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Don't Armeniens/Calvinists BOTh Teach Grace/Faith Alone ?

J

JesusFan

Well-Known Member
Seems that both those of Free Will side and Election side teach and promote that we are saved by grace of GOD thru faith In Christ ALONE, so aren't we all agreeing on what the Gospel message really is?

We differ on how it is all applied and brought about in a Christian life, but don't we still preach same Gospel of Christ crucified and risen on behalf of those saved in Him?

I believe in 4 points of TULIP, but isn't there just 1 Gospel both sides teach/preach?
NOT Gospel for free Will/ another for Election?
 
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J

jbh28

Active Member
JesusFan said:
Seems that both those of Free Will side and Election side teach and promote that we are saved by grace of GOD thru faith In Christ ALONE, so aren't we all agreeing on what the Gospel message really is?

We differ on how it is all applied and brought about in a Christian life, but don't we still preach same Gospel of Christ crucified and risen on behalf of those saved in Him?

I believe in 4 points of TULIP, but isn't there just 1 Gospel both sides teach/preach?
NOT Gospel for free Will/ another for Election?
Click to expand...

Here is the gospel
For I delivered to you as of first importance what I also received: that Christ died for our sins in accordance with the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day in accordance with the Scriptures, and that he appeared to Cephas, then to the twelve.
(1 Corinthians 15:3-5 ESV)
 
D

drfuss

New Member
JesusFan said:
Seems that both those of Free Will side and Election side teach and promote that we are saved by grace of GOD thru faith In Christ ALONE, so aren't we all agreeing on what the Gospel message really is?

We differ on how it is all applied and brought about in a Christian life, but don't we still preach same Gospel of Christ crucified and risen on behalf of those saved in Him?

I believe in 4 points of TULIP, but isn't there just 1 Gospel both sides teach/preach?
NOT Gospel for free Will/ another for Election?
Click to expand...

Yes, one Gospel; different terminology, definitions and a play on words.
 
M

matt wade

Well-Known Member
No, Calvinists believe that God forces you to be saved whether you like it or not. Or, I should say, they believe God forces you to be saved and he forces you to like it.
 
A

Andy T.

Active Member
matt wade said:
No, Calvinists believe that God forces you to be saved whether you like it or not. Or, I should say, they believe God forces you to be saved and he forces you to like it.
Click to expand...
Very penetrating insight here. Since you answered "No" - do you think Cals don't believe the Gospel and are not saved?
 
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webdog

webdog

Active Member
Site Supporter
JesusFan said:
Seems that both those of Free Will side and Election side teach and promote that we are saved by grace of GOD thru faith In Christ ALONE, so aren't we all agreeing on what the Gospel message really is?

We differ on how it is all applied and brought about in a Christian life, but don't we still preach same Gospel of Christ crucified and risen on behalf of those saved in Him?

I believe in 4 points of TULIP, but isn't there just 1 Gospel both sides teach/preach?
NOT Gospel for free Will/ another for Election?
Click to expand...
I'm glad as a calvinist you grasp this...it is quite refreshing to be honest.

That is why it really irks me when a reformer will say such things as "calvinism is the Gospel", "Christ was a calvinist" and refer to us non cal's with "nameless theology" as "self salvationists" who serve another god because we refuse to let Him be sovereign. It's total pile of steaming...
 
O

Osage Bluestem

Member
Yes we both preach the same gospel. Salvation is by grace through faith in Christ alone.

This is certainly not an issue to break fellowship over.
 
A

Andy T.

Active Member
matt wade said:
Answering this question would be against the forum rules.
Click to expand...
Well, we know by your statement here, what your answer is. I hope you're praying for me! :wavey:

Hey Webdog - here's an example of the flip-side to what you've seen come from some Cals.
 
J

jbh28

Active Member
matt wade said:
No, Calvinists believe that God forces you to be saved whether you like it or not. Or, I should say, they believe God forces you to be saved and he forces you to like it.
Click to expand...
Well, that's not true. I guess being honest about those that we disagree with is too much to ask for.

webdog said:
I'm glad as a calvinist you grasp this...it is quite refreshing to be honest.

That is why it really irks me when a reformer will say such things as "calvinism is the Gospel", "Christ was a calvinist" and refer to us non cal's with "nameless theology" as "self salvationists" who serve another god because we refuse to let Him be sovereign. It's total pile of steaming...
Click to expand...
The gospel is the gospel. Both Calvinists and Arminians (and those in between) believe the same gospel. You are correct in that we should refrain from making those that disagree with us some type of "lower" Christian.
 
T

Tom Butler

New Member
We have to be more specific when outlining differences between Calvinist understanding of the gospel and the Arminian understanding.

More accurately, we need to speak of Baptist Calvinists and Baptist Non-Calvinists.

That's because most Baptists who are not Calvinists also reject being described s Arminian. Even Free-Will Baptists and General Baptists, who believe one can lose his salvation, don't like the term Arminian.

The reason for disliking the term Arminian is that most if not all Baptists believe salvation is by grace alone through faith alone, and reject works salvation, including baptismal regeneration and observation of other sacraments.

So, that being true, we Cals and non-Cals can certainly fellowship around the gospel, because both of us agree on what it is.
 
M

matt wade

Well-Known Member
jbh28 said:
Well, that's not true. I guess being honest about those that we disagree with is too much to ask for.
Click to expand...

Based upon the teachings of Luke on this board, what I described is exactly what Calvinists believe. If that's not true, then feel free to show the errors of my statement.
 
J

jbh28

Active Member
matt wade said:
Based upon the teachings of Luke on this board, what I described is exactly what Calvinists believe. If that's not true, then feel free to show the errors of my statement.
Click to expand...

Calvinist don't believe that people are saved by forcing them against their will.
 
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