The Russian people are trying to rebuild the iron curtain. They want Ukraine back in the Russian empire and that is the reason for the Russian military base in Ukraine.
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Drone sees Russian base in Ukraine
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poncho
Well-Known Member
Prove it. Everyone knows you can say it. Now prove what you keep saying.
poncho
Well-Known Member
The Mess that Nuland Made
July 13, 2015
Exclusive: Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland engineered Ukraine’s “regime change” in early 2014 without weighing the likely chaos and consequences. Now, as neo-Nazis turn their guns on the government, it’s hard to see how anyone can clean up the mess that Nuland made, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
As the Ukrainian army squares off against ultra-right and neo-Nazi militias in the west and violence against ethnic Russians continues in the east, the obvious folly of the Obama administration’s Ukraine policy has come into focus even for many who tried to ignore the facts, or what you might call “the mess that Victoria Nuland made.”
Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs “Toria” Nuland was the “mastermind” behind the Feb. 22, 2014 “regime change” in Ukraine, plotting the overthrow of the democratically elected government of President Viktor Yanukovych while convincing the ever-gullible U.S. mainstream media that the coup wasn’t really a coup but a victory for “democracy.”
To sell this latest neocon-driven “regime change” to the American people, the ugliness of the coup-makers had to be systematically airbrushed, particularly the key role of neo-Nazis and other ultra-nationalists from the Right Sektor. For the U.S.-organized propaganda campaign to work, the coup-makers had to wear white hats, not brown shirts.
So, for nearly a year and a half, the West’s mainstream media, especially The New York Times and The Washington Post, twisted their reporting into all kinds of contortions to avoid telling their readers that the new regime in Kiev was permeated by and dependent on neo-Nazi fighters and Ukrainian ultra-nationalists who wanted a pure-blood Ukraine, without ethnic Russians.
Any mention of that sordid reality was deemed “Russian propaganda” and anyone who spoke this inconvenient truth was a “stooge of Moscow.” It wasn’t until July 7 that the Times admitted the importance of the neo-Nazis and other ultra-nationalists in waging war against ethnic Russian rebels in the east. The Times also reported that these far-right forces had been joined by Islamic militants. Some of those jihadists have been called “brothers” of the hyper-brutal Islamic State.
Though the Times sought to spin this remarkable military alliance – neo-Nazi militias and Islamic jihadists – as a positive, the reality had to be jarring for readers who had bought into the Western propaganda about noble “pro-democracy” forces resisting evil “Russian aggression.”
Perhaps the Times sensed that it could no longer keep the lid on the troubling truth in Ukraine. For weeks, the Right Sektor militias and the neo-Nazi Azov battalion have been warning the civilian government in Kiev that they might turn on it and create a new order more to their liking.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/07/13/the-mess-that-nuland-made/
July 13, 2015
Exclusive: Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland engineered Ukraine’s “regime change” in early 2014 without weighing the likely chaos and consequences. Now, as neo-Nazis turn their guns on the government, it’s hard to see how anyone can clean up the mess that Nuland made, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
As the Ukrainian army squares off against ultra-right and neo-Nazi militias in the west and violence against ethnic Russians continues in the east, the obvious folly of the Obama administration’s Ukraine policy has come into focus even for many who tried to ignore the facts, or what you might call “the mess that Victoria Nuland made.”
Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs “Toria” Nuland was the “mastermind” behind the Feb. 22, 2014 “regime change” in Ukraine, plotting the overthrow of the democratically elected government of President Viktor Yanukovych while convincing the ever-gullible U.S. mainstream media that the coup wasn’t really a coup but a victory for “democracy.”
To sell this latest neocon-driven “regime change” to the American people, the ugliness of the coup-makers had to be systematically airbrushed, particularly the key role of neo-Nazis and other ultra-nationalists from the Right Sektor. For the U.S.-organized propaganda campaign to work, the coup-makers had to wear white hats, not brown shirts.
So, for nearly a year and a half, the West’s mainstream media, especially The New York Times and The Washington Post, twisted their reporting into all kinds of contortions to avoid telling their readers that the new regime in Kiev was permeated by and dependent on neo-Nazi fighters and Ukrainian ultra-nationalists who wanted a pure-blood Ukraine, without ethnic Russians.
Any mention of that sordid reality was deemed “Russian propaganda” and anyone who spoke this inconvenient truth was a “stooge of Moscow.” It wasn’t until July 7 that the Times admitted the importance of the neo-Nazis and other ultra-nationalists in waging war against ethnic Russian rebels in the east. The Times also reported that these far-right forces had been joined by Islamic militants. Some of those jihadists have been called “brothers” of the hyper-brutal Islamic State.
Though the Times sought to spin this remarkable military alliance – neo-Nazi militias and Islamic jihadists – as a positive, the reality had to be jarring for readers who had bought into the Western propaganda about noble “pro-democracy” forces resisting evil “Russian aggression.”
Perhaps the Times sensed that it could no longer keep the lid on the troubling truth in Ukraine. For weeks, the Right Sektor militias and the neo-Nazi Azov battalion have been warning the civilian government in Kiev that they might turn on it and create a new order more to their liking.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/07/13/the-mess-that-nuland-made/
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The Russian people do not care about human rights so they tolerate Putin, the richest murderer in the world.
poncho
Well-Known Member
A Family Business of Perpetual War
Exclusive: Victoria Nuland and Robert Kagan have a great mom-and-pop business going. From the State Department, she generates wars and – from op-ed pages – he demands Congress buy more weapons. There’s a pay-off, too, as grateful military contractors kick in money to think tanks where other Kagans work, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
Neoconservative pundit Robert Kagan and his wife, Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, run a remarkable family business: she has sparked a hot war in Ukraine and helped launch Cold War II with Russia – and he steps in to demand that Congress jack up military spending so America can meet these new security threats.
This extraordinary husband-and-wife duo makes quite a one-two punch for the Military-Industrial Complex, an inside-outside team that creates the need for more military spending, applies political pressure to ensure higher appropriations, and watches as thankful weapons manufacturers lavish grants on like-minded hawkish Washington think tanks.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/03/20/a-family-business-of-perpetual-war/
Exclusive: Victoria Nuland and Robert Kagan have a great mom-and-pop business going. From the State Department, she generates wars and – from op-ed pages – he demands Congress buy more weapons. There’s a pay-off, too, as grateful military contractors kick in money to think tanks where other Kagans work, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
Neoconservative pundit Robert Kagan and his wife, Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, run a remarkable family business: she has sparked a hot war in Ukraine and helped launch Cold War II with Russia – and he steps in to demand that Congress jack up military spending so America can meet these new security threats.
This extraordinary husband-and-wife duo makes quite a one-two punch for the Military-Industrial Complex, an inside-outside team that creates the need for more military spending, applies political pressure to ensure higher appropriations, and watches as thankful weapons manufacturers lavish grants on like-minded hawkish Washington think tanks.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/03/20/a-family-business-of-perpetual-war/
Off topic.
Russian television, available in the USA, does not tell the truth because it is censored by Putin, but some Russians know that there are Russian bases in the Ukraine because Russian soldiers have been shipped home dead from the Ukraine.
Russian television, available in the USA, does not tell the truth because it is censored by Putin, but some Russians know that there are Russian bases in the Ukraine because Russian soldiers have been shipped home dead from the Ukraine.
poncho
Well-Known Member
No it's on topic.
You just don't want to hear the truth about your war mongering neocon heros who have the blood of millions on their hands.
You're barking up the wrong tree Robert Parry doesn't work for Russian television.
Investigative reporter Robert Parry broke many of the Iran-Contra stories for The Associated Press and Newsweek in the 1980s
The Rush to a New Cold War
The U.S. government and news media have jumped back into Cold War attitudes since early 2014 when a U.S.-backed coup overthrew Ukraine’s elected president and prompted countermoves by Russia, setting the stage for a potential nuclear showdown, as journalist Robert Parry discussed with Dennis J. Bernstein.
By Dennis J. Bernstein
A new Cold War has taken shape between nuclear-armed Russia and the United States with very little public debate, just a return to hostile rhetoric and military moves and counter-moves over Ukraine, an issue that journalist Robert Parry has followed over the past year and a half.
Parry, a longtime Washington-based investigative reporter and editor of Consortiumnews.com, was interviewed about the crisis by Dennis J. Bernstein for Pacifica Radio’s Flashpoint program.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/19/the-rush-to-a-new-cold-war/
NYT’s Orwellian View of Ukraine
Exclusive: In the up-is-down Orwellian world that is now The New York Times’ editorial page, there was no coup in Ukraine in 2014, no U.S.-driven “regime change,” no provocation on Russia’s border, just Moscow’s aggression — a sign of how propaganda has taken over mainstream U.S. media, writes Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
In George Orwell’s 1984, the leaders of Oceania presented “Two Minutes Hate” in which the image of an enemy was put on display and loyal Oceanianians expressed their rage, all the better to prepare them for the country’s endless wars and their own surrender of freedom. And, now, in America, you have The New York Times.
Surely the Times is a bit more subtle than the powers-that-be in Orwell’s Oceania, but the point is the same. The “paper of record” decides who our rotating foreign enemy is and depicts its leader as a demon corrupting whatever he touches. The rest of us aren’t supposed to think for ourselves.
We’re just supposed to hate.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/22/nyts-orwellian-view-of-ukraine/
You took the bait, the hook, the line and the sinker.
U.S. House Admits Nazi Role in Ukraine
Exclusive: The U.S. House of Representatives has admitted an ugly truth that the U.S. mainstream media has tried to hide from the American people – that the post-coup regime in Ukraine has relied heavily on Nazi storm troopers to carry out its bloody war against ethnic Russians, reports Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
Last February, when ethnic Russian rebels were closing in on the Ukrainian port of Mariupol, the New York Times rhapsodically described the heroes defending the city and indeed Western civilization – the courageous Azov battalion facing down barbarians at the gate. What the Times didn’t tell its readers was that these “heroes” were Nazis, some of them even wearing Swastikas and SS symbols.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/12/u-s-house-admits-nazi-role-in-ukraine/
WPost Plays Ukraine’s Lapdog
Exclusive: Ukraine’s Prime Minister Yatsenyuk and Finance Minister Jaresko are on a U.S. trip to drum up weapons and money to crush the ethnic Russian resistance in the east – and they are finding a lapdog U.S. press that won’t ask them tough questions, reports Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
There once was a time when the U.S. news media investigated U.S. imperial adventures overseas, such as Washington-sponsored coups. Journalists also asked tough questions to officials implicated in corruption even if those queries were inconvenient to the desired propaganda themes. But those days are long gone, as the Washington Post demonstrated again this week.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/11/wpost-plays-ukraines-lapdog/
Neocon Fugitive Given Ukraine Province
Exclusive: Ukraine’s President Poroshenko has tapped another international “carpetbagger” to rule his people, ex-Georgian President Saakashvili, a neocon hero wanted in his homeland for embezzlement and human rights abuses who now governs Odessa, reports Robert Parry.
By Robert Parry
The latest political move by the U.S.-backed “pro-democracy” regime in Ukraine was to foist on the people of Odessa the autocratic Georgian ex-President Mikheil Saakashvili, a neoconservative favorite and currently a fugitive from his own country which is seeking him on charges of human rights violations and embezzlement.
New York Times correspondent David M. Herszenhorn justified this imposition of a newly minted Ukrainian citizen on the largely Russian-speaking population of Odessa by saying that “the Ukrainian public’s general willingness to accept the appointment of foreigners to high-level positions underscores the deep lack of trust in any government after nearly a quarter-century of mismanagement and corruption.”
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/02/neocon-fugitive-given-ukraine-province/
DB: You have previously said the U.S. played an active role in this “coup.”
RP: There’s no question. The U.S. was supporting, through the National Endowment for Democracy, scores of political organizations that were working to overthrow the elected government. There were other U.S. entities, like USAID, as well as members of the U.S. government. Sen. John McCain went to Kiev, spoke to this very right-wing group, and said the U.S. supports you and what you are doing.
Then there was the famous phone conversation that was intercepted between Assistant Secretary of State Nuland and Ambassador Jeffrey Pyatt where they discussed who was going to take over after the change of power. Nuland put forward that Yatsenyuk “is the guy,” who after the coup became the prime minister. There were all the markings of a coup d’état. More neutral observers, who have looked at this, including the head of the Stratfor think tank (George Friedman), have called it the most obvious coup he’s ever seen.
That was the reality, but the U.S. news media and U.S. government chose to present it in a very different way. The Yanukovych government just left the scene, or something, is how the New York Times presented it. That wasn’t real, but that’s how they sold it to the American people.
https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/19/the-rush-to-a-new-cold-war/
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poncho
Well-Known Member
Explaining the Ukraine Crisis
June 16, 2015
Spurred on by neocons and liberal war hawks, the Obama administration lurches toward a dangerous escalation of tensions with nuclear-armed Russia, while the American people are again fed a steady diet of propaganda – that is challenged by a new book on the Ukraine crisis, reviewed by David Swanson.
By David Swanson
I’m not sure if there’s been a better written book published yet this year than Ukraine: Zbig’s Grand Chessboard and How the West Was Checkmated, but I’m confident there’s not been a more important one. With some 17,000 nuclear bombs in the world, the United States and Russia have about 16,000 of them. The United States is aggressively flirting with World War III, the people of the United States have not the foggiest notion of how or why, and authors Natylie Baldwin and Kermit Heartsong explain it all quite clearly. Go ahead and tell me there’s nothing you’re now spending your time on that’s less important than this.
< snip >
The Orange Revolution in Ukraine in 2004, the Rose Revolution in Georgia in 2003, and Ukraine II in 2013-2014 are recounted well, including detailed chronology. It’s truly remarkable how much has been publicly reported that remains buried.
Western leaders met repeatedly in 2012 and 2013 to plot the fate of Ukraine. Neo-Nazis from Ukraine were sent to Poland to train for a coup. NGOs operating out of the U.S. Embassy in Kiev organized trainings for coup participants. On Nov. 24, 2013, three days after Ukraine refused an IMF deal, including refusing to sever ties to Russia, protesters in Kiev began to clash with police.
The protesters used violence, destroying buildings and monuments, and tossing Molotov cocktails, but President Obama warned the Ukrainian government not to respond with force. (Contrast that with the treatment of the Occupy movement, or the shooting on Capitol Hill of the woman who made an unacceptable U-turn in her car with her baby.)
U.S.-funded groups organized a Ukrainian opposition, funded a new TV channel, and promoted regime change. The U.S. State Department spent some $5 billion. U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, who handpicked the new leaders, openly brought cookies to protesters. When those protesters violently overthrew the government in February 2014, the United States immediately declared the coup government legitimate.
That new government banned major political parties, and attacked, tortured, and murdered their members. The new government included neo-Nazis and would soon include officials imported from the United States. The new government banned the Russian language — the first language of many Ukrainian citizens. Russian war memorials were destroyed. Russian-speaking populations were attacked and murdered.
Crimea, an autonomous region of Ukraine, had its own parliament, had been part of Russia from 1783 until 1954, had publicly voted for close ties to Russia in 1991, 1994, and 2008, and its parliament had voted to rejoin Russia in 2008. On March 16, 2014, 82 percent of Crimeans took part in a referendum, and 96 percent of them voted to rejoin Russia. This nonviolent, bloodless, democratic and legal action, in no violation of a Ukrainian constitution that had been shredded by a violent coup, was immediately denounced in the West as a Russian “invasion” of Crimea.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/16/explaining-the-ukraine-crisis/
June 16, 2015
Spurred on by neocons and liberal war hawks, the Obama administration lurches toward a dangerous escalation of tensions with nuclear-armed Russia, while the American people are again fed a steady diet of propaganda – that is challenged by a new book on the Ukraine crisis, reviewed by David Swanson.
By David Swanson
I’m not sure if there’s been a better written book published yet this year than Ukraine: Zbig’s Grand Chessboard and How the West Was Checkmated, but I’m confident there’s not been a more important one. With some 17,000 nuclear bombs in the world, the United States and Russia have about 16,000 of them. The United States is aggressively flirting with World War III, the people of the United States have not the foggiest notion of how or why, and authors Natylie Baldwin and Kermit Heartsong explain it all quite clearly. Go ahead and tell me there’s nothing you’re now spending your time on that’s less important than this.
< snip >
The Orange Revolution in Ukraine in 2004, the Rose Revolution in Georgia in 2003, and Ukraine II in 2013-2014 are recounted well, including detailed chronology. It’s truly remarkable how much has been publicly reported that remains buried.
Western leaders met repeatedly in 2012 and 2013 to plot the fate of Ukraine. Neo-Nazis from Ukraine were sent to Poland to train for a coup. NGOs operating out of the U.S. Embassy in Kiev organized trainings for coup participants. On Nov. 24, 2013, three days after Ukraine refused an IMF deal, including refusing to sever ties to Russia, protesters in Kiev began to clash with police.
The protesters used violence, destroying buildings and monuments, and tossing Molotov cocktails, but President Obama warned the Ukrainian government not to respond with force. (Contrast that with the treatment of the Occupy movement, or the shooting on Capitol Hill of the woman who made an unacceptable U-turn in her car with her baby.)
U.S.-funded groups organized a Ukrainian opposition, funded a new TV channel, and promoted regime change. The U.S. State Department spent some $5 billion. U.S. Assistant Secretary of State Victoria Nuland, who handpicked the new leaders, openly brought cookies to protesters. When those protesters violently overthrew the government in February 2014, the United States immediately declared the coup government legitimate.
That new government banned major political parties, and attacked, tortured, and murdered their members. The new government included neo-Nazis and would soon include officials imported from the United States. The new government banned the Russian language — the first language of many Ukrainian citizens. Russian war memorials were destroyed. Russian-speaking populations were attacked and murdered.
Crimea, an autonomous region of Ukraine, had its own parliament, had been part of Russia from 1783 until 1954, had publicly voted for close ties to Russia in 1991, 1994, and 2008, and its parliament had voted to rejoin Russia in 2008. On March 16, 2014, 82 percent of Crimeans took part in a referendum, and 96 percent of them voted to rejoin Russia. This nonviolent, bloodless, democratic and legal action, in no violation of a Ukrainian constitution that had been shredded by a violent coup, was immediately denounced in the West as a Russian “invasion” of Crimea.
Continue . . . https://consortiumnews.com/2015/06/16/explaining-the-ukraine-crisis/
The Democrats are in power and they support Putin as 21st century, so your complaints about the GOP are off topic.
You cannot explain the video of the drone about the Russian equipment at the base in the Ukraine. If fact, you never have even addressed the topic of the Russian Ukraine base and the deaths of Russian soldiers in the Ukraine.
The Russian people may think that Ukraine is Russia, but Ukraine thinks that Ukraine in Ukraine.
The Russians are guilty of crimes against humanity and are murdering people at Putin's whim.
You cannot explain the video of the drone about the Russian equipment at the base in the Ukraine. If fact, you never have even addressed the topic of the Russian Ukraine base and the deaths of Russian soldiers in the Ukraine.
The Russian people may think that Ukraine is Russia, but Ukraine thinks that Ukraine in Ukraine.
The Russians are guilty of crimes against humanity and are murdering people at Putin's whim.
poncho
Well-Known Member
You wish.
I have addressed it. You can't verify any of it. You don't have any idea who made the video, where it was made or when it was made. All you have is the word of people that have been making allegations that have panned out to be bunk time and time again.
Just like you have done for the last year and a half.
What don't you understand about the top Ukrainian general admitting he is not fighting the Russian military?
The Russian people think that the US has instigated a violent coup and civil war on their border and they are correct and there is plenty of evidence that proves it.
You have never proven this. You keep saying it but you never provide any proof.
Washington DC, the neocons and the corporate media on the other hand are guilty of crimes against humanity. The evidence is manifest.
But you don't seem concerned about that at all. Evidently "human rights" to you is nothing more than a "rallying cry" to kill and displace even more people in foreign lands.
Let's look at the record of your neocon heros . . .
Iraq, hundreds of thousands dead, millions displaced including Christians thanks to your paranoid war mongering neocon heros, Libya, thousands dead and displaced including Christians thanks to your paranoid war mongering neocon heros, Syria, thousands dead and displaced including Christians thanks to your paranoid war mongering neocon heros.
Ukraine, thousands dead and displaced and more all the time, as if it weren't bad enough that Washington has been supporting some of the worst human rights violators in the form of neo nazis now those neo nazis have teamed up with Muslim terrorists to continue the eradication of ethnic Russian Ukrainians.
You stand on the top an ever increasing mountain of dead bodies that your neocon heros keep piling up and accuse others of committing human rights violations.
You're either a propagandist working for George Soros or you are a willfully blind paranoid hypocrite that only pretends to care about human rights to build a case to kill and displace even more people than your paranoid war mongering neocon heros already have and they number in the millions now and include your own brothers and sisters in Christ.
No, CMG you are never going to convince me that you give a hoot about human rights. Not while you continue to support people that already have the blood of millions on their hands and are always screaming for more war, more blood, more destruction, more death, more chaos, more displaced people.
Europeans are defending themselves against Right Sector
Ukraine is already being called the «Kosovo of Eastern Europe», and, like the Albanians who preceded them, Ukrainians could become another headache for Europe. The Europeans have no wish to see Islamism and Ukrainian nationalism comingling within their borders, so European countries will take measures to tighten immigration restrictions on citizens of Ukraine.
The first signs are already visible. The Western press has finally begun openly referring to Ukrainian nationalist organizations as «fascists.» And there will certainly be more to come.
http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/07/20/europeans-defending-themselves-against-right-sector.html
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Over the top. The guilt of the Russian people and their complicity with the crimes against humanity by their nation is apparent to even a casual observer. The Russians should root for Hillary, who is every bit as weak as Obama and will continue to give the Russians free rein for their death spree. The Russian people know only despotism.
Ukraine is of no concern to the Russian people who only seek a spoil. Stalin starved hundreds of thousands in the Ukraine and Ukraine hates Russians, as do many others who remember the crimes of the Russian people.
Ukraine is of no concern to the Russian people who only seek a spoil. Stalin starved hundreds of thousands in the Ukraine and Ukraine hates Russians, as do many others who remember the crimes of the Russian people.
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poncho
Well-Known Member
In the past yes. You seem to think the past and present are the same yet you have not proven this to be true. You accuse the Russians of having an "expansionist" policy today.
Where's the proof?
You accuse the Russians of having a policy of "aggression" before the US instigated the violent coup that you absolutely refuse to talk about.
Where's the proof?
You're one of Hillary's champions in all this, you side with Obama who thought he could bully Russia into bowing to Washington by making unfounded allegations and placing sanctions on them.
It ain't working.
You side with Soros who played a big role in instigating the violent coup that you absolutely refuse to talk about.
So what? How does that excuse your irrational fear and hatred?
Ah but if the shoe were on the other foot and English speaking people were being "eradicated" by neo nazis you'd be jumping up and down demanding the USA send in the marines to kill every last neo nazi if need be to rescue all the English speaking people.
You believe Washington has every right in the world to protect it's people from aggression as do I, the difference is you think that ONLY Washington has the right to protect it's own people.
Russia does not have that right according to you. If the Russians do what you expect and demand the USA do to help and or protect it's people you call it "aggression". That is hypocrisy writ large CMG.
Stalin is dead, the USSR no longer exists. The past is not the present.
The present has you supporting the mass murder of people in the middle east and north Africa and the eradication of Russian speaking Ukrainians by "ultra nationalists" that murder those who speak Russian and would vote against them if fair elections were held while accusing Washington DC's latest "regime change" victims of being mass murderers.
Again that is hypocrisy writ large. My assessment of your continued support of people who have the blood of millions on their hands isn't "over the top".
It's accurate. The numbers don't lie. Your paranoid war mongering heros are responsible for the deaths of millions.
Like I said, your concern for "human rights" is hollow. If you truly cared about "human rights" you wouldn't be defending people that have denied "human rights" to millions of people through endless military interventions, violent staged coups, regime changes and supporting neo fascists and Islamic terrorists that chop the heads off your own brothers and sister in Christ.
You're concern for "human rights" is as phony as your neocon hero's never ending excuses for killing more people and causing more chaos in the mid east, north Africa and Europe.
It is not Russia nor China that maintain troops in 150 countries around the world. That dubious distinction falls on the United States. Fighting Joe Dunford and General Breedlove can talk all they want about the Russian and Chinese «threat». But for the rest of the world, which sees SCO and BRICS as welcome foils to the plans for further NATO expansion, it is America and its policy of fostering «color revolutions» and displaying military shows of force that represent the true threats to global stability.
http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/07/15/countering-the-neo-cold-warriors.html
Nuland’s Mastery of Ukraine Propaganda
An early skill learned by Official Washington’s neoconservatives, when they were cutting their teeth inside the U.S. government in the 1980s, was how to frame their arguments in the most propagandistic way, so anyone who dared to disagree with any aspect of the presentation seemed unpatriotic or crazy.
During my years at The Associated Press and Newsweek, I dealt with a number of now prominent neocons who were just starting out and mastering these techniques at the knee of top CIA psychological warfare specialist Walter Raymond Jr., who had been transferred to President Ronald Reagan’s National Security Council staff where Raymond oversaw inter-agency task forces that pushed Reagan’s hard-line agenda in Central America and elsewhere. [See Consortiumnews.com’s “The Victory of ‘Perception Management.’”]
Assistant Secretary of State for European Affairs Victoria Nuland, who pushed for the Ukraine coup and helped pick the post-coup leaders.
One of those quick learners was Robert Kagan, who was then a protégé of Assistant Secretary of State Elliott Abrams. Kagan got his first big chance when he became director of the State Department’s public diplomacy office for Latin America, a key outlet for Raymond’s propaganda schemes.
Though always personable in his dealings with me, Kagan grew frustrated when I wouldn’t swallow the propaganda that I was being fed. At one point, Kagan warned me that I might have to be “controversialized,” i.e. targeted for public attack by Reagan’s right-wing media allies and anti-journalism attack groups, like Accuracy in Media, a process that did indeed occur.
Years later, Kagan emerged as one of America’s top neocons, a co-founder of the Project for the New American Century, which opened in 1998 to advocate for the U.S. invasion of Iraq, ultimately gaining the backing of a large swath of the U.S. national security establishment in support of that bloody endeavor.
Continue . . . http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/03/13/nuland-mastery-ukraine-propaganda.html
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The Russians have no business in Ukraine and they are only there to steal and murder.
poncho
Well-Known Member
You have it backwards CMG.
It's the Washington backed Ukrainian coup regime that's doing the stealing and murdering. The Russians aren't killing the ethnic Russian Ukrainians.
The Ukrainian coup government and their pet neo nazis are the ones doing all the killing.
Washington had no business overthrowing an elected government and starting a civil war. No matter how "noble" their big lies appear to be. The neocon spirits of fear and hatred you keep channeling are responsible for the death and destruction in Ukraine not Russia. I urge you to be careful, the spirits (fear and hatred) you are channeling are not of God.
Why do you always avoid discussing the Washington backed coup that preceded the Crimean referendum?
Every time I bring it up you ignore it and go straight into your neocon fear and hate mongering routine. Look at this thread and the others you and I have butted heads in.
I try to put facts and evidence out there and you counter with more fear and hate mongering. That's all you got and that's sad. Tyrants need guys like you that buy into their lies and spread their fear and hatred for them.
You're fear mongering message of hate is no different in that regard than the liberals you're always complaining about who use the same fear mongering and message of hate to push their agenda.
http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?t=101009
I'd say Robert Parry has described you to a tee in the above paragraph.
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The Russians need to get out of the Ukraine and stay out of the Ukraine. The Russians do not own the Ukraine and the Russians only go to the Ukraine to plunder, rape and murder.
poncho
Well-Known Member
Another display of hypocrisy writ large? Getting to be quite the habit with you.
Ukraine is now owned by the same global banksters (IMF and World Bank) and transnational corporations that own the EU "member states".
How dare those Russians think they have a right to protect their own interests on their own borders? Only the USA and it's owners have the right to plunder, rape and murder other nations into submission.
Look what they're doing to Greece. It's the same game being played by the same people on Ukraine. Drive them into unsustainable debt, and force "bailout" loans they cannot repay on them in order to strip them of their assets when they can't pay them back.
Let's get back to the Washington backed coup that you are so fearful to talk about . . .Why Would Bloomberg News Completely Disappear the February, 2014 Ukraine Coup?
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2015/05/bloomberg-disappears-ukraine-coup.html
I would say for the same reason you are so careful to avoid discussing it. Acknowledging this bit of truth would derail you're whole hypocritical fear and hate mongering campaign.
http://www.strategic-culture.org/news/2015/03/13/nuland-mastery-ukraine-propaganda.html
Evidently you learned how to frame your one and only argument from the neocons, but who did they learn it from?
Hint . . .
http://www.snopes.com/quotes/goering.asp
Hundreds of Ukrainian right-wingers hold anti-government rally in Kiev; call for a referendum
KIEV, Ukraine (AP) — Hundreds of Ukrainian right-wingers were rallying in Kiev on Tuesday to protest against government policies in the wake of a deadly stand-off between radical nationalists and police in the country's west.
The radical Right Sector group was one of the most militant factions in the massive protests in Ukraine's capital that prompted pro-Russia President Viktor Yanukovych to flee the country in February 2014. Since the war broke out in eastern Ukraine between government forces and pro-Russia separatists several months later, the Right Sector has fought on the government side.
However, Right Sector militants keep running into disputes with local Ukrainian authorities and Amnesty International has accused the group of holding civilians as prisoners and torturing them. The activists claim they are trying to clamp down on corruption and nepotism but Ukrainian authorities accuse Right Sector of using violence to reach its goals.
Speaking Tuesday at the national Right Sector congress, group leader Dmytro Yarosh called for a referendum to impeach President Petro Poroshenko and his government.
http://www.usnews.com/news/world/articles/2015/07/21/hundreds-of-ukrainian-right-wingers-rally-against-kiev-govt
Looks like your side is upset with Poroshenko and Washington's coup government because they aren't murdering as many people as Yarosh thinks they should. Look like Ukraine might be heading for violent bloody coup 2.0
You should have tested the spirits before you climbed into bed with them.
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The Russian people do not belong in Ukraine.
poncho
Well-Known Member
Don't despair CMG your Bandera worshiping heros are doing their best to eradicate all the ethnic Russian Ukrainians living there but lack the funds to do it right even with Washington DC and the IMF's help.
The last time something like this was happening in Europe the national socialist party found that Zyklon B was more cost effective and efficient than tanks, artillery shells and bullets.
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The Russian people are the enemies of both the Ukraine and the United States.
poncho
Well-Known Member
I'm sure there's room for one more in the social nationalist party of Ukraine if you're interested in joining you could probably find a membership application online.
You might find it here . . . http://en.svoboda.org.ua/
To translate (while at the website) just right click, select "translate to English" and viola!
You might want to shave your head and get some evil looking skull and bones tattoos in order to look the part before joining.
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