Faith, Coming to Christ pleases God !

[savedbymercy]

I found your answer. But unless you want to be publicly embarrassed you should just answer the questions I ask you.

If you know it , why you keep asking me ? That is harassment, all because you evade the Truth !

 

[DHK]

If you know it , why you keep asking me ? That is harassment, all because you evade the Truth !

I prefer honest debate. You prefer rabbit trails, dodging the truth, evasive tactics, etc.--anything but the truth.
In fact you can't even quote a verse (2Cor.4:3), as short as that verse is, without leaving out part of it, to support your error. You mislead, are dishonest, and not truthful in your presentation of the facts.
And that is why Yeshua said what he said back in 2012.

But here is what you said in 2012:

This thread is not about me, if you want to know when I believed you need to search for my testimony on your board. I do know and admit however that you believe a false gospel of works !

BTW, I do not believe in the same jesus you believe in anyway, one that whose death saved no one in and of itself.

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1920103&postcount=79

In another thread, you deny that one is justified by faith.
Yeshua stated almost three years ago that at that time you never answered questions concerning your testimony.
At about the same time, you testify that you don't believe the same "Jesus" that I believe.

So where does that leave us? J.W.'s Mormons, and false religions don't worship the same Jesus as I do either. Where does it place you? What Jesus do you believe?

I think you better make yourself fairly clear and very soon.

 

[savedbymercy]

I prefer honest debate. You prefer rabbit trails, dodging the truth, evasive tactics, etc.--anything but the truth.
In fact you can't even quote a verse (2Cor.4:3), as short as that verse is, without leaving out part of it, to support your error. You mislead, are dishonest, and not truthful in your presentation of the facts.
And that is why Yeshua said what he said back in 2012.

But here is what you said in 2012:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1920103&postcount=79

In another thread, you deny that one is justified by faith.
Yeshua stated almost three years ago that at that time you never answered questions concerning your testimony.
At about the same time, you testify that you don't believe the same "Jesus" that I believe.

So where does that leave us? J.W.'s Mormons, and false religions don't worship the same Jesus as I do either. Where does it place you? What Jesus do you believe?

I think you better make yourself fairly clear and very soon.

Now you are lying on me, where have I denied that one is Justified by Faith ? Please show the post or admit that you are lying !

 

[savedbymercy]

pt

How is anyone saved in your theology, savedbymercy? And don't just say "By Christ." We all agree salvation comes by Christ. Explain how salvation is accomplished in your theology, because your recent posts lead me to believe that you have a system in which no one can be saved.

Well I am sorry to disappoint you, but thats exactly how someone is saved according to what I believe, by the Death of Christ ! I cant believe you said to me, dont say " By Christ" ! How can you be a Christian and dont believe that is how one is saved, By Christ ?

Its you who doesnt believe that Christ saves one. Tell me, do you believe that everyone Christ died for is saved by His Death for them alone ? Does His death for them alone, effect their Eternal Salvation ? Yes or No ! Now I do, now what says you !

Now answer that and dont evade it !
__________________

 

[PreachTony]

You quote the scripture Luke 19:10 , now was Christ 100 % successful in both seeking and saving that which was lost ? Yes or No ! Do you believe that any of the lost He seeks shall be lost ? Yes or No ?

Are you adopting the position that if someone is able to reject the gospel and thereby reject Christ that it somehow weakens Christ?

Well I am sorry to disappoint you, but thats exactly how someone is saved according to what I believe, by the Death of Christ ! I cant believe you said to me, dont say " By Christ" ! How can you be a Christian and dont believe that is how one is saved, By Christ ?

If you'll apply a little reading comprehension to what I wrote, you'll see that I wrote "And don't just say "By Christ." I was seeking for you to explain your theology. I was in no way implying that Christ does not save. Your stated position stands contrary to established biblical doctrines concerning salvation and the necessity of preaching the gospel to the lost. I was hoping you would clarify.

Its you who doesnt believe that Christ saves one. Tell me, do you believe that everyone Christ died for is saved by His Death for them alone ? Does His death for them alone, effect their Eternal Salvation ? Yes or No ! Now I do, now what says you !

Now answer that and dont evade it !

Don't ever tell me what I believe. I have shown you time and again the scriptures that stand in opposition to your point of view.

I cannot answer your question as stated, because you have framed it in a way that requires a Calvinist, or even hyper-Calvinist, mind set. I am not a Calvinist. I don't believe that Christ died for one group and not another. I see Christ dying so that "whosoever will" can come to Him, and so that the WORLD through Him might be saved. His death accomplished the work. He even said "It is finished." I believe that man can now either accept or reject Christ. He is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. If Christ only died for one group and not another, then that becomes a duplicitous statement from God. I don't believe God is duplicitous.

 

[savedbymercy]

Faith is the Gift of God !

Most religionist believe that Faith is something the natural man has or has the ability to do, but they are dead wrong and deceived ! See, Christ has been the author of a believers Faith Heb 12:2

2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

The writer here is very precise in stating to believers of like precious Faith, that it was not of themselves, but Christ was the Author of it. Now what does this word Author mean ? Its the greek word archēgos and means:


I.the chief leader, prince

A.of Christ



II.one that takes the lead in any thing and thus affords an example, a predecessor in a matter, pioneer


III.the author

That word predecessor denotes that He is the Father of Our Faith, much like it is said of Abraham regarding believers, that he is the Father of the Faithful Rom 4:11,12,16

And he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had yet being uncircumcised: that he might be the father of all them that believe, though they be not circumcised; that righteousness might be imputed unto them also:


And the father of circumcision to them who are not of the circumcision only, but who also walk in the steps of that faith of our father Abraham, which he had being yet uncircumcised.

Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

Gal 3:7,9

Know ye therefore that they which are of faith, the same are the children of Abraham.

So then they which be of faith are blessed with faithful Abraham.

But what Abraham could not do, he could not produce Spiritual Children with Faith,

But Christ could, so He is the True Father of the Faithful, which He produced in Abraham's stead.

Another definition for that word author in Heb 12:2 which is neglected is :


I.beginning, origin


II.the person or thing that commences, the first person or thing in a series, the leader


III.that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause


IV.the extremity of a thing

A.of the corners of a sail



V.the first place, principality, rule, magistracy

A.of angels and demons

Christ is the active cause of our Faith if we believe in Him. Our Faith begin to be because of His causation !

See, the natural man wants to take credit for faith as being of his ability, which is a lie, and it steals credit due to Christ !

 

[savedbymercy]

Are you adopting the position that if someone is able to reject the gospel and thereby reject Christ that it somehow weakens Christ?


If you'll apply a little reading comprehension to what I wrote, you'll see that I wrote "And don't just say "By Christ." I was seeking for you to explain your theology. I was in no way implying that Christ does not save. Your stated position stands contrary to established biblical doctrines concerning salvation and the necessity of preaching the gospel to the lost. I was hoping you would clarify.


Don't ever tell me what I believe. I have shown you time and again the scriptures that stand in opposition to your point of view.

I cannot answer your question as stated, because you have framed it in a way that requires a Calvinist, or even hyper-Calvinist, mind set. I am not a Calvinist. I don't believe that Christ died for one group and not another. I see Christ dying so that "whosoever will" can come to Him, and so that the WORLD through Him might be saved. His death accomplished the work. He even said "It is finished." I believe that man can now either accept or reject Christ. He is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. If Christ only died for one group and not another, then that becomes a duplicitous statement from God. I don't believe God is duplicitous.

Didn't you evade a question I asked you about Lk 19:10 ?

 

[PreachTony]

Didn't you evade a question I asked you about Lk 19:10 ?

For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

I believe Jesus both CAN and WILL save all who call on His name, in accordance with further scriptures like Romans 10:

13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

If, according to your theology, the people who hear the gospel are ALREADY saved, then what is the purpose of Paul saying "WHOSOEVER shall call upon the name of the Lord SHALL be saved?"

 

[DHK]

Now you are lying on me, where have I denied that one is Justified by Faith ? Please show the post or admit that you are lying !

First we have the plain teaching of Scripture:
Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

But in posts of yours, you "teach":

It is God that justifieth Not Faith !

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1917247&postcount=140

You are forced to say things like that because you believe that faith is a work.
If you were to admit the biblical teaching that faith is not a work, then you could admit that truth of Romans 5:1, but instead you outright deny Romans 5:1, and teach that those who believe salvation is by faith (sola fide), believe in a works salvation.
You are not only very confused. Your keep walking into deeper and deeper error.

 

[Yeshua1]

Didn't you evade a question I asked you about Lk 19:10 ?

L am a Calvinist in reagrds to my views on Sotierology, but do you hold that the saved elect are already in that state before God before they need to repend and confess jesus as their Saviour then?

That we are saved before and aprt from receiving jesus through faith in Him and his work?

 

[savedbymercy]

Faith is the Gift of God !2

So Faith is the Gift of God in that Christ, the Gift of God Jn 4:10

Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.

Because Christ, who is the Gift of God, is its Author causer , the effectual producer of it, and thats why, all who Live by Faith, do so because they live by the Faith of the Son of God, who Loved them and gave Himself for them Gal 2:20

20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.

Christ as the Head does communicate His Faith to each of His Members of His Body Rom 12:3

3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.

He does this by giving them His Spirit Rom 5:5;Titus 3:5-6 and of course Faith is the fruit of His Spirit Gal 5:22

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,

So its the work of Christ's Spirit in us that effects Faith in Christ and our beginning to Live by Faith, hence we Live by the Faith of the Son of God, So are believing is not of us, but of Christ that by His Spirit now lives in us ! And its all the Gift of God !

 

[savedbymercy]

Are you adopting the position that if someone is able to reject the gospel and thereby reject Christ that it somehow weakens Christ?


If you'll apply a little reading comprehension to what I wrote, you'll see that I wrote "And don't just say "By Christ." I was seeking for you to explain your theology. I was in no way implying that Christ does not save. Your stated position stands contrary to established biblical doctrines concerning salvation and the necessity of preaching the gospel to the lost. I was hoping you would clarify.


Don't ever tell me what I believe. I have shown you time and again the scriptures that stand in opposition to your point of view.

I cannot answer your question as stated, because you have framed it in a way that requires a Calvinist, or even hyper-Calvinist, mind set. I am not a Calvinist. I don't believe that Christ died for one group and not another. I see Christ dying so that "whosoever will" can come to Him, and so that the WORLD through Him might be saved. His death accomplished the work. He even said "It is finished." I believe that man can now either accept or reject Christ. He is not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. If Christ only died for one group and not another, then that becomes a duplicitous statement from God. I don't believe God is duplicitous.

You quote the scripture Luke 19:10 , now was Christ 100 % successful in both seeking and saving that which was lost ? Yes or No ! Do you believe that any of the lost He seeks shall be lost ? Yes or No ?

 

[savedbymercy]

First we have the plain teaching of Scripture:
Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

But in posts of yours, you "teach":

http://www.baptistboard.com/showpost.php?p=1917247&postcount=140

You are forced to say things like that because you believe that faith is a work.
If you were to admit the biblical teaching that faith is not a work, then you could admit that truth of Romans 5:1, but instead you outright deny Romans 5:1, and teach that those who believe salvation is by faith (sola fide), believe in a works salvation.
You are not only very confused. Your keep walking into deeper and deeper error.

Im still looking for the quote where you stated I denied Justification by Faith ! Your integrity is at stake, Its not right to slander, or misrepresent a person, its very dishonest ! I think an apology is due if you cannot confirm such a statement !

 

[DHK]

Im still looking for the quote where you stated I denied Justification by Faith ! Your integrity is at stake, Its not right to slander, or misrepresent a person, its very dishonest ! I think an apology is due if you cannot confirm such a statement !

[FONT=&quot]It is God that justifieth Not Faith !

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]No apology will be forth coming.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You are quite dogmatic when you state not faith, contrary to the teaching of Romans 5:1. Your position has been consistent from the day you first joined in 2011, that faith is a work. Thus justification would have to be by works.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To avoid those nasty truths of the Bible you go to such extremes and teach that the elect are called of God and regenerated in the womb, using Paul as an example. You indeed have a warped theology. You deny completely the human will in man.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Often times your thoughts are not even your own, but plagiarized from Pink.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Though the Bible teaches that all mankind came under the curse when Adam sin, even the creation, you don't believe that the elect were ever under the curse. You don't believe they were ever part of the "children of the devil."[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is your interpretation of Gal.3:13 that those whom Christ died for (the elect) could never come under a curse of any kind.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is a warped theology.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You have in the past accused all those who believe in free will of having "an antichrist-theology, inferring that they are not saved.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And the list goes on and on.
[/FONT]

 

[Yeshua1]

Im still looking for the quote where you stated I denied Justification by Faith ! Your integrity is at stake, Its not right to slander, or misrepresent a person, its very dishonest ! I think an apology is due if you cannot confirm such a statement !

Were the elect already then saved apart from receiving jesus hru faith, and were born not under the curse of the fall of adam then?

 

[Yeshua1]

[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]No apology will be forth coming.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You are quite dogmatic when you state not faith, contrary to the teaching of Romans 5:1. Your position has been consistent from the day you first joined in 2011, that faith is a work. Thus justification would have to be by works.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]To avoid those nasty truths of the Bible you go to such extremes and teach that the elect are called of God and regenerated in the womb, using Paul as an example. You indeed have a warped theology. You deny completely the human will in man.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Often times your thoughts are not even your own, but plagiarized from Pink.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Though the Bible teaches that all mankind came under the curse when Adam sin, even the creation, you don't believe that the elect were ever under the curse. You don't believe they were ever part of the "children of the devil."[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is your interpretation of Gal.3:13 that those whom Christ died for (the elect) could never come under a curse of any kind.
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]It is a warped theology.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]You have in the past accused all those who believe in free will of having "an antichrist-theology, inferring that they are not saved.
[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot][/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]And the list goes on and on.
[/FONT]

Even and especially calvinists affirm that all of us save Jesus were born under the effects of the Fall, and needed to get saved by Grace alone thru faith alone!

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

No apology will be forth coming.

Thats not good christian character to slander and misrepresent your neighbor ! Prov 25:18

A man that beareth false witness against his neighbour is a maul, and a sword, and a sharp arrow.

Prov 11:9

An hypocrite with his mouth destroyeth his neighbour: but through knowledge shall the just be delivered.

Ex 20:16

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

You maliciously said what you stated to hurt me !

 

[DHK]

dhk



Thats not good christian character to slander and misrepresent your neighbor ! Prov 25:18

A man that beareth false witness against his neighbour is a maul, and a sword, and a sharp arrow.

Prov 11:9

An hypocrite with his mouth destroyeth his neighbour: but through knowledge shall the just be delivered.

Ex 20:16

Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbour.

You maliciously said what you stated to hurt me !

Show me where I slandered you. I quoted exactly what you said.
If you want to explain your words go ahead. Defend yourself instead of making baseless accusations.

 

[savedbymercy]

dhk

You are quite dogmatic when you state not faith, contrary to the teaching of Romans 5:1. Your position has been consistent from the day you first joined in 2011, that faith is a work. Thus justification would have to be by works

I have never stated that a person is not Justified by Faith, nor implied it, you are lying. In fact, I did a thread here a couple of years ago here:

Its called Justified before saved and I stated this:

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1917247&highlight=faith#post1917247 ost 140

It is God that justifieth Not Faith !



Rom 8:33

33 Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.

This scripture is very clear as to who Justifies, it is God's act first and foremost, and it was conceived in His Mind from Eternity , and when that act is finally terminated on the elect sinners conscious, it is Justification by Faith Rom 5:1. However , for it to ever come to be Justification by Faith in time, it had to be conceived first as Justification from Eternity by Him that conceived it originally ! God never laid to charge to the Elect, their condemnation due to their sin, that began their Justification before Him in Eternity !

That one post proves you are lying on me !

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1916583&highlight=faith#post1916583 Post 138

Quote:
Originally Posted by savedbymercy View Post
When one is Justified by Faith in time, it is when God has made known to them the Mystery of His Will or Decree of their Eternal Justification, it is then they are being made consciously aware of God's Justifying sentence, that was from Eternity due to His Eternal Purpose in Christ Eph 3:11 and that Eternal Compact or Agreement in the Everlasting Covenant between the Father and Son, the Spirit bearing witness, for God makes the Covenant known to Spiritual Faith 2 Sam 23:5

Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.

Ps 25:14

14 The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.

So being Justified by Faith in Time is nothing less than being made known to us our Eternal Interest in God's Eternal Covenant with His Son, and our interest in the Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20, and this was before being revealed to us a Mystery of God's Will Eph 1:7-9

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Thats Justification by Faith !


http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1915485&highlight=faith#post1915485 136

When one is Justified by Faith in time, it is when God has made known to them the Mystery of His Will or Decree of their Eternal Justification, it is then they are being made consciously aware of God's Justifying sentence, that was from Eternity due to His Eternal Purpose in Christ Eph 3:11 and that Eternal Compact or Agreement in the Everlasting Covenant between the Father and Son, the Spirit bearing witness, for God makes the Covenant known to Spiritual Faith 2 Sam 23:5

Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation, and all my desire, although he make it not to grow.

Ps 25:14

14 The secret of the Lord is with them that fear him; and he will shew them his covenant.

So being Justified by Faith in Time is nothing less than being made known to us our Eternal Interest in God's Eternal Covenant with His Son, and our interest in the Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20, and this was before being revealed to us a Mystery of God's Will Eph 1:7-9

7 In whom we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins, according to the riches of his grace;

8 Wherein he hath abounded toward us in all wisdom and prudence;

9 Having made known unto us the mystery of his will, according to his good pleasure which he hath purposed in himself:

Thats Justification by Faith !

http://www.baptistboard.com/showthread.php?p=1903772&highlight=faith#post1903772 post 197

What is Justification by Faith ?

Justification by faith is God's declaring personally to a person, in their consciousness, that by Christ, His Blood, they are made just, they are forgiven of all their sins, have no condemnation in Christ, so that the person perceives and lays hold of this Divine declaration by Holy Spirit given Faith. Faith or believing in Christ is not an act man performs as an condition in order to their Justification before God, for that automatically defaults to Justification by my works, and not by faith in its proper sense. Therefore faith is the primary instrument by which God declares or makes known to the Justified, that he or she is Justified, so faith is the substance of things hoped for , the reality of things [spiritual] not seen.

All these shows your deceitfulness !

Your position has been consistent from the day you first joined in 2011, that faith is a work.

Faith is a Work, a Work of the Law that ought to be done Matt 23:23

23 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye pay tithe of mint and anise and cummin, and have omitted the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done, and not to leave the other undone.

 

[savedbymercy]

Show me where I slandered you. I quoted exactly what you said.
If you want to explain your words go ahead. Defend yourself instead of making baseless accusations.

You know where you lied in post 22 , You stated this:

In another thread, you deny that one is justified by faith.

Now where did I say or deny that one is Justified by Faith ? You need to provide that sir, or admit that you lied !