Effeminacy

[Luke2427]

Besides the way a man dresses, can a man be effeminate?

In the way he talks or employs body motions or walks, etc...


I thought it was almost universally accepted that there is a huge difference in a regular man's walk, talk and movement and a very effeminate, e. g. Richard Simmons, person's walk and movement.

But it seems that there are those who think effeminacy has only to do with the way one dresses.

 

[JonC]

I always viewed it as taking on the feminine gender role. My dictionary lists it as “womanish, soft, weak, etc.” I’ve never thought of effeminate to be restricted to dress. But in the context of scripture, it seems to be more than unconscious mannerisms and as intentional (Richard Simmons pretty much sums up what I think when I think of the term).

 

[Luke2427]

I always viewed it as taking on the feminine gender role. My dictionary lists it as “womanish, soft, weak, etc.” I’ve never thought of effeminate to be restricted to dress. But in the context of scripture, it seems to be more than unconscious mannerisms and as intentional (Richard Simmons pretty much sums up what I think when I think of the term).

So do you think it can be easily distinguishable?

For example is there not a huge difference in the way Richard Simmons moves and talks and the way... say... John Wayne and Charleton Heston moved and talked?

I'm not saying everybody ought to move and talk like them, but I am saying that men ought to try very hard NOT to move and talk like Simmons.

 

[JonC]

So do you think it can be easily distinguishable?

For example is there not a huge difference in the way Richard Simmons moves and talks and the way... say... John Wayne and Charleton Heston moved and talked?

I'm not saying everybody ought to move and talk like them, but I am saying that men ought to try very hard NOT to move and talk like Simmons.

I’m not sure. I have seen many who are intentionally flamboyant and feminine - basically these men intentionally assume feminine traits. Here these were easily distinguishable as they appeared to be hyper drunk women. But I have known some Christian men (a couple of choir leaders among them) who had personalities and mannerisms that some would describe as feminine - so I don’t think you have to be a John Wayne personality.

Perhaps it is abandoning the male role and adopting a female role (as these roles are defined in Scripture… and this is going a direction which will get me in trouble but that’s for another thread). I will say that since 1 Cor 6:9-10 lists effeminate among idolaters, adulterers, fornicators, etc, I think that this is something intentional rather than a mere personality trait.

But, perhaps it a rejection of the male role. Although I disagree with the theology of “Wild at Heart” (John Eldredge) he did restate observations that I believe correct regarding the loss of male identity in our society. I really am not sure on this one.

 

[Winman]

Besides the way a man dresses, can a man be effeminate?

In the way he talks or employs body motions or walks, etc...


I thought it was almost universally accepted that there is a huge difference in a regular man's walk, talk and movement and a very effeminate, e. g. Richard Simmons, person's walk and movement.

But it seems that there are those who think effeminacy has only to do with the way one dresses.

Well of course men can act effeminate. These two fellas here made a comedy act out of this fact;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWdL9mrYNmQ

It's not just their clothes that gives the effect.

 

[Benjamin]

I'm not saying everybody ought to move and talk like them, but I am saying that men ought to try very hard NOT to move and talk like Simmons.

Sounds like an insecurity problem to me.


:laugh: j/k

 

[InTheLight]

Besides the way a man dresses, can a man be effeminate? In the way he talks or employs body motions or walks, etc...

I thought when you were mired in a deep hole you were supposed to stop digging....

 

[Skandelon]

I am saying that men ought to try very hard NOT to move and talk like Simmons.

Hmmm, good question...I wonder why God predetermined some men to act like that and didn't give the ability to choose to act more manly, like he determined you and John Wayne to act!?
:love2:

 

[saturneptune]

Hmmm, good question...I wonder why God predetermined some men to act like that and didn't give the ability to choose to act more manly, like he determined you and John Wayne to act!?
:love2:

It was their choice, don't you agree?

 

[Skandelon]

It was their choice, don't you agree?

I was poking fun with Luke and his deterministic views in light of this OP. I believe men actually have choices...available options from which to select. Luke believes all choices are determined by man's desire/nature which is determined by God to be such and could not be otherwise.

 

[Winman]

I was poking fun with Luke and his deterministic views in light of this OP. I believe men actually have choices...available options from which to select. Luke believes all choices are determined by man's desire/nature which is determined by God to be such and could not be otherwise.

How can man not have choice? The very word WILL cannot be defined outside of freedom of choice.

If we do not have choice, then we cannot have a will.

And men can invent their own choices;

Psa 106:29 Thus they provoked him to anger with their inventions: and the plague brake in upon them.

Psa 106:39 Thus were they defiled with their own works, and went a whoring with their own inventions.

Ecc 7:29 Lo, this only have I found, that God hath made man upright; but they have sought out many inventions.

Luke can say whatever he wants, the scriptures show man can invent his own evil desires and works.

 

[Aaron]

Besides the way a man dresses, can a man be effeminate?

In the way he talks or employs body motions or walks, etc...


I thought it was almost universally accepted that there is a huge difference in a regular man's walk, talk and movement and a very effeminate, e. g. Richard Simmons, person's walk and movement.

But it seems that there are those who think effeminacy has only to do with the way one dresses.

I always viewed it as taking on the feminine gender role. My dictionary lists it as “womanish, soft, weak, etc.” I’ve never thought of effeminate to be restricted to dress. But in the context of scripture, it seems to be more than unconscious mannerisms and as intentional (Richard Simmons pretty much sums up what I think when I think of the term).

Stay-at-home dads.

 

[JonC]

Stay-at-home dads.

Girly men. :smilewinkgrin:

 

[saturneptune]

Stay-at-home dads.

Why yes, Dads that stay at home to keep their family together represent part of the effeminate mindset. Instead of staying at home, what would you prefer they do, abandon their families? Makes sense to me.

 

[kyredneck]

Stay-at-home dads.

My role since retiring in 2004 is 'Family Gopher', whatever the younguns and wife needs me to do, I do or assist with (read go with the flow), and I absolutely love it; thank you LORD. I cook, do laundry, clean house, baby sit, grocery shop, etc., the roles are totally reversed between my wife and I, she works, I tend things at home and look after the needs of our (now grown and on their own) children and their children when called upon. A growing part of this duty is tending to the needs of my elderly soon to be 89 yr old Dad, cooking and tending to his needs around his home, etc.. Again, thank you LORD, iluvit.

If that's 'effeminate', then the naysayers can 'go jump in the lake'. Not a doubt in my mind, this is what I'm supposed to be doing.

 

[SolaSaint]

In my 27 years as a Christian I have noticed many of the preachers I have seen are effeminate. Many have to have their hair just right and dress just right. Some even have the feminine gestures and speech. Has anyone else witnessed this?

 

[Aaron]

My role since retiring in 2004 is 'Family Gopher', whatever the younguns and wife needs me to do, I do or assist with (read go with the flow), and I absolutely love it; thank you LORD. I cook, do laundry, clean house, baby sit, grocery shop, etc., the roles are totally reversed between my wife and I, she works, I tend things at home and look after the needs of our (now grown and on their own) children and their children when called upon. A growing part of this duty is tending to the needs of my elderly soon to be 89 yr old Dad, cooking and tending to his needs around his home, etc.. Again, thank you LORD, iluvit.

If that's 'effeminate', then the naysayers can 'go jump in the lake'. Not a doubt in my mind, this is what I'm supposed to be doing.

By stay-at-home-dad I'm referring to those who stay home to rear the children while the woman provides. If that is your case, then, yes. That is effeminacy.

 

[Amy.G]

In my 27 years as a Christian I have noticed many of the preachers I have seen are effeminate. Many have to have their hair just right and dress just right. Some even have the feminine gestures and speech. Has anyone else witnessed this?

Ummmm... no. Ewwww

 

[righteousdude2]

I think....GENETICS come into play somewhat......

....all of us have some effeminant characteristics from genetic chromosomes! After all, females have two of the same kind of sex chromosome (XX), and are called the homogametic sex. While males have two distinct sex chromosomes (XY), and are called the heterogametic sex. [from wikipedia link below]

Like it our not guys, while the female is the recipient of two XX chromosomes, us guys have one X and one Y! In fact, the sex of the fetus is not determined until somewhere between the fourteenth and twentieth week of gestation! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pregnancy)

That said, I would think that both sexes, will at times, demonstrate some minute tendencies and even roles of the other sex, and that makes for a better parent, and marital relationship!

As Paul taught the church in Ephesians 5:25-33 (NKJV),
"Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish. So husbands ought to love their own wives as their own bodies; he who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as the Lord does the church. For we are members of His body, of His flesh and of His bones. For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh. This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church. Nevertheless let each one of you in particular so love his own wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband."

I believe it would be rather difficult for a husband to treat his wife as himself without getting into her head and seeing himself as she sees him, through her eyes! This is why many women are abused....men fail to treat their spouse as they would want to be treated should the shoe, or high heels, be on the other foot!

As for the manner of dress, and the outward appearance, that is another argument, and I draw the line here! Unless, you are Scottish and have the cultural desire and need to wear a kilt! :laugh:
SEE:
http://www.webmd.com/a-to-z-guides/genetics-topic-overview

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XY_sex-determination_system

 

[saturneptune]

By stay-at-home-dad I'm referring to those who stay home to rear the children while the woman provides. If that is your case, then, yes. That is effeminacy.

So give us a list of characteristics that make you a true macho man. I certainly hope you do not braid your armpits.