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Does The Lord Create Evil?

1689Dave

1689Dave

Well-Known Member
Yeshua1 said:
Not really, for if there was no sin, there was to be no spiritua/physical death!
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It still remains, if there are degrees of reward in heaven, which BTW there are, then we have the rewards of Christ's infinite righteousness waiting for us that would be impossible with our's or Adam's finite righteousness.
 
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Yeshua1

Well-Known Member
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1689Dave said:
It still remains, if there are degrees of reward in heaven, which BTW there are, then we have the rewards of Christ's infinite righteousness waiting for us that would be impossible with our's or Adam's finite righteousness.
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There would have been no need for jesus to die if Adam had not chosen to fall!
 
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tyndale1946

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Yeshua1 said:
Yes, was just answering what would ahve happened if Adam did not Fall!
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Scripture is not built on speculation only on the purpose and will of God... God did not will Adam to fall but he did not intervene either... But he had the remedy for it when he did... Brother Glen:)

Genesis 3:9 And the LORD God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou?

Did the Lord know where Adam is?... Sure he did, but Adam had to know where Adam is... Do you Adam?
 
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percho

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When God said."Let there be light," was evil already present on the earth or was evil yet future, at that moment?
 
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percho

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Yeshua1 said:
Yes, was just answering what would ahve happened if Adam did not Fall!
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There then, would have been no need for redemption, which by the way, had already been foreordained in the blood of the to come Christ in the image of Adam, for righteousness would have taken place in the obedience of one, Adam.

IMHO.
 
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percho

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"Let there be Light,"

Did the works of the devil, the evil one, already need to be destroyed by the manifestation of the Son of God or were his works yet to come?
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
1689Dave said:
But we also pray "lead us not into temptation" (by Satan of course).
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And?

Still, the Clark quote is quite problematic:

1689Dave said:
Clark stated that, "God's causing a man to sin is not sin. There is no law, superior to God, which forbids him to decree sinful acts. Sin presupposes a law, for sin is lawlessness." Clark explained that "God is above law" because "the laws that God imposes on men do not apply to the divine nature."
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God does not cause man to sin. Clark's "solution" ignores that the law of God is a reflection of His own character. Therefore, God cannot go against His own law--as Clark theorizes--because to do so would be to deny Himself, which He cannot do.

The Archangel
 
canadyjd

canadyjd

Well-Known Member
Yeshua1 said:
Could say it in the sense that God vauses the storms of life that hit us, that He is still soveriegn over all things, either directly or thru third party, for did he not send the evil spirit upon King Saul?
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God certainly allows bad things to happen to good people (think Job for example)

In King Saul's case, however, if I remember correctly, Saul was behaving inappropriately and God was bringing punishment upon him.
 
Benjamin

Benjamin

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The Archangel said:
And?

Still, the Clark quote is quite problematic:



God does not cause man to sin. Clark's "solution" ignores that the law of God is a reflection of His own character. Therefore, God cannot go against His own law--as Clark theorizes--because to do so would be to deny Himself, which He cannot do.

The Archangel
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Agreed. Yes, I said it, I agree with Archangel on this one! :eek: ;) Actually, this is what I appreciate about a Calvinist who is a consistent Compatibilist compared to a Hard Determinist. They realize concerning the Problem of Evil that the TRUTH must be upheld that evil cannot be assigned to God or you are staring Theological Fatalism in the face.

By aseity God is Only Good and no evil, not even in some contrived round-about way such as Clark "theorizes", can come from Him. This is a vitally important and absolute necessary TRUTH for any theologian to maintain no matter what their soteriological leaning.

We may come at the argument from some different angles but I believe we are pretty close on this coming to the same conclusion when dealing with the P.O.E.
 
The Archangel

The Archangel

Well-Known Member
Benjamin said:
Agreed. Yes, I said it, I agree with Archangel on this one! :eek: ;) Actually, this is what I appreciate about a Calvinist who is a consistent Compatibilist compared to a Hard Determinist. They realize concerning the Problem of Evil that the TRUTH must be upheld that evil cannot be assigned to God or you are staring Theological Fatalism in the face.

By aseity God is Only Good and no evil, not even in some contrived round-about way such as Clark "theorizes", can come from Him. This is a vitally important and absolute necessary TRUTH for any theologian to maintain no matter what their soteriological leaning.

We may come at the argument from some different angles but I believe we are pretty close on this coming to the same conclusion when dealing with the P.O.E.
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Well... this place is apparently a lot colder now...

Blessings,

The Archangel
 
1689Dave

1689Dave

Well-Known Member
The Archangel said:
And?

Still, the Clark quote is quite problematic:



God does not cause man to sin. Clark's "solution" ignores that the law of God is a reflection of His own character. Therefore, God cannot go against His own law--as Clark theorizes--because to do so would be to deny Himself, which He cannot do.

The Archangel
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I'm not defending Clark's position. But I believe it's the best I've heard on the problem of God and evil. Many of the standard theologies say that without sin we cannot know of God's love, mercy, justice, wrath, goodness and so on. So sin appears to be necessary in order to reveal his glory. Which is why he created in the first place.
 
A

Aaron

Member
Site Supporter
tyndale1946 said:
Scripture says he does or does it?... Some say they take the Bible literally, well how do you balance this scripture with a God of love?... Would a God of love create evil?... Comments... Brother Glen:)

Isaiah 45:5 I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:

45:6 That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.

45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

45:8 Drop down, ye heavens, from above, and let the skies pour down righteousness: let the earth open, and let them bring forth salvation, and let righteousness spring up together; I the LORD have created it.
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Like light and darkness are contrasted, evil here is contrasted with peace. God is saying I bring times of peace, and I bring times of war. He will make brothers of enemies, and estrange mothers and daughters. There will be times of relative ease, and times of suffering. God brings them all.

In the bigger picture, as far as the problem of evil is concerned, where a heart is corrupted, where darkness is loved and God is hated, God cannot be charged, and yet it didn't happen outside of His will. We're told what the corrupting influence was with Adam. We're not told how Satan was corrupted, but we are told that lies began with him. Christ calls him the Father of Lies.
 
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