Does the RCC have An Inferior View On the Bible?

[Yeshua1]

"The only type of Catholic that would dare to enter this board in the first place would be a Catholic apologist, one who would make sure that he knows what he is talking about."


What a lot of hooey, DHK. You make accusations and statements grounded upon no facts but upon your own hatred for the Catholic Church. None of the Catholics (three I think) on this board are apologists. You accused the Catholic Church of sending 'their most able apologists to this board'. More hooey!! The only person that ever could have been considered an apologist was Carson Weber and he was still an undergrad at Stuebenville when he participated here. I KNOW BECAUSE I HAVE COMMUNICATED WITH HIM ABOUT THIS BOARD!!! I not saying your a liar, I'm saying you are making false assumptions. If a Catholic has a handle on his faith he/she doesn't fit into assumption that Catholics are poor, ignoramuses that 'don't nuttin 'bout the bible', therefore, the one that do must be apologists. I've spent time going over the archives of this board checking out your allegations. They don't hold water!

When a person on this board, especially someone attending a Baptist church, begins to question the teachings of Protestantism and gives an honest look at the Catholic Church, they are automatically labeled a 'closet Catholic' or accused of coming to this board under false pretenses. I've been called a liar, that I always was a Catholic and could never have been a Baptist in the first place. Lets face it, the idea that someone could study the Catholic faith and conclude it is the New Testament Church Christ founded is absurd to you, so these kinds of conclusions follow.

IF you stick to JUST the ONLY revelation ispired by god unto us today... the BIBLE, one cannot find RCC theology in those sacred texts, and cannot support "official" RCC doctrines, as the Church of rome teaches "another Gospel!"

 

[DHK]

Example, a bigot starts any bigotted statement with, I have many friends who are..... Of course you think it's inaccurate, if you thought I was accurate you'd change. No one questions your heart on the issue. By any definition of the word you are bashing and you aren't biblically supported in what you are doing NO MATTER WHAT you want to call it. I'll gladly take that debate with any one person any time.

It sounds like you are the one bashing. Be careful where you are pointing fingers. I don't need to change. My faith is solidly founded on the Word of God. I can demonstrate every one of my beliefs from the Scripture. The RCC cannot, for it is a man-made religion.

Also, take an anonymous poll of all the users on here and see how many agree with me and not you. You should win the majority because the data pool is skewed to be from the same theological belief system.

Again, need I remind you, this is a Baptist Board. If I went to a Catholic Board do you not think that the numbers would be reversed?

(which makes debate rather difficult if you all agree... but....) What would the Church look like if Peter had said, Paul doesn't belong with us, HE wants to speak to Gentiles... and they kicked him out. They would have lost balance, too much weight one way, and the heavy side thinks they are right, no matter the proof. Afterall there are a thousand others sitting on the same side of the balance as you, so you MUST be right, you win the numbers.... only because you wouldn't let anyone else on to play.

Paul was an Apostle to the Gentiles. He was kicked out of the synagogues many times, and even stoned and left for dead.
I am right because I know my Bible.

So, I'm inaccurate, you have to say that, and I think you believe that, but it's a fantasy that you are free to maintain if you wish. That being said, I still wouldn't want your job of managing one of these places, so my hats are off to your endeavors for your dedication if nothing else.

It is not a fantasy to say that you are not only inaccurate concerning Biblical facts but ignorant of them. I do read your posts.

Yeah, that's what the KKK said when they created their club.

A crude comparison. But if that is what you use when you compare truth to error so be it. It simply tells me where you stand.

That's what the mormons said when they created their group, the seventh day adventists, the J.W.s, the Nazis, the Italian Fascists, the Chines and Russian communists, the calvinists, the latter groups having to kill people, to show how they were right. Which group do you more closely affilate with?

You are simply telling me where you stand. I base all my beliefs on the Bible. You do not. So you have revealed your position. It does not look good from this perspective.

ANYONE can stand on a soapbox and say, YOU ARE WRONG YOU DON'T GET IT I AM RIGHT. And it amounts to petulant hot air expulsion. I've given scripture every step of the way in my comments. Most of you, YOU included avoid addressing it. It's really flippin easy to be right if you redact anything in the bible that might show you to be wrong.

What have I avoided. I haven't avoided any of your comments. So who has the hot air? Again, I base all my beliefs on the Bible, and you have made it clear that you don't.

If you behaved like Paul we would have no problems. You behave like the circumcision group he spoke out against though.

You make assumptions about me that you no nothing about. You know little about me, and yet throw out baseless personal unfounded accusations. What is up with that?
You have made just over 100 posts; and joined just this month, July 2012, and you think that makes you an expert on the personal lives of those in this forum? Unbelievable!!

You are delirious if you find your behavior here to be Paulinian. Make a thread for the two of us to have that chat. You'll be shamed by the time its over. Not because that's my goal, but because of how far from the truth that sentence will be revealed to be. You try to justify the bigotry on here, by claiming it's biblical, but can't, and won't refute any opposition, you just ignore it and say "YOU ARE WRONG". That's weak. You have no support for the behavior on here biblically.

You are right. I am not Paulinian. I am Biblical. There is more than just the epistles of Paul in the Bible. This board is for all, not just two people. Your request is denied as have others by the administration itself. It is doubtful that I would be shamed by you. I don't justify bigotry. What gives you that idea? I do condemn your arrogant attitude however. It seems you don't know how to hold a civil debate. I don't defend the attitudes or behaviour of others. We are all accountable to God. I am not accountable for your behaviour or anyone else's. You will stand before the judgment seat of Christ for your actions and I for mine. I will not give account for your actions or for anyone else's. Why would you expect me to?

Thesaurus??? I"m having to keep it simple, I'd use crayola font if there was one. Why would I use different words when bashing isn't even being understood, why complicate it? You want a different word? I'll consult the dictionary, hang on....

big·ot·ry   /ˈbɪgətri/ Show Spelled[big-uh-tree] Show IPA
noun, plural big·ot·ries.
1. stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.

That's addressing the arguments, not the people making them. I think I'll stick to BASH, it's much more socially acceptable.

very civil of you.

Why do you claim to be a Baptist in your profile but defend Catholic views. A little hypocritical aren't you?

Because I'm more concerned with GOD'S word than some sort of title before my beliefs. And you have no support in GOD'S word for this behavior.

For your behaviour??
Matthew 12:36 But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, they shall give account thereof in the day of judgment.
37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.
--There are many "idle" words in your posts.

A hypocrite is one that tries to hide behind the author of, THEOLOGY ISN"T IMPORTANT BUT FAITH WORKING THROUGH LOVE, and justify bigotry. Hypocrite is a good word to introduce here, but you applied it backwards. I don't defend Catholic views. I've said repeatedly I don't agree with them. However, the more offensive issue here is your blatant misrepresentation of their views, refusal to answer any rebuttal that shows it, and screams I'm not holy enough because I side with the Bible not your proclamations of how I'm supposed to believe. Do you know why there are more "Baptist denominations" than any other sect of Xianity? Because they all think they are right and none of them agree. Paul said it was a result of the flesh, not Spirit that caused that. OMG There's that Paul guy you affiliate with slapping you down again. Life's rough somedays.

Since I haven't posted much in this particular thread you probably can't demonstrate where I have misrepresented their views, and therefore you are simply spouting off slander and false allegations. Is this your typical manner of debate? Where have I refused to give any rebuttal to your answers. I think you are confused. You do not side with the Bible. You don't know it well enough to side with it. Where did I say anything about Paul and agreeing with him, more than any other Biblical author. You really are confused. The only reason that Baptists differ one from another is that they believe in soul liberty, something that this nation has because people like the Baptists fought for it.

I'll always be a Christian before baptist. You should do the same.

How do I know that? Right now I don't know what you are. You put on your profile that you are a heretic. Should I believe that?

1, just go ahead and ban me because I won't let you practice your bigotry.
2, join the jw's and KKK in breaking off and making your own sect by ONLY allowing like minded people in. You'll show me then! :BangHead:
3, God sent angels from heaven and man to deliver his messages to the peoples. Perhaps you should stop ignoring the verses I share with you guys and answer them before you shoot the messenger. Nothing I've said yet was personal with no biblical support. I've received a crap load of that from you and like minded people. That's pretty Godly of you. You wonder why I question that "GODLINESS"? Do the poll. I dare you.

First of all I simply said: "To post here is a privilege, not a right." That is written in the rules. If you did not agree with that when you registered and pressed that "I agree," then you shouldn't have joined. You were deceitful, and lied. You should just leave on your own accord. Let me repeat it for you:
To post here is a privilege and not a right.
If you don't agree then leave.

I don't know what you refer to when you say "your bigotry," but you are not God. You don't have the power to stop me from posting. I have posted nothing that can be construed as bigotry.

You can join whatever group you wish. You mentioned a few options. But I am a Baptist, and I chose to join here because it is a Baptist Board. Does that make sense to you yet?

What verses have you shared with me? What answers have I not given you? Are you making illogical assumptions that are called sweeping generalizations?

 

[DHK]

You are a damned bigoted liar. I can bring references from one of the most conservative seminaries in the country that I'm a far cry from Catholic. If you think to be baptist I have to ignore the bible and back up your bigoted comments, I'd like you to meet my God. You'll really be impressed with Him, as strange as He is to you.

Your language, if continued, will earn you infractions, which when accumulated will get you banned. You do know how to debate in a civil manner I hope? If you are a far cry from being a Catholic why on earth would you defend them? You don't have to ignore the Bible, but that is what you seem to do. I don't want to meet your God. I already know who God is. He is my Savior and I have a personal relationship with him. I am quite satisfied in that.

I support the Bible. You support hating catholics. You can't even bear to hear you may be wrong in what you do. No matter how hard God tries to reach you, you turn him down and embrace your bigotry over the Bible.

For one who claims to support the Bible, why don't you use it instead of using foul language on this board? Your choice of language supports your hatred. I don't hate Catholics; I despise the doctrine that they teach. You can't see the difference can you? God has reached me. He reached down in love and saved me many years ago. A person who uses the vile language you do, probably wouldn't understand that.

When I do that, you'll be justified in banning me. To ban me for giving biblical arguments against your actions, is nothing but bigoted cowardice. BUT very, "your form of" baptist.

I just asked you to keep the rules, and you reply that when you do then I will be justified in banning you?? Shall I take you up on your invitation? What are you talking about "biblical arguments." You haven't spoken about anything Biblical. You have only come here to rant against this board, and call people names, or so it seems.

BTW you never responded to your claims of their beliefs being inaccurate, so I'll conclude they are just flat out lies and deliberate to support your bigotry.

What claims? Did you want me to go through the entire RCC Catechism point by point? You will have to be a bit more specific than that.

 

[DHK]

Well show you know, correct some of the people's ridiculous claims. Like you are saved by works. I gave the biblical break down of that one, and not a person here was man, or woman enough to answer it. Just turn your head and whistled as you walked off.

The RCC's define in their Catechism that "new birth" = "baptism." Baptism is a work. One cannot be saved without baptism they say. That is what the new birth is. That is salvation by works. It is that simple. To maintain one's salvation it must be maintained by works.

The Bible teaches neither one of those heretical beliefs.
Therefore being justified by faith we have peace with God. (Rom.5:1)
--We are justified by faith.
Eph.2:8,9 For by grace are ye saved through faith...not of works.
It is clear. Works have no part in salvation.

And most of my arguments have been, I don't agree with them, but they are more biblical than protestants are, followed with explanations and scripture, and your answers have been a unanimous, profound, "NU UH!" Very "debate" like of you.

And where have you found such answers?
I just gave you a Biblical one.

So you ban them, and take the fight to them, and claim to love them? if you don't love them, you aren't in God and he's not in you. I'm not accusing, I'm quoting, John was the chaps name. The word AGAPAO is not present anywhere in what you are doing here. Your results make factions and dissensions, that's fleshly not spiritual fruit, and you posture to be the holy one. Give me a break.

Why not reread what you just posted. Now tell me where the word agape is demonstrated in your post. There is more hatred in that post then in all the posts on this page. But you would never admit to that would you? Neither would I admit to "hatred" in defending my faith, or in sharing my faith to a Catholic. But you have no clue how I would do that simply because you only read what is posted on a debate forum. Some people can't get that through their heads.

But you can promote HATE and BIGOTRY not to mention allow lies and deliberate misrepresentations of their faith, and eliminate anyone that can refute you. That's not debate. It's not even teaching. It's bigotry. It's holy huddle. It's exactly EXACTLY how the KKK was formed, read their history. That is the closest model to your behavior here, is KKK. That's a PRECIOUS fruit you bear. DO THE POLL!

Please tell me who is promoting the hatred here. Look to yourself and your attitude to others. I don't misrepresent the RCC faith. I don't eliminate those that can refute me. If you don't know the policies of the board, or the history of the board, that leaves you in the dark. Don't try to defend your ignorance. Your last three lines demonstrate arrogant ignorance.

So you guys have said, and I refuted, and you had no answers. So until you can back up your braggodocious claims, I'm pretty content where I'm at. And wrong about their claims or not, I'm not wrong on what scripture says about their beliefs, and you guys have yet to address it.

You haven't refuted anything that I have said, have you?
Nor have you provided me any Scriptures for the RCC beliefs, so I don't know what you are talking about. You probably couldn't anyway. Providing Scripture for the Assumption of Mary, her Immaculate Conception, her perpetual virginity, have always been difficult for the RCC. But according to you, you will have no problem with backing up your claims with Scripture.

WHAT KIND OF BAPTIST ARE YOU? Are you baptist ONLY because you believe in the full dunk, and not the love neighbor, love enemy, love brother, don't cause strife, dissension, factions, etc.. LOOK you can poo poo me away anytime you wish. I respect your rights. But you can make me disappear, you will still be causing strife dissension, factions, UNLOVE, hate and bigotry. And you'll be claiming you are holier than me because I defend some RCC doctrine, which is a lie, I defend the Bible and it happens to support their doctrine, MOST of the time.

I see you defending the RCC; not the Bible.

Question my faith like you just did, what an AD HOMINEM way to answer me, when you can't refute the scriptures presented in these threads that you abhorently violate.

Question your faith? Alright. You tell me what "Bible thumping heretic" means. That is your "biography."

The above, is giving you the same tone and respect you have shown me. If you think I'm out of line, boot yourself first, I'm following your lead.

Your philosophy: Two wrongs make a right?? (If what you said was true). But then how would you know that with only 100 posts and less than a month on the board?

You can investigate that, and we can debate it with citations and see who is revising, but you wouldn't want to do that, you don't want to be shown you are wrong, that's why no RCC's are allowed on here to defend themselves. :1_grouphug:ONLY "holy like me/judged by me and approved by me" allowed. Right?

No you are wrong, and demonstrating your ignorance about this board.
You also seem to be wrong about history, I am guessing.

Step out of the vacuum then.

It is not I that lives in the vacuum of ignorance.

When you can answer the direct rebuttals to any of the things you have said, vs ignoring them, your comment will warrant consideration.

Name-calling, offensive language, personal attacks--it needs no rebuttal, only condemnation.

At this point you are an embarassed, shamed, whiney thug. You want to demean my character? Lie about my faith because I don't think like you? Well own your sins then. Bigot, thuggy, fascist. Look up every word. NOT A ONE is a word that you haven't exhibited the behavior to on here. So you can boot the messenger, it won't change your heart. You won't have some one VOICING opposition to you, but that just means you'll be a bigot in peace. Not any sorta holier than thou Xian.

Again, name-calling, offensive language, personal attacks--it needs no rebuttal, only condemnation.

Oh, you are so right, for example, many of your pasionate, selected chosen members, :1_grouphug: have made DIRECT CONTRADICTIONS TO THE WORD OF GOD, and belittled me telling me I'm wrong because I won't let them. You are truly all of one kind. Scripture is good for you to have a prop to rewrite and claim to be superior from. But, none of you have been man enough, nor Xian enough to face it word for word and try to live by it. You've one and all tried to rewrite it to suit your theology.

You make judgements without justification. You have just made another sweeping generalization about all of us, when you know very little about any of us. Are you claiming the omniscience of God?

Well, I'm your nemesis, I let scripture define my theology, not my theology define my scripture. I had to change from a belief similar to yours, to where I am now just to be IN LINE with scripture. You are still trying to force it into your personal box. Good luck with that. You can pour the milk out into a meat shaped cookie mold, but it's still milk.

1. You don't use the Scripture.
2. You don't have any defined theology.
3. I don't have a "personal box." What I believe is defined by the Bible.
4. You sound like a very confused person.

You are passionate about filling in for GOD on the judgment seat. How can I argue with With GOD's personal substitute judge. Arrogant bigot.

More name-calling.
Jesus himself said:
Judge righteous judgment. It is a command.
He also said: "Beware of the leaven of the Pharisees." He was speaking of the false doctrine of the Pharisees. The false doctrine of today's Pharisees is the false doctrine of the RCC.

 

[DHK]

To date, I've shown biblically they are not. YOu've sit on a stump and called me names, insulted me, maligned my character, my faith, and ignored my direct rebuttals to repeat the above. ALL OF THAT was against your rules. I noticed the one rule you didn't approve, is if it's gays or catholics none of the respect others rules apply.

To date I haven't seen you use the Bible. To date you have been the one name-calling and hurling personal insults as any reader can see in this post. I have given you rebuttals to whatever post you have given me, but you have given me precious little to answer. I notice that you are the one that has no respect here. Why don't you take time to reread the rules. It might do you some good.

If you have the love right, you are in heaven. Plain and simple.

If that is what you believe then you are not saved. It is the object of your love that is important. Misplaced love will send you to Hell.

If you have the love right, HE is in you and you are in HIM. If you got the love wrong, you can be the leader of the SBC convention for all I care, the word baptist won't do anything but get you laughed at in hell.

Love alone cannot save.

That is the SOLE requirement that is the result and canon of everyother statement in the Bible regarding salvation. You have ZERO agapao on here. You don't even understand the word. It's as absent here, as the people thinking SARX ONLY refers to the human body are ignorant of it's meaning.

Love doesn't save anyone. It is Christ that saves, and Him alone. If there is no faith in Christ there is no salvation.

I have never been taught by the RCC. You have. Perhaps that explains your intrinsic, uncontrollable angst and hate towards them. I'm clear of any reason to hate them. I made my arguments because of years of conversations with multiple faiths, and doing my own research. You are parroting comments other's teach, and ... wait... maybe not you parroting comments, but "you" in the general sense referring to the ... wait for it.... "BASHING" found on here.

I don't bash people. I despise false doctrine; the very doctrine Jesus said to rebuke, and Paul said to avoid. Jude said to contend for the faith. Paul disputed in the market place. More and more, as I see what you post, I am beginning to wonder if you have any good understanding of what the gospel is.

Thus they created factions and dissensions. Flesh not fruit of the spirit. I'm so glad you embrace the fleshly foundation you are built from. :| Now, stop claiming to be the holy one. You aren't selling it to anyone.

The Reformers exposed the corruption in the RCC for what it really was. What followed were horrible Inquisitions and condemnation by the RCC. The RCC has killed more people, made martyrs out of more people than any other group of people.

Some of the smartes people I talk with, biblically are RCC. Sorry, but you are living a pipe dream and stating a dramatic untruth. Perhaps you just hung out with some ignorant RCC'ers, that would explain why something as hateful as the Xianity you preach here would make sense to you, you were one of the ignorant, and now you are just a louder form of ignorant, still just as ignorant as before, because you can't support your behavior in scripture anywhere. I've shown you errant over a dozen times, you can't and don't answer them. So, you say whatever you have to do to claim to be Xian. Whatever makes you feel good. But no one is going to buy your claim with this behavior.

I don't use the profanity you do, so you are not one to talk.
The one using hateful speech has the name of "Catalyst."
I have told the truth concerning the RCC, my experiences with them in the past, and now in the presence. So as much as you would like to call me a liar you would be wise not to. To remain in ignorance and use it as your defense is your right.

 

[Catalyst]

IF you stick to JUST the ONLY revelation ispired by god unto us today... the BIBLE, one cannot find RCC theology in those sacred texts, and cannot support "official" RCC doctrines, as the Church of rome teaches "another Gospel!"

Right. You can't do it, if you go into the research to prove it can't be done. However if you go in and just take the verses as they are written, then its not only there its REALLY friggin obvious.

I started that conversation, pauls thoughts on the church. Someone is going to cry its teaching rcc doctrine, unfortunately its not my fault that rome got something right, its an exegetical look at the topic.

Go show me how the verses say anything close to no way to see the rcc. Dare ya. No changing, adding or removing words, just cuz you don't like what was written already.

 

[Moriah]

Go show me how the verses say anything close to no way to see the rcc. Dare ya. No changing, adding or removing words, just cuz you don't like what was written already.

I want to make sure I understand right. What scriptures do you want?

 

[Catalyst]

Dhk, you are a liar. I have used no inappripriate language. Paul used the most vulgar, dirty word for fecal waste there was in his day, wished people mangled their male junk,and Christ gave the pharisees the most impactful and dirty curse that was available to Him. Go ahead and reproach them too. You are trying to dig yourself out of a hole by creating other issues. You can come on and just say, "no I'm not" and pretend you said something but you are full of it and you know you are. Its posturing. You guys make a one on one threac and let's start exegeting these verses. I look forward to how bright you flush when you have no legs to stand on anymore. You can hide behind power, stubborn and denial til the cows come home, but every you and others on here know you are reaching.

I don't care abiut that. I care about scripture, the history, the exegesis, and debunking your agenda driven attacks on Rome. Its not my fault that Rome got some scripture right, but I can accept it, you go and try to rewrite it. There is NO intellectual honesty in anything you say. In fact, it appears you have already about catholic offenses on here, apparently too feed your position. You are so unsure of your reasoning in yojr faith they scare you and you won't let them on here.

Or do you think the Holy Spirit, what you iron cast ultra conservative fundamentalists say is the teacher of all of us, ISN'T CAPABLE OF KEEPING THOSE IN THE FAITH, IN THE FAITH? Do you think God needs you to make secret groups, disallowing members that disagree, so you can provide the protection HE is incapable of? That isn't faith. Its insecurity. You aren't being righteous, you are collecting lemmings to scratch your back.

The difference between them and me, I stand on altruistic principal, and I don't care what you do to silence me, I'm saying what is before us. And I'm defending God's word. You try to ad hominem that with a whiney YOU ARE CATHOLIC attempt to discredit me. Unfortunately you were incapable of proving anything I said scripture says is wrong. So all you have is personal denigrating attacks, and historical lies to justify your bigoted actions.

I'm on my phone, I will answer yout post tomorrow. But, if you are a moderator you should live by the rules you enforce. Its not ok to call someone a name, because you proclaim them a heretic.

I have used no language you couldn't hear in a pg movie. And it can all be used prime time tv. There is no place in scripture that condemns words like that. It condemns messages, like slander, mal feasance of communication power, cursing someone, a biblical curse isn't saying shit damn or hell,its condemning someone's name so they suffer. Back then your name was your label/brand, and to do so stripped someone of their livlihood.

The most extreme curse in the Bible came from jesus to the pharisees. Remember they believed if one of them lived one day sinless the messiah would arrive. They spent their lives trying to meet that standard. That's why the pharisees on the road went to the other side when the man was bleeding. You can't get to close to the blood, you would be ritually unclean. The most unclean thing in the Bible is the adversary. For you, the mean ole boogie man. Hw is the most opposite of God you can be so by definition, the largest curse. When Christ called them vipers, you can bet they were shocked, then realized the insult, then sought to angrily go after him.

Your concept of making issue of those few words I used for emphatic purpose, and many of them, like hell and damned I used literally as found in scripture, is a prime example of colossians 2's warning of peiple who make rules that sound holy to man, but aren't even a shadow of the righteous that is to come. Its dangerous to teach such irresponsible things. You get a church full of fundamental baptists, they could all be adulterers and cheats at business, but they don't say those words, they don't drink or smoke, and they don't dance, and they think there is proof positive. None of those things have any bearing on biblical xianity. Its man made rules to give some immature thig a reason to show off and claim to be holier than someone else. Paul warned against it. You embrace and try to enforce it.

You are an eisegetical nightmare. There is no exegesis behind any of your comments that holds substantial water.

I will give your comments specific answers tomorrow, its way to taxing on my phone. Can you make a room where it will not be polluted by other posters? I think you being the/a leader on here should live by the standards you write and enforce and being an ultraconservative "claims to be" fundamentalist based group, should live up to biblical standards as well. I can show your offenses and you can put me in my place for the world to see. And they can judge you by your words, my arguments, and your fruit. That should CERTAINLY put me in my place.

 

[Jon-Marc]

Genisis 38, jerimah 1:5 and Luke 1
Condems contraception

The catholic church is the only church that has a sound reason. For every line in the bible because they wrote it through the inspiration of the holy ghost

If the catholic church wrote the Bible, why didn't they include all the beliefs they've made up--baby baptism, purgatory, calling Mary the "Mother of God", which places her above God, and praying to dead saints when only God can answer prayer? I can pray directly to God, and Christ Jesus is our ONLY mediator between us and the Father.

 

[Walter]

If the catholic church wrote the Bible, why didn't they include all the beliefs they've made up--baby baptism, purgatory, calling Mary the "Mother of God", which places her above God, and praying to dead saints when only God can answer prayer? I can pray directly to God, and Christ Jesus is our ONLY mediator between us and the Father.

You Protestants just love to do the doctrinal dance, don't you?? Don't forget to accuse us of selling holy water, praying to candles and statues, worshipping incense and pronouncing Latin hexes, too.

Mary is the Mother of God. Jesus was God or He wasn't. Mary was His mother. She is, indeed, the Mother of God. You may not like the title because you hate the Catholic Church but Mary was Theotokos. The title is much more about who Jesus is, than Mary. Study some Church history and you will find that out.

 

[DHK]

Dhk, you are a liar. I have used no inappripriate language. Paul used the most vulgar, dirty word for fecal waste there was in his day, wished people mangled their male junk,and Christ gave the pharisees the most impactful and dirty curse that was available to Him. Go ahead and reproach them too. You are trying to dig yourself out of a hole by creating other issues. You can come on and just say, "no I'm not" and pretend you said something but you are full of it and you know you are. Its posturing. You guys make a one on one threac and let's start exegeting these verses. I look forward to how bright you flush when you have no legs to stand on anymore. You can hide behind power, stubborn and denial til the cows come home, but every you and others on here know you are reaching.

You are not the Apostle Paul. You agreed to specific rules. You have not been abiding by them. Posting in grace, and not offending others is not your forte.

Here is an example of what is not appropriate on the board, all quoted from your posts on page 16:

You are a damned bigoted liar.

your bigoted comments,

Bigot, thuggy, fascist.

You damned coward.

There is enough unprocessed bull fertilizer in you to fertilize all of illinois and half of kansas.

You are as worthless as your theology.

There is nothing edifying in anything that you said.

In reference to the word "damned", only God has that power. You have no power to "damn" anyone, and such language is shameful coming from you or anyone who calls themselves a Christian.

 

[Walter]

You are not the Apostle Paul. You agreed to specific rules. You have not been abiding by them. Posting in grace, and not offending others is not your forte.

Here is an example of what is not appropriate on the board, all quoted from your posts on page 16:

There is nothing edifying in anything that you said.

In reference to the word "damned", only God has that power. You have no power to "damn" anyone, and such language is shameful coming from you or anyone who calls themselves a Christian.

Neither were the mocking, nasty posts directed at me by EWF appropriate and were shameful coming from someone that calls themself a Christian. But, even though those posts were reported, you totally ignored them. Wonder why? You don't moderate this forum fairly. Any enemy of your enemy is your friend.

 

[Iconoclast]

The problem for the RCC is that they want to read later-century developments back into the first and early second century churches. For example, in the time of Ignatius, there were no monarchical bishops; that did not develop until the late second century. In fact, there were not three orders of ministry in A.D. 110; the NT order was still in place in which the office of elder/presbyter/pastor/bishop was one and the same office.

Thus, the "apostolic succession" consisting of an unbroken line of monarchical bishops as a third order of ministry back to the apostles is a fable, as John Wesley rightly came to see.

:thumbs::wavey::applause:

 

[Catalyst]

You are not god but you judge people. Paul is an apostle, a role model for me. I used no word not in prime time tv, and I used them appropriately.

More so, there is absolutely nothing biblical referencing words being bad, well except raca...

You can't produce one. I gave you 2/3 of col ch 2 that says your efforts to make rules not of god on what is a sin and what isn't is you making problems, not holiness. As usual you didn't answer that. You ignored thatk and the drinking/smoking/"cussing" which is a bastardization of cursing and has nothing to do with what a curse is. "Cussing" is a made up offense not in the bible. Might as well argue over circumcision, holy days, what to wear and not wear, and so forth. Its but a shadow of what is real. No comments no answer. Any idea how condescending and presumptively arrogant that is? The bible, and me mentioning it, are so unimportant you neec not address it. I guess if you sub for God on the throne of judgment, you got some clout...

 

[DHK]

Neither were the mocking, nasty posts directed at me by EWF appropriate and were shameful coming from someone that calls themself a Christian. But, even though those posts were reported, you totally ignored them. Wonder why? You don't moderate this forum fairly. Any enemy of your enemy is your friend.

No doubt some of them were a bit nasty and should have been edited.
Please note: Any pro-Catholic post will be watched much more closely than those posted by Baptists, especially by me. Understand Walter, you have switched camps. You are now posting in enemy territory so to speak. When Catalyst posts those things he posts them against me, personally; me, a moderator; me, a Baptist. And thus his words bite against all the Baptists and all the moderators that are here.
You speak on behalf of yourself and represent the beliefs of the RCC, but you are posting on a Baptist Board, and have been graciously given permission to do so. It is not a right. It is a private board. If any Catholic has a problem here, he should leave. IMO they shouldn't be here in the first place. One cannot believe in RCC doctrine and be a Christian at the same time.

 

[DHK]

You are not god but you judge people. Paul is an apostle, a role model for me. I used no word not in prime time tv, and I used them appropriately.

More so, there is absolutely nothing biblical referencing words being bad, well except raca...

You can't produce one. I gave you 2/3 of col ch 2 that says your efforts to make rules not of god on what is a sin and what isn't is you making problems, not holiness. As usual you didn't answer that. You ignored thatk and the drinking/smoking/"cussing" which is a bastardization of cursing and has nothing to do with what a curse is. "Cussing" is a made up offense not in the bible. Might as well argue over circumcision, holy days, what to wear and not wear, and so forth. Its but a shadow of what is real. No comments no answer. Any idea how condescending and presumptively arrogant that is? The bible, and me mentioning it, are so unimportant you neec not address it. I guess if you sub for God on the throne of judgment, you got some clout...

You are honestly trying to defend the things that you said (and I quoted for you) in post #171??
Unbelievable!

 

[Yeshua1]

No doubt some of them were a bit nasty and should have been edited.
Please note: Any pro-Catholic post will be watched much more closely than those posted by Baptists, especially by me. Understand Walter, you have switched camps. You are now posting in enemy territory so to speak. When Catalyst posts those things he posts them against me, personally; me, a moderator; me, a Baptist. And thus his words bite against all the Baptists and all the moderators that are here.
You speak on behalf of yourself and represent the beliefs of the RCC, but you are posting on a Baptist Board, and have been graciously given permission to do so. It is not a right. It is a private board. If any Catholic has a problem here, he should leave. IMO they shouldn't be here in the first place. One cannot believe in RCC doctrine and be a Christian at the same time.

Think that ALL Baptists here posting would Amen with me, and agree that we do see the lord able to and saving individual catholics, In SPITE OF their heretical views espoused by RCC, but they need to come out and be seperate from among them!

We also would see the RCC itself as NOT being another Christian church! one mimicing ot, much as say the Mormon church does!

 

[DHK]

"The only type of Catholic that would dare to enter this board in the first place would be a Catholic apologist, one who would make sure that he knows what he is talking about."


What a lot of hooey, DHK.

Personal attacks are not tolerated and do your case no good

You make accusations and statements grounded upon no facts but upon your own hatred for the Catholic Church.

Your statement is a false accusation, and in and of itself is a hateful statement. Why do you direct hate toward me. What you perceive as "hate" is not directed toward any person, but to the doctrine of the RCC. Therefore you are in the wrong, not I.

None of the Catholics (three I think) on this board are apologists.

You defeat your own argument. What is an apologist? You quoted my definition and used it as your own OP for this post. Here is what you said an "apologist" is:

"one who would make sure that he knows what he is talking about."
--You fit into that category don't you? So does TS. And so do many others.

You accused the Catholic Church of sending 'their most able apologists to this board'.

You lied. The only statement I made (that I can find) about Catholic apologists), is the one that you quoted. It says nothing about "the most able apologists." Why are you lying and being deceptive. It is statements like these that earn a person infractions and eventually get them banned. Tell the truth if you are going to debate.

More hooey!! The only person that ever could have been considered an apologist was Carson Weber and he was still an undergrad at Stuebenville when he participated here.

Remember, I am going by the definition of apologist that you posted.
Examine also the posters on this board. There are no "Baptist apologists" on this board of the caliber that you have in mind. Josh McDowell is not here. Neither is Norm Geisler. Nor any of the other apologists that travel simply for that purpose. The men and women here are either pastors, or, like Ansi and Amy, have studied on their own accord the doctrines of their own faith and the RCC faith and have become quite knowledgeable about it. You would call them, by your definition, apologists. Many of us are former Catholics, and quite aware what the Catholics teach contrary to the stomping of your feet and pounding of your fists.

I KNOW BECAUSE I HAVE COMMUNICATED WITH HIM ABOUT THIS BOARD!!! I not saying your a liar, I'm saying you are making false assumptions.

Talking with Carson was one of your first big mistakes. Perhaps if you had not done that you would not be in the mess you are in today. He misrepresents many things including Scripture.

If a Catholic has a handle on his faith he/she doesn't fit into assumption that Catholics are poor, ignoramuses that 'don't nuttin 'bout the bible', therefore, the one that do must be apologists.

Many of them are apologists. They do have a handle on the Bible--to their own destruction:

2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; wherein are some things hard to be understood, which the ignorant and unstedfast wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
--For example, any one who equates the new birth with baptism is ignorant (of the Bible) and they wrest the Scriptures to their own destruction, for that is not what the new birth is, and yet it is one of the most important doctrines of the Bible. Yet that is what the RCC Catechism teaches.

I've spent time going over the archives of this board checking out your allegations. They don't hold water!

Any person not understanding the Bible would say that.

When a person on this board, especially someone attending a Baptist church, begins to question the teachings of Protestantism and gives an honest look at the Catholic Church, they are automatically labeled a 'closet Catholic' or accused of coming to this board under false pretenses.

When Catholics are not allowed on the board, their registrations denied, what conclusion would you like me to come to?

I've been called a liar, that I always was a Catholic and could never have been a Baptist in the first place.

You could always ask an administrator to change your profile, explaining your situation, but you haven't done that. So the deceit is on your part, isn't it? There are many on this board who have changed their profiles. Why isn't it a problem for them, but it is for you?

Lets face it, the idea that someone could study the Catholic faith and conclude it is the New Testament Church Christ founded is absurd to you, so these kinds of conclusions follow.

It is absurd. It is the harlot church. You will find that conclusion in any 18th or 19th century Protestant commentary. Most of the Presbyterian ones come to that conclusion.
It is a religion of works that deny salvation by faith.
You cannot be a Christian and believe what the RCC teaches at the same time. It remains an impossibility. The two are at antipodes with each other.

 

[The Biblicist]

You Protestants just love to do the doctrinal dance, don't you?? Don't forget to accuse us of selling holy water, praying to candles and statues, worshipping incense and pronouncing Latin hexes, too.

Mary is the Mother of God. Jesus was God or He wasn't. Mary was His mother. She is, indeed, the Mother of God. You may not like the title because you hate the Catholic Church but Mary was Theotokos. The title is much more about who Jesus is, than Mary. Study some Church history and you will find that out.

You will not find the Greek term "theotokos" in scripture. Nor is Mary the mother of God as God has no Mother but is everlasting to everlasting. What Mary conceived was not God but a HUMAN body with a HUMAN Nature and it was that humanity that The Word of God "tabernacled" or "TOOK UPON HIMSELF." Hence, the Deity of Christ is never once mentioned or described as being "born" but a "son was GIVEN and a child WAS BORN." Mary is the mother of what was "born" not the Son which was "given."

 

[Yeshua1]

You will not find the Greek term "theotokos" in scripture. Nor is Mary the mother of God as God has no Mother but is everlasting to everlasting. What Mary conceived was not God but a HUMAN body with a HUMAN Nature and it was that humanity that The Word of God "tabernacled" or "TOOK UPON HIMSELF." Hence, the Deity of Christ is never once mentioned or described as being "born" but a "son was GIVEN and a child WAS BORN." Mary is the mother of what was "born" not the Son which was "given."

Yes, as she was the physicasl mother to jesus humanity, but NOT His divine nature, as God was always his eternal Father!