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ESV 2025 - Change notes

Saved421

Saved421

Member
Update:

Most of the changes are just grammatical changes, footnotes.

The rest are minor and the verse numbering is going back to the same as the A.V.

Nothing too exciting...

Nice they added back some words, time will tell.

Shawn
 
Deacon

Deacon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Long overdue!


Genesis 3:16b (ESV 2016)
j Your desire shall be contrary to6 your husband, but he shall k rule over you.”
j ch. 4:7; Song 7:10
6 Or shall be toward (see 4:7)
k 1 Cor. 11:3; 14:34; Eph. 5:22–24; Col. 3:18; 1 Tim. 2:11, 12; Titus 2:5; 1 Pet. 3:1, 5, 6

~~~~~~~~~~~
Genesis 3:16 (ESV 2025)
Your desire shall be for1 your husband, and he shall rule over you.”
1 Or to, or toward, or against (see 4:7)

Dr. Wayne Grudem was on the Translator's Committee of the ESV 2016.
Known for his excellent Systematic Theology text, Dr. Grudem has been known for taking a strong stance on a number of theological issues.
Some of his theological positions affect the translation of the ESV 2016; the subordination of women is one of them.

I think the translation of this passage in the ESV 2016 is weak.
I believe that the ESV's 2016 translation of Genesis 3:16 was a reaction to its use by modern feminist theologians in supporting a woman's place in the church.

I've worked through how the 2016 translators came to their conclusion; there is a remote the possibility that the verse has been misunderstood,
however, such possibilities should be noted in a footnote.

The ESV 2025 update is a needed correction.
Biblical texts should be used to support theological positions; theological positions should not be used to alter the biblical text.

Rob
 
Saved421

Saved421

Member
Deacon said:
Long overdue!


Genesis 3:16b (ESV 2016)
j Your desire shall be contrary to6 your husband, but he shall k rule over you.”
j ch. 4:7; Song 7:10
6 Or shall be toward (see 4:7)
k 1 Cor. 11:3; 14:34; Eph. 5:22–24; Col. 3:18; 1 Tim. 2:11, 12; Titus 2:5; 1 Pet. 3:1, 5, 6

~~~~~~~~~~~
Genesis 3:16 (ESV 2025)
Your desire shall be for1 your husband, and he shall rule over you.”
1 Or to, or toward, or against (see 4:7)

Dr. Wayne Grudem was on the Translator's Committee of the ESV 2016.
Known for his excellent Systematic Theology text, Dr. Grudem has been known for taking a strong stance on a number of theological issues.
Some of his theological positions affect the translation of the ESV 2016; the subordination of women is one of them.

I think the translation of this passage in the ESV 2016 is weak.
I believe that the ESV's 2016 translation of Genesis 3:16 was a reaction to its use by modern feminist theologians in supporting a woman's place in the church.

I've worked through how the 2016 translators came to their conclusion; there is a remote the possibility that the verse has been misunderstood,
however, such possibilities should be noted in a footnote.

The ESV 2025 update is a needed correction.
Biblical texts should be used to support theological positions; theological positions should not be used to alter the biblical text.

Rob
Click to expand...
Yes I agree.
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
When I saw they had fixed the mistranslation of Revelation 13:8, it brought a smile to my face.

With regard to John 1:18, I prefer "...God, the unique one, who is in..."
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
The ESV was based on the RSV, and did not incorporate many of the fixes corrected by the NRSV. Such a shame.
 
J

JesusFan

Well-Known Member
Van said:
I doubt Jesus Fan knew the NRSV corrected the mistranslation of Rev 13:8 years ago.
Click to expand...
Did you know though it was mistranslated in order to try to use scriptura to indicate gender neutrality, blending of roles in church and society and family? And to water down alternative lifestyles as being sin?
 
V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
RSV
But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

ESV
But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

NRSV
But we must always give thanks to God for you, brothers and sisters beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the first fruits for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and through belief in the truth.

Both the RSV and ESV change the noun in the inspired text to a verb to mistranslate the text. The NRSV is faithful to the inspired text grammatically. Name calling a version (feminist agenda based) for engaging in a well accepted translation choice is without merit.

All three versions certainly have their faults, but to think the NRSV is worse than the RSV is laughable nonsense. The recent change to the ESV incorporated the NRSV correction of Revelation 13:8.
 
J

JesusFan

Well-Known Member
Van said:
RSV
But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

ESV
But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

NRSV
But we must always give thanks to God for you, brothers and sisters beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the first fruits for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and through belief in the truth.

Both the RSV and ESV change the noun in the inspired text to a verb to mistranslate the text. The NRSV is faithful to the inspired text grammatically. Name calling a version (feminist agenda based) for engaging in a well accepted translation choice is without merit.

All three versions certainly have their faults, but to think the NRSV is worse than the RSV is laughable nonsense. The recent change to the ESV incorporated the NRSV correction of Revelation 13:8.
Click to expand...
Nrsv bowed down to Feminist Christianity, and to water down explicate gender roles and watered down prohibitions about alternate lifestyles
 
J

JesusFan

Well-Known Member
Van said:
RSV
But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved by the Lord, because God chose you from the beginning to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

ESV
But we ought always to give thanks to God for you, brothers beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the firstfruits to be saved, through sanctification by the Spirit and belief in the truth.

NRSV
But we must always give thanks to God for you, brothers and sisters beloved by the Lord, because God chose you as the first fruits for salvation through sanctification by the Spirit and through belief in the truth.

Both the RSV and ESV change the noun in the inspired text to a verb to mistranslate the text. The NRSV is faithful to the inspired text grammatically. Name calling a version (feminist agenda based) for engaging in a well accepted translation choice is without merit.

All three versions certainly have their faults, but to think the NRSV is worse than the RSV is laughable nonsense. The recent change to the ESV incorporated the NRSV correction of Revelation 13:8.
Click to expand...
Even your beloved Nrsv got it here that its due to working of and by the Holy Spirit and then faith. Regenerated unto faith into Christ
 
37818

37818

Well-Known Member
ESV, Exodus 12:40, The time that the people of Israel lived in Egypt was 430 years.

Is not the correct reading, per Galatians 3:16-17, Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, And to seeds, as of many; but as of one, And to thy seed, which is Christ. And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

From the promise given to Abraham to the giving of the Law to Moses was 430 years.

The corrected verse,
Exodus 12:40, And the dwelling of the sons of Israel, which they dwelt in the land of Egypt, and in the land of Canaan, they and   their fathers -- four hundred thirty years.
 
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V

Van

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
JesusFan said:
Even your beloved Nrsv got it here that its due to working of and by the Holy Spirit and then faith. Regenerated unto faith into Christ
Click to expand...
Did I say I "love" the NRSV? Nope so an out and out falsehood by the fount of falsehoods.

Then through sanctification and faith is said to mean sanctification comes before faith. I cannot believe anyone could make such a nonsensical claim, but their you have it.

We were chosen for salvation by the Spirit setting apart our human spirit, based on God crediting our faith as righteousness. Folks, Read Romans Chapter 4!!
 
Deacon

Deacon

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Many of the changes are either simply formatting changes or cosmetic changes of no particular consequence.

1: Exodus 34:22 - changing “LORD God” (2016) to “Lord GOD” (2025) in Exodus 34:23

Exodus 34:22 (BHS)
23 שָׁלֹשׁ פְּעָמִים בַּשָּׁנָה יֵרָאֶה כָּל־זְכוּרְךָ אֶת־פְּנֵי הָאָדֹן יְהוָה אֱלֹהֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל׃

Note: There is no capitalization in Biblical Hebrew.

Translation Comparisons:
AV ————————“Lord GOD”
ESV 2016 —————“LORD God”
ESV 2025 —————“Lord GOD”
NASB 2020 ————“Lord GOD”
NRSV/+ue ————-“LORD God”
NIV ———————“Sovereign LORD”
NLT ——————-“Sovereign, the LORD”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

2: Words with similar sounds (correcting formatting to emphasize alliteration)

Joshua 6:26 (BHS)
26 וַיַּשְׁבַּע יְהוֹשֻׁעַ בָּעֵת הַהִיא לֵאמֹר אָרוּר הָאִישׁ לִפְנֵי יְהוָה אֲשֶׁר יָקוּם וּבָנָה אֶת־הָעִיר הַזֹּאת אֶת־יְרִיחוֹ בִּבְכֹרוֹ יְיַסְּדֶנָּה וּבִצְעִירוֹ יַצִּיב דְּלָתֶיהָ׃

He will lay its foundation; ye-sod-enah
He will set its gates: y'tziv delet-ah
(it tough to transliterate with auto-correct!)

Everett Fox (2014) - Joshua 6:26b
with his firstborn he will found it,
and with his youngest he will set up its doors.
 
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Saved421

Saved421

Member
Deacon said:
Many of the changes are either simply formatting changes or cosmetic changes of no particular consequence.

1: Exodus 34:22 - changing “LORD God” (2016) to “Lord GOD” (2025) in Exodus 34:23

Exodus 34:22 (BHS)
23 שָׁלֹשׁ פְּעָמִים בַּשָּׁנָה יֵרָאֶה כָּל־זְכוּרְךָ אֶת־פְּנֵי הָאָדֹן יְהוָה אֱלֹהֵי יִשְׂרָאֵל׃

Note: There is no capitalization in Biblical Hebrew.

Translation Comparisons:
AV ————————“Lord GOD”
ESV 2016 —————“LORD God”
ESV 2025 —————“Lord GOD”
NASB 2020 ————“Lord GOD”
NRSV/+ue ————-“LORD God”
NIV ———————“Sovereign LORD”
NLT ——————-“Sovereign, the LORD”

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

2: Words with similar sounds (correcting formatting to emphasize alliteration)

Joshua 6:26 (BHS)
26 וַיַּשְׁבַּע יְהוֹשֻׁעַ בָּעֵת הַהִיא לֵאמֹר אָרוּר הָאִישׁ לִפְנֵי יְהוָה אֲשֶׁר יָקוּם וּבָנָה אֶת־הָעִיר הַזֹּאת אֶת־יְרִיחוֹ בִּבְכֹרוֹ יְיַסְּדֶנָּה וּבִצְעִירוֹ יַצִּיב דְּלָתֶיהָ׃

He will lay its foundation; ye-sod-enah
He will set its gates: y'tziv delet-ah
(it tough to transliterate with auto-correct!)

Everett Fox (2014) - Joshua 6:26b
with his firstborn he will found it,
and with his youngest he will set up its doors.
Click to expand...
Dear Deacon,

Thanks for sharing, I do have to admit the ESV is correct here as the word translated is indeed Lord not LORD as LORD = Jehovah.

The Lord is Adonai which is how the ESV is translating it and other versions.

Regarding Ex 12:40: the text saith they were sourjourning for 430 years, including Egypt, from the time of Abraham leaving his kindred to the Exodus.

Thanks,

Take care,

'Shawn
 
Saved421

Saved421

Member
Saved421 said:
Dear Deacon,

Thanks for sharing, I do have to admit the ESV is correct here as the word translated is indeed Lord not LORD as LORD = Jehovah.

The Lord is Adonai which is how the ESV is translating it and other versions.

Regarding Ex 12:40: the text saith they were sourjourning for 430 years, including Egypt, from the time of Abraham leaving his kindred to the Exodus.

Thanks,

Take care,

'Shawn
Click to expand...
Correction:

Shouldn't have doubted, read the word, confirmed by God in Christ (refer to Gen 46; Psalm 105:10.)

God confirmed the law to Jacob and said, go to Egypt and then his children would dwell in Egypt for 430 years.

Alleuia!

Shawn

Edit: maybe not, 430 years may not be right accorfing to caculations of stay in Egypt with internal evidence.
 
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