Double Double Toil and Trouble

[Dr. Walter]

How does someone born totally blind become blinder?

Because you are confusing SPIRITUAL inability that comes only with a new heart as Deuteronomy 29:4 explicitly states with NATURAL ability of conscience to recognize light which the fleshly mind reacts by hardening as John 3:19-20 and Romans 8:7-8 clearly demonstrates.

Deuteromony 29:4 completely invalidates your whole position as it proves that PRIOR to being given the new heart there is complete SPIRITUAL blindness and complete SPIRITUAL deafness.

You are simply confusing SPIRITUAL with NATURAL abilities. The Natural abilities can recognize light but always respond as Romans 8:7-8 and thus the NATURAL conscience is hardened with exposure to light.

Your position is totally founded upon confusing things that differ and Deuteronomy 29:4 drives a stake in the very heart of your whole position as does Ezek. 36:26-27.

Well, my friend this is my final message. Fare-thee-well!

You need to ban Dr. Walter's account as well. I have no other accounts and so when you do that your job will be finished.

 

[Skandelon]

Because you are confusing SPIRITUAL inability that comes only with a new heart as Deuteronomy 29:4 explicitly states with NATURAL ability of conscience to recognize light which the fleshly mind reacts by hardening as John 3:19-20 and Romans 8:7-8 clearly demonstrates.

Again you read something into the text that simply does not exist. We agree that Israel at this time had GROWN CALLOUSED, they had 'BECOME HARDENED.' You assume that 'becoming hardened' is inevitable to everyone because they are born 'totally hardened.'

Because, what is hardening if not being unable to see, hear, understand and repent? Scripture specifically says that had they not 'become calloused' they 'might see, hear, understand and turn.' It doesn't say they became hardened because that is inevitable even if God sends his Son to die on the cross, sends apostles, sends the gospel, the scriptures, the church, and his Spirit to bring conviction....none of that matters, their heart will inevitable become hardened without yet ANOTHER work of God that is irresistible (making all those other means seem meaningless).

WHY, WHY, WHY would scripture warn people not to allow their hearts to grow hardened if (1) we are born totally hardened and/or (2) its inevitable. And if they warning is for believers only, then explain how a regenerate heart can grow hard under your system?

Deuteromony 29:4 completely invalidates your whole position as it proves that PRIOR to being given the new heart there is complete SPIRITUAL blindness and complete SPIRITUAL deafness.

Context: You are ignoring the Audience.

You need to ban Dr. Walter's account as well. I have no other accounts and so when you do that your job will be finished.

As explained, it is against the rules to post under more than one account.

 

[Skandelon]

This needs to be addressed too:

You are simply confusing SPIRITUAL with NATURAL abilities. The Natural abilities can recognize light but always respond as Romans 8:7-8 and thus the NATURAL conscience is hardened with exposure to light.

That passage doesn't even come close to suggesting that the light of the gospel appeal inevitably leads to hardening apart from an irresistibly work of regeneration. You read that into that text.

Scripture specifically spells out the abilities and even the result of those abilities for those not yet hardened:

"For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.'For this people's heart has become calloused; they hardly hear with their ears, and they have closed their eyes. Otherwise they might see with their eyes, hear with their ears, understand with their hearts and turn, and I would heal them.'

Read the emboldened part above and it tells us EXACTLY what someone MIGHT be able to do had they not 'grown calloused.' And you would rebut by saying, "Oh, that is just the 'NATURAL' ability," but not only does that not make ANY SENSE because how does someone naturally see, hear, understand and turn if the Spirit isn't involved? And more significantly, why would he say, "I would heal them..." Since when does God heal those who are hearing, seeing understanding and repenting for show?

 

[Squire Robertsson]

As this thread now has over 200 posts, I am closing it.