Elevation of women in the church and in society

[Magnetic Poles]

This is quite possibly true, though I would not get into percentages.

The fact is, men who do this lead to feminist women.
Feminism and wimpy men lead to sodomy and lesbianism.
Those trends area a fact of history.
If any of your insist that feminism is desirable, then please expect the homosexuality that will follow.
Maybe not in your family, but in society as a whole.

What a bunch of baloney! You are spouting unsupported assertions, unless you can cite some statistically valid studies to support them.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Yet there does seem to be a correlation between domineering men who use religion as a weapon, and abused wives.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionandethics/week349/cover.html

 

[Magnetic Poles]

I also highly suggest reading
http://www.bgct.org/texasbaptists/Page.aspx?&pid=1463&srcid=1403

Galatians 3:28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.

 

[npetreley]

Yet there does seem to be a correlation between domineering men who use religion as a weapon, and abused wives.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionandethics/week349/cover.html

PBS blames abuse on religion? Wow, I didn't see that coming.

 

[Jonathan]

That would certainly be a hard bet to determine.

Do not misunderstand, I agree that men do exactly what you say. As far as the percentage of each in this day and age, hard to tell. The thread is on women though. you could start a thread on the men if you like and I will post there concerning that.

In my reading, the thread is on the threat to churches (and society) by folks abandoning their primary responsibilities in order to chase after personal ambitions. Whether it is men or women doing this is it a problem. In the Baptist world, however, this is a significantly greater problem (historically and presently) with men doing this than women. Sure, there is a relatively small left wing of the Baptist world where women pastors are advocated where such neglect of family is possible but in the majority, this is not the problem.

 

[Rufus_1611]

I seriously am thinking of sending CY a towel, since he is still so wet behind the ears! :laugh: I would hope the pup opens his eyes someday, but apparently, as seen in this thread, not all do, even with age. Somehow, despite his claims of being biblical, he violates biblical principle by presuming to lecture his elders. So much for following the Bible.

Then there's our "buddy" Rufus. Rufus' own words identify him for what he is, then gets mad when it is pointed out. He then accuses me of ad hominems, while he hurls them one after the other. Sad really.

Seriously, how many of these "he-man" misogynists would like to live under the rules they wish to impose on females. I'd wager none. As for their wives being happy, I bet if they were honest, the wives would tell a different story. If not, I have two words for you...Stockholm Syndrome. If you don't know what it is, look it up.

I don't know how any man could be happy lording over his life mate. I find it is more conducive to bonding with a woman who is intellectually able to share ideas, make me think, and to interact as full equals. Unfortunately, that is not what these guys are seeking, and let me tell you, they are missing out. I must be doing something right. Thirty-three years, grown children, and grandchildren later, we are going stronger than ever. I value my wife's opinions, and she, mine. I don't rule over her. We make decisions together. We are a team of equal parts.

As Lily Tomlin's character, Edith Ann would say..."And that's the truth!"

MP, sweetie, I ain't madatcha. I'm just pointing out that you don't have an argument and those who don't have arguments typically get louder and louder, use more and more name calling tactics and focus on the person rather than the subject matter. This is the result of being soul-led, rather than spirit-led which is something females are prone to. When you feel like you have an argument, present it. Maybe you could mix it up a little and throw in a scripture or two to make your case, rather than rejecting the scripture that is presented to you?

 

[Rufus_1611]

Yet there does seem to be a correlation between domineering men who use religion as a weapon, and abused wives.

http://www.pbs.org/wnet/religionandethics/week349/cover.html

Seriously, now we're wife beaters? Umm, that PBS documentary is going to a UCC short-haired, female "reverend", Marie Fortune, who is an out lesbian, for information on how men use religion as a weapon. Newsflash, lesbians don't like the Bible either and they sure don't like men who embrace their masculinity and lead their house. People who have been given up to a reprobate mind and turned the natural use into that which is unnatural should not be considered sources of wisdom on such matters. Here's an alternative resource for your world view, study this and you may find a better way and you might stop listening to lesbians for material to preach against God's model for leading the home.

 

[christianyouth]

I value my wife's opinions, and she, mine. I don't rule over her. We make decisions together. We are a team of equal parts.

As Lily Tomlin's character, Edith Ann would say..."And that's the truth!"

Eph 5:22 - "Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord."
Eph 5:23a - "For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church:"
Eph 5:24 - "Therefor, just as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands, in every thing."

1 Peter 3:1,2 - "Wives, likewise, be submissive to your own husbands, that even if some do not obey the word, they, without a word, may be won by the conduct of their wives, when they observe your chaste conduct accompanied by fear.
1 Peter 3:3 - "Do not let your adornment be merely outward-- arranging the hair, wearing gold, or putting on fine apparel-- rather let it be the hidden person of the heart, with the incorruptible beauty of a gentle and quiet spirit. Which is very prescious in the sight of God.
1 Peter 3:5 - "For in this manner, in former times, the holy women who trusted in God also adorned themselves, being submissive to their own husbands. As Sarah obeyed Abraham, calling him lord, whose daughters you are if you do good and are not afraid with any terror.


Men:
1 Peter 3:7a - "Husbands, likewise dwell with them with understanding, giving honor to the wife, as to the weaker vessel,"

Please, comment on those scriptures.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

MP, sweetie, I ain't madatcha. I'm just pointing out that you don't have an argument and those who don't have arguments typically get louder and louder, use more and more name calling tactics and focus on the person rather than the subject matter. This is the result of being soul-led, rather than spirit-led which is something females are prone to. When you feel like you have an argument, present it. Maybe you could mix it up a little and throw in a scripture or two to make your case, rather than rejecting the scripture that is presented to you?

Well Rufus, if you are coming on to me, I don't swing that way. :laugh:

Go back and look at the names that you have used, then pull the mote from your own eye. And if you have a logical neuron in that head, it's time you go back and reread the thread, since I have made logical arguments. The problem is not that I haven't made a logical argument...it's that you just don't like it, just as you don't like women.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Seriously, now we're wife beaters? Umm, that PBS documentary is going to a UCC short-haired, female "reverend", Marie Fortune, who is an out lesbian, for information on how men use religion as a weapon. Newsflash, lesbians don't like the Bible either and they sure don't like men who embrace their masculinity and lead their house. People who have been given up to a reprobate mind and turned the natural use into that which is unnatural should not be considered sources of wisdom on such matters. Here's an alternative resource for your world view, study this and you may find a better way and you might stop listening to lesbians for material to preach against God's model for leading the home.

I never accused you of being a wife beater. However, there is a correlation of abusive men using religion and the Bible to batter the women in their lives. That is a fact. I have seen many reports over the years of evil men using the same verses you guys cite, as a justification to abuse their wives. It does happen.

 

[Rufus_1611]

Well Rufus, if you are coming on to me, I don't swing that way. :laugh:

Go back and look at the names that you have used, then pull the mote from your own eye. And if you have a logical neuron in that head, it's time you go back and reread the thread, since I have made logical arguments. The problem is not that I haven't made a logical argument...it's that you just don't like it, just as you don't like women.

List 'em out MP. I have used "rebellious" and what else?

You're right, perhaps you've made a logical argument, the problem I have with it, is it's not a Biblical argument.

To state that I don't like women is just more foolishness. I love women, I wrestle against rebellious women and feminists like yourself.

 

[Cutter]

I seriously am thinking of sending CY a towel, since he is still so wet behind the ears! :laugh: I would hope the pup opens his eyes someday, but apparently, as seen in this thread, not all do, even with age. Somehow, despite his claims of being biblical, he violates biblical principle by presuming to lecture his elders. So much for following the Bible.

Job 32:6 And Elihu the son of Barachel the Buzite answered and said, I am young, and ye are very old; wherefore I was afraid, and durst not shew you mine opinion.
:7 I said, Days should speak, and multitude of years should teach wisdom.
:8 But there is a spirit in man: and the inspiration of the Almighty giveth them understanding.
:9 Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgment.
:10 Therefore I said, Hearken to me; I also will shew mine opinion.

I must be doing something right. Thirty-three years, grown children, and grandchildren later, we are going stronger than ever. I value my wife's opinions, and she, mine. I don't rule over her. We make decisions together. We are a team of equal parts

Cutter's history. Twenty-nine years, grown children, and grandchildren later, we are going stronger than ever. I value my wife's opinions, and she, mine. I don't rule over her. We make decisions together. We are a team of equal parts.

To God be the glory!

 

[Rufus_1611]

I never accused you of being a wife beater. However, there is a correlation of abusive men using religion and the Bible to batter the women in their lives. That is a fact. I have seen many reports over the years of evil men using the same verses you guys cite, as a justification to abuse their wives. It does happen.

That is a fact as presented by whom? GLAAD?

 

[Magnetic Poles]

You're right, perhaps you've made a logical argument, the problem I have with it, is it's not a Biblical argument.

I have made a Biblical argument also. Go back and read again.

But then, you don't really care. You pick and choose which parts you like, then misapply them. If you are a pure biblical literalist, do you take a son who is unruly to be stoned to death? Do you believe in killing those who don't worship your God? Why not go all the way with what the Bible says to do, rather than just support the sections that you think support your bigotry against women?

 

[Rufus_1611]

I have made a Biblical argument also. Go back and read again.

But then, you don't really care. You pick and choose which parts you like, then misapply them. If you are a pure biblical literalist, do you take a son who is unruly to be stoned to death? Do you believe in killing those who don't worship your God? Why not go all the way with what the Bible says to do, rather than just support the sections that you think support your bigotry against women?

The New Testament addresses the matters you presented, so no I'm not going to stone my son, and I'm not going to kill the heathen etc. The New Testament also provides instructions for gender roles within a Biblical household so whether it is in the beginning of the book with Genesis 2:18 to the back of the book with Titus 2:5, there is Biblical instruction throughout for God's order in this matter and it changes not throughout the entire book.

"But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God." - 1 Corinthians 11:3

"Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord." - Ephesians 5:22

"Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord." - Colossians 3:18

"To be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed." - Titus 2:5

"For a man indeed ought not to cover his head, forasmuch as he is the image and glory of God: but the woman is the glory of the man." - 1 Corinthians 11:7

"For the man is not of the woman: but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man." - 1 Corinthians 11:8-9​

"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. " - 2 Timothy 2:11-14​

 

[Magnetic Poles]

The New Testament addresses the matters you presented, so no I'm not going to stone my son, and I'm not going to kill the heathen etc.

So you reject the OT? Like I said, pick & choose!

 

[Rufus_1611]

So you reject the OT? Like I said, pick & choose!

It's quite evident that we can not reason together. I'm done, grace and peace to ya.

 

[ccrobinson]

To state that I don't like women is just more foolishness. I love women, I wrestle against rebellious women and feminists like yourself.

Uh, Rufus? MP is a man.

And, I'm sure you love women, as long as they stay in their place.

And, if you don't think men beat their wives and use Bible verses about submission as their justification, then you're just plain deluded.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

It's quite evident that we can not reason together.

I have been thinking the same thing.

 

[Magnetic Poles]

Uh, Rufus? MP is a man.

And, I'm sure you love women, as long as they stay in their place.

And, if you don't think men beat their wives and use Bible verses about submission as their justification, then you're just plain deluded.

Indeed they do, CC. In fact, when I was a news reporter, I covered several sad stories of just such abuse, and have read many more.

You know, if one were to take this thread and do a search and replace of the word "women" with "men" or "blacks", perhaps the bigotry would jump out at these guys. The fact is that, sadly, in some baptist circles, it is still acceptable to keep women 2nd class. In fact, one poster here calls for the "subjugation" of wives. His word. Heartbreaking really.