God had whole nations killed in the OT. Whether or or not He "permitted" the Colorado incident, He has "permitted" killing before.
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Does ANYONE here Hold that God predestined "batman killer?"
- Thread starter Yeshua1
- Start date
God had whole nations killed in the OT. Whether or or not He "permitted" the Colorado incident, He has "permitted" killing before.
PT Barnum once said...
...a sucker is born every minute! This sure looks like a phishing expedition. :tear:
Well, actually, PT Barnum may never have coined this phrase, so here is some additional info on the phrase.
SEE:http://www.historybuff.com/library/refbarnum.html
Still, I agree with Arbo....something is amiss....:thumbsup:
...a sucker is born every minute! This sure looks like a phishing expedition. :tear:
Well, actually, PT Barnum may never have coined this phrase, so here is some additional info on the phrase.
SEE:http://www.historybuff.com/library/refbarnum.html
Still, I agree with Arbo....something is amiss....:thumbsup:
Even this is hard to follow....but
....there may be a grain of truth in this theory! However, if He knew, I have to ask why didn't He send his angels to protect the masses? After all, that is what He's done in the past.
I believe that evil rules vertain realms of this planet, more so than other realms, and it is that evil that brings about these catosphphic events.
Ephesians 6:12 - New King James Version (NKJV) - For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age,[a] against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
The Message (MSG) - And that about wraps it up. God is strong, and he wants you strong. So take everything the Master has set out for you, well-made weapons of the best materials. And put them to use so you will be able to stand up to everything the Devil throws your way. This is no afternoon athletic contest that we'll walk away from and forget about in a couple of hours. This is for keeps, a life-or-death fight to the finish against the Devil and all his angels.
Amplified Bible (AMP) - For we are not wrestling with flesh and blood [contending only with physical opponents], but against the despotisms, against the powers, against [the master spirits who are] the world rulers of this present darkness, against the spirit forces of wickedness in the heavenly (supernatural) sphere.
If the devil was allowed to take out Job's family members, there is no reason to say the devil can't take out other people. However, God did warn Satan that "no hair on Job's head could be touched!"
We are in a spiritual war with evil. A war that can, and does involve the loss of physical life from time to time. Look at the wars throughout history. Not only were soldiers killed, but innocent folks, too!
It is my opinion, that there seems to be a strong evil realm in certain areas around the world, and this part of the nation [Colorado] may be an area that is subject to strong spiritual warfare.
There seems to be no other explanation when it comes to these mass murders and terrorists? It seems that pure evil grabs hold of their spirit and causes them to do their [Satan's evil] bidding!
For this reason we should all be looking forward with great hope for eternity. At least this kind of evil will be gone for good!
This is ALSO one more reason to never take anything we do for granted. We can't afford to become spiritual complacent! We need to surround ourselves with prayer, as well as our loved ones, no matter where our day may take us. Like Paul says, "Pray without ceasing!" I am forever seeking His covering and favor, and I never forget to thank Him when I see evidence of His intervention in my life or the life of my loved ones. I can't even begin to tell you how many times in a day that God is interveing on my behalf, but, He is. This is one reason we have been sent "warring angels!" Not only do angels do our bidding, they are sent to nuture us and do war on our behalf.
We are tremendously blessed as we have the full covering, blessing and intervention of the Holy Ghost as well as His angelic hosts. We are truly special. And one day we will judge the angels.
1 Corinthians 6:3 - New King James Version (NKJV)
Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?
Shalom. Selah!
....there may be a grain of truth in this theory! However, if He knew, I have to ask why didn't He send his angels to protect the masses? After all, that is what He's done in the past.
I believe that evil rules vertain realms of this planet, more so than other realms, and it is that evil that brings about these catosphphic events.
Ephesians 6:12 - New King James Version (NKJV) - For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age,[a] against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
The Message (MSG) - And that about wraps it up. God is strong, and he wants you strong. So take everything the Master has set out for you, well-made weapons of the best materials. And put them to use so you will be able to stand up to everything the Devil throws your way. This is no afternoon athletic contest that we'll walk away from and forget about in a couple of hours. This is for keeps, a life-or-death fight to the finish against the Devil and all his angels.
Amplified Bible (AMP) - For we are not wrestling with flesh and blood [contending only with physical opponents], but against the despotisms, against the powers, against [the master spirits who are] the world rulers of this present darkness, against the spirit forces of wickedness in the heavenly (supernatural) sphere.
If the devil was allowed to take out Job's family members, there is no reason to say the devil can't take out other people. However, God did warn Satan that "no hair on Job's head could be touched!"
We are in a spiritual war with evil. A war that can, and does involve the loss of physical life from time to time. Look at the wars throughout history. Not only were soldiers killed, but innocent folks, too!
It is my opinion, that there seems to be a strong evil realm in certain areas around the world, and this part of the nation [Colorado] may be an area that is subject to strong spiritual warfare.
There seems to be no other explanation when it comes to these mass murders and terrorists? It seems that pure evil grabs hold of their spirit and causes them to do their [Satan's evil] bidding!
For this reason we should all be looking forward with great hope for eternity. At least this kind of evil will be gone for good!
This is ALSO one more reason to never take anything we do for granted. We can't afford to become spiritual complacent! We need to surround ourselves with prayer, as well as our loved ones, no matter where our day may take us. Like Paul says, "Pray without ceasing!" I am forever seeking His covering and favor, and I never forget to thank Him when I see evidence of His intervention in my life or the life of my loved ones. I can't even begin to tell you how many times in a day that God is interveing on my behalf, but, He is. This is one reason we have been sent "warring angels!" Not only do angels do our bidding, they are sent to nuture us and do war on our behalf.
We are tremendously blessed as we have the full covering, blessing and intervention of the Holy Ghost as well as His angelic hosts. We are truly special. And one day we will judge the angels.
1 Corinthians 6:3 - New King James Version (NKJV)
Do you not know that we shall judge angels? How much more, things that pertain to this life?
Shalom. Selah!
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That, my brother....
...is only going to be answered when we get to heaven and ask the Lord in person!
...is only going to be answered when we get to heaven and ask the Lord in person!
Yes...precisely why the basic question in the OP is hard to answer..or, more precisely....the answer can be BOTH yes and no at the same time.
The answer depends on what one means by "pre-destine"
Does "Pre-destine" mean "cause"?
If No:
Then, quite possibly the answer is no
However: If to "predestine" does not necessarily mean "cause". Then the answer could also be...
Yes, absolutely.
One must clearly define what they mean by "predestine" before this is a question can be answered.
Luke described it perfectly: The answer to his question, as he put it:
(emphasis mine)
He being a Calvinist...My being ostensibly Arminian is:
YES
Did the Lord chose to have Him kill those people, put that desire/thought in his mind, 'forced' him to go thru with it, or Did God "merely" know what was going to happen, as the killer made the decision HIMSELF to do the deed?
freeatlast
New Member
Bad belief! If baptist are teaching that than RUN and find someone who is teaching the truth!
Correct belief.
Rev 21:8
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
1Cor 6:11
And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
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freeatlast
New Member
God does not have a permissive will.
freeatlast
New Member
This no longer belongs to God. It was sold to satan by Adam. God is not permitting anything as it is not His to permit. He simply has not taken it all back yet but when He does such things will not be permitted.
are you saying that no murderer has ever been saved by the Grace of God? We ALL were part of the murder of Jesus being sinners, cannot we be saved?
freeatlast
New Member
Just because God ordains some things in history it does not mean He permits as in approes of others. This world belongs to satan and it has to be taken back before God will rule with an absolute rule.
he did not offer to people life or death depending on how they obeyed his ways under Old Covenant?
he did not really offer satan and Adam free will choice?
Are you stating here that God lost His sovereign rule, and now has to somehow "get it back?"
freeatlast
New Member
Read what I wrote and what the bible says.
freeatlast
New Member
I suppose it depends on what you mean by sovereign rule, but the answer could be yes, depending on your definition.
I did!
The Bible states that murderers not washed by the Blodd of jesus are lost, but those who have been are saved!
freeatlast
New Member
Free will yes, but.
Free will and permissive will are not the same. Permissive will suggests that God allows by permission even though it goes against His desires. It would be like a parent who tells their teen child "I really don't want you to do that but go ahead if you really want."
God does not do that.
God sets boundaries with no compromise and men violate them by free will. It is called sin.
freeatlast
New Member
Agreed and it is called sin. :thumbsup:
freeatlast
New Member
This is what the bible says;
But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
And such were some of you
As I have told you many times, believe what is written instead of what men teach.