Do we care more about winning the Duck Dynasty cultural battle...

[Zaac]

For a complete understanding of my post here---please refer up a couple of posts

What Phil said in the quote?? No different type language that can be found in a college level Human Anatomy class while studying human reproduction----you take a HA class on the college level---and the professor will be using the same type language in describing those parts-----what did you want Phil to use?? Gutter language?? Language heard in a 9th grade locker room??

blackbird:saint::saint:

Would you use that sort of language in church? The language WAS crude and it highlights the church's vehemence about that issue.

 

[blackbird]

It is a strawman in other words a flat out lie that if we are paying attention to the issue with Phil Robertson then we are not working to win the lost. It is also a lie that if we do we cannot win the lost. It is not an either or scenario. Let's deal in reality and truth rather than strawman lies.

Phil Robertson and his show is produced for entertainment and is not intended to be shown by A & E as an evangelistic push with the gospel. Pure entertainment---nothing to do with winning souls!:BangHead::type:

 

[blackbird]

Would you use that sort of language in church? The language WAS crude and it highlights the church's vehemence about that issue.

To be truthful---no---I would not use that language in church---and probably neither would Phil-----BUT----I WOULD use it in a college classroom setting for use in human anatomy:type: And if you enrolled in college and took HA & P you WOULD hear that sort of language coming from the lips of the professor

 

[Revmitchell]

Phil Robertson and his show is produced for entertainment and is not intended to be shown by A & E as an evangelistic push with the gospel. Pure entertainment---nothing to do with winning souls!:BangHead::type:

That is not A&E's intent but I have met them and I can tell you it is their intent.

 

[blackbird]

That is not A&E's intent but I have met them and I can tell you it is their intent.

It probably IS their intent----but to follow along the lines of the A & E script---nobody's gonna see many souls saved as a direct result of watching the show

 

[evenifigoalone]

That is not A&E's intent but I have met them and I can tell you it is their intent.

I'd hope so. They of course don't need a TV show to do it (and I assume the show itself is built on entertainment), but having Christians in all sorts of positions, including that of a popular TV show, is a good thing. I can only imagine the opportunities it must help to create outside of the show or filming.


As to baptismal generation (since it was brought up), I don't like that, but assuming they even believe it they have as much as right to that belief as I have a right to OSAS or any other salvational doctrine. I'm not going to attempt to silence it just because I disagree with it.


So on some things I see where the OP is coming from and some I don't.

 

[righteousdude2]

Why would I get thin skinned about anything that God says is sinful? I think yall just make the type of comment you just made in order to justify the way the church goes off the deep end about its pet sins while ignoring other sins we believe to be less important.

You just don't get it, do you Zaac? If someone speaks up about homosexuality, and not other sins, you become OFFENDED and as Yeshua said, "Skinned!"

You have an ugly attitude when it comes to the members on this board. You lack the fruits of the spirit when responding to others. I guess it could be said....when it comes to this board, "YOU DON'T PLAY WELL WITH OTHERS!"


As I suggested, and it seemed to "skin" you real good, you would be best served by leaving this board, one way or another! If we are causing you to stumble, and it sure seems that the majority of us CONTINUE to "skin" you and cause you to stumble, why do you stick around?

Unless you enjoy playing the better-than-thou role and sticking it to all of us, as much as you can?

I still think the moderators should prayerfully consider helping you along the way, and end your membership, in order to keep the lowbrow level of theology and doctrine spouted by the majority of us from causing you to sin.

Every time you get on your soap box and preach down to all of us, it is a clear sign that we have caused you to stumble, duly noted in the angry tone used in your approach to teaching us back wood hicks that we "Just don't get it!"

It is really you who don't get it....and you never will! You ain't a goin' to change us, so why continue with us? Do you think you will wear a more decorated crown in heaven for setting those Baptist boys and girls straight when it comes to homosexuals?

I have a suspicion that you will be mildly disappointed in heaven, as those who judge others will, in fact, be judged even more.

And because you think, my prayers are not sincere, I am not going to end this by telling you that I am praying for you! I think, that you think, that you have a corner on everything godly, so it is alright with me if you want to burn bridges and go it alone! I hope this didn't "skin" you too badly?

 

[Zaac]

To be truthful---no---I would not use that language in church---and probably neither would Phil-----BUT----I WOULD use it in a college classroom setting for use in human anatomy:type: And if you enrolled in college and took HA & P you WOULD hear that sort of language coming from the lips of the professor

That's a bit odd and speaks to a double-mindedness. Why would the people of God not use the same language all the time? If it's inappropriate for one venue, it's inappropriate period.

And I must say that what is done in college classes is DEFINITELY not the measure of appropriate language for the people of God.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Would you use that sort of language in church? The language WAS crude and it highlights the church's vehemence about that issue.

The two words he used were clinical words you hear in a doctor's office. He didn't use bathroom-vulgarity, nasty little teenage boy words, or words associated with pornography.

The v-word? Why should that offend you? That's it's name. Society has all sorts of nasty words for that part of a woman's body. Words intended to embarrass, shame, and ridicule. He used the benign and clinical name. The same thing for the a-word he used. It's the official name for that part of the human body. Those two words are used with middle schoolers in science class.

Maybe those two words don't trip off the tongue in daily conversation, but that doesn't make them crude or inappropriate.

Vehemence? Really?!? He says men should prefer the vagina of a woman and not the anus of a man and that's showing Christian vehemence for homosexuality? :BangHead:

That's a stretch even for you. He was explaining the unnaturalness that the Bible speaks of when it comes to homosexuality to an unsaved interviewer for a secular magazine.

....and he wasn't speaking in church. He was speaking to an adult for the men's magazine, GQ.

 

[Zaac]

You just don't get it, do you Zaac? If someone speaks up about homosexuality, and not other sins, you become OFFENDED and as Yeshua said, "Skinned!"

Oh I get it rd. The folks on here just like the majority of folks in the SBC have adopted homosexuality and abortion as their pet sins. Never mind that our sons and daughters still sit in the same churches and fornicate and commit adultery and go undisciplined because they are our family . Nevermind that the majority of us are running around grossly overweight from greed and overindulgence. Nevermind that the majority show no honor and respect for the authority placed over us by God.

The world gets it that a bunch of folks who think that homosexuality and abortion are the worst of all sins while refusing to address their equally vile sin as vehemently. That's why the church is viewed as a bunch of unloving hypocrites. We have love for us and our own sins but can't ever seem to extend the same measure of love for those "not in the family".

Love thy neighbor as thyself.

You have an ugly attitude when it comes to the members on this board. You lack the fruits of the spirit when responding to others. I guess it could be said....when it comes to this board, "YOU DON'T PLAY WELL WITH OTHERS!"

And the members of this board have an ugly attitude when it comes to anybody and anything that isn't conservative Republican. So save your pious cancor for someone who is actually bothered by what you think I lack. I don't do foolishness and there is a lot of it spouted on here that folks seem to think is being done in the name of Jesus. But it's obvious, just like it is with so many churches in the SBC that we make the noise of a lot of clanging cymbals but often seem to be absent love.

As I suggested, and it seemed to "skin" you real good, you would be best served by leaving this board, one way or another! If we are causing you to stumble, and it sure seems that the majority of us CONTINUE to "skin" you and cause you to stumble, why do you stick around?

Man please. You like so many again in the church just don't like the fact that your wickedness is called out. You want to sit up on your highhorse and point the finger at your pet sins while getting the approval of those around ya. And ya just can't handle anyone calling your own wickedness out for what it is. So you've once again fooled yourself if you think you've "skinned" me. Hilarious.:laugh:

Unless you enjoy playing the better-than-thou role and sticking it to all of us, as much as you can?

LOL. Yall got the better than thou act down pat. That's why the hypocrisy abounds with your pet sins.

I still think the moderators should prayerfully consider helping you along the way, and end your membership, in order to keep the lowbrow level of theology and doctrine spouted by the majority of us from causing you to sin.

ANd I still say that it's remarkably hypocritical to tr to censor me in one thread by raling against it for Duck Dynasty in another.

Every time you get on your soap box and preach down to all of us, it is a clear sign that we have caused you to stumble, duly noted in the angry tone used in your approach to teaching us back wood hicks that we "Just don't get it!"

You mean like every time yall show a lack of love for those who aren't like you? Deal with that. deal with the constant display of THAT coming out of here for everyone who isn't a conservative Republican.

It is really you who don't get it....and you never will! You ain't a goin' to change us, so why continue with us?

:laugh: Yes, I do realize that a lot of you view your wickedness as Godliness and have surrounded yourselves with folks who will affirm it. But like the prophets of old, my allegiance is to Christ and not the clanging cymbals who show nothing of love. I'll continue to call wickedness what it is just as was done with the Pharisees.

Do you think you will wear a more decorated crown in heaven for setting those Baptist boys and girls straight when it comes to homosexuals?

Shame that you seem to think this is a contest to be won. But that further highlights where the heart of many are. Always thinking,as witht eh DD fiasco, that this is about winning a battle of them against us.

I have a suspicion that you will be mildly disappointed in heaven, as those who judge others will, in fact, be judged even more.

You go with your suspicions. As you and the majority on this board are a constant display of the hypocritical judgment of which God warns about. So let your own words be a warning to you all. Keep hypocritically judging folks because of your pet sins.

A

nd because you think, my prayers are not sincere, I am not going to end this by telling you that I am praying for you! I think, that you think, that you have a corner on everything godly, so it is alright with me if you want to burn bridges and go it alone! I hope this didn't "skin" you too badly?

Again, save the insincere cry me a river stuff to once again try to appear to be Godly. You don't spit in someone's face and then think they are gonna believe this "I'll pray for you" bit. :laugh:

 

[Zaac]

The two words he used were clinical words you hear in a doctor's office. He didn't use bathroom-vulgarity, nasty little teenage boy words, or words associated with pornography.

Now you need to stop. You're quick to point out when you think something I say is inappropriate. But he was being clinical. Please. He was being vulgar and he knows it. Yall continue to display an unbelievable hypocrisy.

The v-word? Why should that offend you?

:laugh: Who said I was offended? You're assuming too much.

That's it's name. Society has all sorts of nasty words for that part of a woman's body. Words intended to embarrass, shame, and ridicule. He used the benign and clinical name. The same thing for the a-word he used. It's the official name for that part of the human body. Those two words are used with middle schoolers in science class.

Maybe those two words don't trip off the tongue in daily conversation, but that doesn't make them crude or inappropriate.

A bunch of crock.

Vehemence? Really?!? He says men should prefer the vagina of a woman and not the anus of a man and that's showing Christian vehemence for homosexuality? :BangHead:

SMH. You're slick but you're not THAT slick. If what you wrote was what I said, you would have read THAT. Those are YOUR words not mine.

That's a stretch even for you. He was explaining the unnaturalness that the Bible speaks of when it comes to homosexuality to an unsaved interviewer for a secular magazine.

And why are you now attempting to explain to me about something I didn't say?

....and he wasn't speaking in church. He was speaking to an adult for the men's magazine, GQ.

Yes because we all know that we should be more or less "CHRISTIAN" based upon who we are talking to.

FOOLISHNESS.

 

[blackbird]

That's a bit odd and speaks to a double-mindedness. Why would the people of God not use the same language all the time? If it's inappropriate for one venue, it's inappropriate period.

And I must say that what is done in college classes is DEFINITELY not the measure of appropriate language for the people of God.

I see you have never sat in a Human Anatomy lecture period or an Anatomy lab in the college setting!!:type::wavey::wavey: What are you accustomed to hearing in the college classroom?? Anatomy on the 9th grade boys locker room level????

 

[webdog]

The words he used were only vulgar to the community that had their vile acts exposed. They hate homosexual or anything that flips the rock over to expose the sunlight. They like cute little words and initials and pretty rainbow flags. I'm glad Robertson had such a platform to say just how illogical and vile homosexuality is. Nothing vulgar whatsoever. Martin Bashir saying someone should defacate on Sarah Palin is what's vulgar...and absolutely not a peep from the homosexual community. Hypocrites.

 

[Zaac]

I see you have never sat in a Human Anatomy lecture period or an Anatomy lab in the college setting!!:type::wavey::wavey:

You may want to get your eyes checked. :laugh: A Human Anatomy lecture has nothing to do with how God's people are to speak.

What are you accustomed to hearing in the college classroom?? Anatomy on the 9th grade boys locker room level????

I'm accustomed to hearing the world act like the world and the people of God acting like the people of God.

But it seems that more and more, to be relevant, there ain't much difference between how the "people of God" act and how the lost world acts.

Might explain the ineffectiveness to witness Christ by so many.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I see you have never sat in a Human Anatomy lecture period or an Anatomy lab in the college setting!!:type::wavey::wavey: What are you accustomed to hearing in the college classroom?? Anatomy on the 9th grade boys locker room level????

This doesn't even have to be in college. I've used the words vagina and anus in 7th grade life science classes.

What was he supposed to have said in explaining to a lost man what the Bible means as unnatural affections? A man should desire a woman's "hooha" and not another mans' "bumbum"? That's stupid.

He couldn't use pornographic or dirty words. That would be inappropriate.

The words he used were only vulgar to the community that had their vile acts exposed. They hate homosexual or anything that flips the rock over to expose the sunlight. They like cute little words and initials and pretty rainbow flags. I'm glad Robertson had such a platform to say just how illogical and vile homosexuality is. Nothing vulgar whatsoever. Martin Bashir saying someone should defacate on Sarah Palin is what's vulgar...and absolutely not a peep from the homosexual community. Hypocrites.

Nail...head...you hit it square on!!!! :thumbs:

A Human Anatomy lecture has nothing to do with how God's people are to speak........I'm accustomed to hearing the world act like the world and the people of God acting like the people of God.

Why not? Why can't we use benign terms for the human body in our speech? Why couldn't Phil have used benign clinical terms to another grown adult man in a magazine for grown adult men?

But it seems that more and more, to be relevant, there ain't much difference between how the "people of God" act and how the lost world acts.

Might explain the ineffectiveness to witness Christ by so many.

Tell me one more time WHY saying the words vagina and anus make one act like the lost world? The lost world uses OTHER words for these body parts - profane, dirty, and wicked - with the INTENT of being profane, dirty, and wicked.

And tell me why using these two words contribute to the ineffective witness of Christ by "so many".

 

[Zaac]

This doesn't even have to be in college. I've used the words vagina and anus in 7th grade life science classes.

Let me know the next time you use them in church.

What was he supposed to have said in explaining to a lost man what the Bible means as unnatural affections? A man should desire a woman's "hooha" and not another mans' "bumbum"? That's stupid.

He wasn't explaining to a lost man what the Bible means.

He couldn't use pornographic or dirty words. That would be inappropriate.

No more inappropriate than what he did use.

Why not? Why can't we use benign terms for the human body in our speech? Why couldn't Phil have used benign clinical terms to another grown adult man in a magazine for grown adult men?

As I sid, next time you're talking with the church moms about these things using the same terms that Phil did, let me know.

Tell me one more time WHY saying the words vagina and anus make one act like the lost world? The lost world uses OTHER words for these body parts - profane, dirty, and wicked - with the INTENT of being profane, dirty, and wicked.

And tell me why using these two words contribute to the ineffective witness of Christ by "so many".

Tell me the next time youre speaking with your pastor and you use these words.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Let me know the next time you use them in church.



As I sid, next time you're talking with the church moms about these things using the same terms that Phil did, let me know.




Tell me the next time youre speaking with your pastor and you use these words.

I HAVE used the word vagina with my pastor AND my minister of music. I went to the church office last summer when I found out I had uterine cancer and the doctor was concerning it my have been in my vagina and the two men and I had an explicit conversation about the doctor's fears and my own. I didn't use the word but one or two times and these men, while it wasn't an easy conversation, showed NO shame and didn't treat me shamefully in using the words that I did.

I have used the word vagina with young girl's in youth groups. So have others.

You are fighting windmills that do not exist, Zaac. I feel like I am at fault in contributing to your incessant clinging to anything polar opposite of what we say here.

For that, I am sorry.

You are wrong about this, but I am going to have to let it go.

 

[Berean]

I HAVE used the word vagina with my pastor AND my minister of music. I went to the church office last summer when I found out I had uterine cancer and the doctor was concerning it my have been in my vagina and the two men and I had an explicit conversation about the doctor's fears and my own. I didn't use the word but one or two times and these men, while it wasn't an easy conversation, showed NO shame and didn't treat me shamefully in using the words that I did.

I have used the word vagina with young girl's in youth groups. So have others.

You are fighting windmills that do not exist, Zaac. I feel like I am at fault in contributing to your incessant clinging to anything polar opposite of what we say here.

For that, I am sorry.

You are wrong about this, but I am going to have to let it go.

Our bad choice of words is sometimes used in ignorance and sometimes in a manner to shock someone. This is commonly used by disc jockeys and talk show host. Only Phil R and God know the reason such coarse language was used in the GQ interview. If I were visiting someone and they were showing me pictures of their new grandchild by an unwed daughter and I remarked "Sure is a cute little b*****d, I had better be prepared to run. Although this is a term still used today mostly in legal matters I would term it highly inappropriate, coarse and certainly in bad taste.

 

[Scarlett O.]

Our bad choice of words is sometimes used in ignorance and sometimes in a manner to shock someone. This is commonly used by disc jockeys and talk show host. Only Phil R and God know the reason such coarse language was used in the GQ interview. If I were visiting someone and they were showing me pictures of their new grandchild by an unwed daughter and I remarked "Sure is a cute little b*****d, I had better be prepared to run. Although this is a term still used today mostly in legal matters I would term it highly inappropriate, coarse and certainly in bad taste.

The word b*stard is a cruel word even in it's proper context. It's MEANT to be offensive in proper context - even a legal context - it's meant to isolate people from family. You can't compare that to clinical words for body parts.

I can tell you exactly why Phil used those two words. Those were the most polite, benign, and harmless he could use. People like Phil are as common as dirt around here. These aren't just an isolated family here. Multiply him countlessly and you have my people.

That's how people talk here. We don't deem benign words for body parts as crude or coarse or vulgar. He wasn't trying to shock or offend and I can guarantee that. I can't guarantee much in this life, but I can that.

I'm just as sorry as I have ever been in my life that this has been made to be something that it isn't.

 

[Carpenter]

...than we do about leading folks to Christ?

There are some key theological issues in which the Robertsons probably disagree with the evangelicals who watch the show. For example, they attend a church that believes in baptismal regeneration, the belief that baptism is essential to receive eternal life. Yet I've heard very few Christians discuss that issue, which is directly related to the gospel.

On the other hand, we are very concerned about the issue of homosexuality, an important issue that is more about morality than about eternal life. My point is this: I think we are often more concerned with winning a cultural battle and looking good than we are about sharing the gospel in a winsome and accurate way.

Once again we flock to an ISSUE and the church once again looks like it cares more about an issue than it does about this man and his family preaching a true Gospel.

Regardless of how anyone feels about the Robertsons, Duck Dynasty or the "Cultural Battle", a door of opportunity has been opened. The question is, what are Christians doing with that door of opportunity.

It seems that there are many Christians who choose to slam that door and continue to "domestically assault" one another for not having the same opinion as they do.

Other Christians are content to just look out the door, but would never step through for fear of "offending" anyone and they will just watch the action as souls continue to perish. They are content just to keep the Word inside with them.

Then there are some Christians who will walk through this door of opportunity and use it to share the Gospel with folks who may have never been interested in hearing it before.

This whole controversy over the Duck Dynasty thing has given me the opportunity to share my faith with several co-workers and in other places simply because they asked my opinion on what is going on. People are asking questions about faith and what the Bible teaches. If the whole concern is about vindicating Phil Robertson, then we have missed the boat. The Lord has provided us an opportunity through a platform that has reached deeply into "cultural" America and a door is open.