the teaching tool it was intended to be.

The words of the Bible are simple enough for even a half-wit like me to understand. To insist that Israel is the Church and Babylon is Jerusalem is not supported by the clear teaching of the Bible. Can anyone offer a rational explanation as to why Jehovah would call the Church Israel and Jerusalem Babylon? Why not just call Israel Isreal, Jerusalem Jerusalem, Babylon Babylon and the Church the Church? When you do that, the Bible makes sense.