Gen 24:48 The KJV get's it wrong?

[AntennaFarmer]

Folks, I have tried to take this topic seriously. On reflection, however, I think it is the nuttiest "attack" on the KJV yet.

If a reader can't understand that "daughter" could mean another female descendent then there is a deep problem somewhere. What will happen when that reader comes to terms like "daughters of Zion" or "son of David"? Both of those are used in almost every English version. If a person is that ignorant then they can't read anyhow. Start them on "Dick, Jane and Sally".

Just in case you still aren't convinced then pull out the dictionary. It is plain English people.

From dictionary.com entry for daughter:
1.a female child or person in relation to her parents. 2.any female descendant. 3.a person related as if by the ties binding daughter to parent: daughter of the church.

 

[Palatka51]

I hate it when gnats get in the house. They are unclean critters - if one flies in one's mouth, they are defiled for several days and their prayers will go unheard.

That's just it isn't it? This thread has explored "daughter" to the nth degree and no one has come to a conclusion. It is time to either leave the gnat (daughter) in the drink (Bible) or just throw out the whole drink and get a new drink. And sense there is no one here qualified to refill that cup I think that I'll settle for the old drink even though the gnat is still in it. For who knows, someone here may just serve us a cup with a camel in it.
I settle on the gnat because I am thirsty. Sense each one of you are passing the cup around trying to make sense of the gnat in the drink not one of us has had the chance to quench our thirst. If just one had drank then this gnat straining would have been profitable. So I'll drink it with the gnat, thank you, as it will contain a little protein which is profitable in and of itself.
However you may keep the cup with the camel, it contains nothing but death. If I were to drink of that cup I will surely choke.

 

[Palatka51]

Folks, I have tried to take this topic seriously. On reflection, however, I think it is the nuttiest "attack" on the KJV yet.

If a reader can't understand that "daughter" could mean another female descendent then there is a deep problem somewhere. What will happen when that reader comes to terms like "daughters of Zion" or "son of David"? Both of those are used in almost every English version. If a person is that ignorant then they can't read anyhow. Start them on "Dick, Jane and Sally".

Just in case you still aren't convinced then pull out the dictionary. It is plain English people.

From dictionary.com entry for daughter:
1.a female child or person in relation to her parents. 2.any female descendant. 3.a person related as if by the ties binding daughter to parent: daughter of the church.

Great post AF. :applause:

 

[Palatka51]

That's just it isn't it? This thread has explored "daughter" to the nth degree and no one has come to a conclusion. It is time to either leave the gnat (daughter) in the drink (Bible) or just throw out the whole drink and get a new drink. And sense there is no one here qualified to refill that cup I think that I'll settle for the old drink even though the gnat is still in it. For who knows, someone here may just serve us a cup with a camel in it.
I settle on the gnat because I am thirsty. Sense each one of you are passing the cup around trying to make sense of the gnat in the drink not one of us has had the chance to quench our thirst. If just one had drank then this gnat straining would have been profitable. So I'll drink it with the gnat, thank you, as it will contain a little protein which is profitable in and of itself.
However you may keep the cup with the camel, it contains nothing but death. If I were to drink of that cup I will surely choke.

Oh, and for the sake of clarification I used the word "Bible" as an all inclusive term for all versions of it that use "daughter" as this was the OP's intent. At least as I have come to understand Tim's original intent, I do not think that he intended to target the KJV only. Even though the thread's title indicates that the KJV is targeted.

 

[Rippon]

Do you still agree with these propositions of yours ?

I would not go so far as to say it [ NLTse ] is the Word of God as is the KJV .

It [ NLTse ] merely contains the Word of God .

The NLT is a Bible , but only the KJV is a true version of the Word of God .

Pastor Bob says he stands by these statements ( see his post #47 ) . Then in post # 51 he turns around and claims to have been misrepresented . Hmm...

Pastor Bob : You have flatly said that the NIV is not the Word of God . Of course many other MV's are included in your condemnation .

You have made the ridiculous distinction that the MV's such as the NIV may be Bibles , but not the Word of God . You may be confused , but I think it is a willful disregard of the facts .

You also believe that the MV's water-down or down-grade the great doctrines of the Bible . Just for the sake of clarity I would like you to document where the NIV , NLTse , ESV and the NASBU obscures or neglects these great doctrines .

KJV-onlyism is a serious departure from the faith .

 

[Salamander]

Rippon, please show us all where this thread is limited to your obsession to persistently attack "KJVO", the KJB, and to hijack everythread in the BV&T forum to atempt to turn it into another KJVO debate?

Could it be that all the evidences about "daughter" to be perfectly relevent to why the KJB makes this distinction? Yes.

 

[Salamander]

I hate it when gnats get in the house. They are unclean critters - if one flies in one's mouth, they are defiled for several days and their prayers will go unheard.

I didn't know gnats prayed? I have heard the human mouth is more unsanitary than a dog's mouth as well.

 

[Salamander]

NKJV - 26 TIMES
ESV - 25 TIMES
ERV - 31 TIMES
HCSB - 26 TIMES
ASV - 31 TIMES
NLT - 22 TIMES
NAB - 25 TIMES
BBE - 25 TIMES

That list could indicate adding to and taking away from the word of God.

 

[tinytim]

Oh, and for the sake of clarification I used the word "Bible" as an all inclusive term for all versions of it that use "daughter" as this was the OP's intent. At least as I have come to understand Tim's original intent, I do not think that he intended to target the KJV only. Even though the thread's title indicates that the KJV is targeted.

Thanks... If I could I would have went back and added the other versions in my OP to the title.. but we can't edit titles.

Thanks for at least trying to understand that I am not a nutcase or ignorant as AF alluded to...

I just beleive that a version of the bible should relate the truth the best is can to the receiving people.. .and I don't think people are ignorant that assumes that when a bible version says someone is a man's daughter, it is not talking about his granddaughter...

For those of you that think I am nuts or ignorant, go out and ask people in you community what a daughter is... have them read this phrase "Tom's daughter, Josie, married Sam"
Then ask them what was Josies father's name...

I bet they say "Tom"

Too bad, Tom could be her grandfather...according to you all, and according to AF,that makes them ignorant...

Why are we acting like the RC church did by coding our Bible so that only theologians can understand it...

Unloose the people, give them the truth in the language they can understand. The truth is she was his GRANDdaughter.. not daughter.

If that makes me a nutcase, so be it.. I just would rather have a version that doesn't hide truth.

 

[Mexdeaf]

I hate it when gnats get in the house. They are unclean critters - if one flies in one's mouth, they are defiled for several days and their prayers will go unheard.

Not to mention- they taste 'gnasty'.

"coff, coff, spit."

 

[Mexdeaf]

Thanks... If I could I would have went back and added the other versions in my OP to the title.. but we can't edit titles.

Thanks for at least trying to understand that I am not a nutcase or ignorant as AF alluded to...

I just beleive that a version of the bible should relate the truth the best is can to the receiving people.. .and I don't think people are ignorant that assumes that when a bible version says someone is a man's daughter, it is not talking about his granddaughter...

For those of you that think I am nuts or ignorant, go out and ask people in you community what a daughter is... have them read this phrase "Tom's daughter, Josie, married Sam"
Then ask them what was Josies father's name...

I bet they say "Tom"

Too bad, Tom could be her grandfather...according to you all, and according to AF,that makes them ignorant...

Why are we acting like the RC church did by coding our Bible so that only theologians can understand it...

Unloose the people, give them the truth in the language they can understand. The truth is she was his GRANDdaughter.. not daughter.

If that makes me a nutcase, so be it.. I just would rather have a version that doesn't hide truth.

I understand what you are getting at and your motives were pure TT. Now go spit those gnats out and drink something to get the taste out of your mouth! :smilewinkgrin:

 

[franklinmonroe]

... Just in case you still aren't convinced then pull out the dictionary. It is plain English people...

AF, I'm a bit surprised by your dictionary.com offerring. You know that the KJV is not "plain" English that can be found in just any dictionary. Please show us the 1828 Webster's definition, or an equivalent. Thanks

 

[tinytim]

I understand what you are getting at and your motives were pure TT. Now go spit those gnats out and drink something to get the taste out of your mouth! :smilewinkgrin:

hack...hack... cough cough... kphat!

Ok, now that feels better...

I know I am NIT picking... or is it GNAT picking... NIT picking has to do with LICE... and I don't want to start that thread back up!!! :laugh: and I probably shouldn't have even started this thread... but something told me too... I knew I shouldn't be listening to those voices again...

Bubba!!! get away from that Keyboard!

 

[franklinmonroe]

NKJV - 26 TIMES
ESV - 25 TIMES
ERV - 31 TIMES
HCSB - 26 TIMES
ASV - 31 TIMES
NLT - 22 TIMES
NAB - 25 TIMES
BBE - 25 TIMES

SFiC, are these results from searching the NT for the English word "daughter" or searching the Greek (edited) word thygater (Strong's #2364)? I'm curious as to how the ERV and ASV show 31 matches in your results.

 

[tinytim]

I thought the Hebrew word was bat

 

[standingfirminChrist]

SFiC, are these results from searching the NT for the English word "daughter" or searching the Hebrew word thygater (Strong's #2364)? I'm curious as to how the ERV and ASV show 31 matches in your results.

I searched the New Testament for the word 'daughter'.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

As "A female descendant" is even today recognised as as an acceptable definition for "daughter" I can't see the logic in calling it a mistake.

Could it have been clearer? Probably.
A mistake? Hardly.

 

[franklinmonroe]

I searched the New Testament for the word 'daughter'.

That is what I suspected. That data then does not compare to the 29 times for the specific Greek word thygater (Strong's #2364); there are 3 other Greek words that are sometimes rendered "daughter".

 

[Pastor_Bob]

Pastor Bob says he stands by these statements ( see his post #47 ) . Then in post # 51 he turns around and claims to have been misrepresented . Hmm...

Please reread my post again very carefully.

Pastor Bob : You have flatly said that the NIV is not the Word of God . Of course many other MV's are included in your condemnation .

Please provide a direct quote.

You have made the ridiculous distinction that the MV's such as the NIV may be Bibles , but not the Word of God .

Please provide a direct quote.

You also believe that the MV's water-down or down-grade the great doctrines of the Bible .

Please provide a direct quote.

Just for the sake of clarity I would like you to document where the NIV , NLTse , ESV and the NASBU obscures or neglects these great doctrines .

The conversation will go no further until you provide my quotes in their proper context. As I stated above, I feel that I have been misrepresented.

You lost credibility with me long ago when you flatly stated that no other English version but the KJV is really the Word of God . emphasis mine

If I "flatly stated" what you say I stated, it shouldn't be hard to produce that quote.

 

[Rippon]

Okay , these are now the newly revised propositions of Pastor Bob .

The NIV is the Word of God .

The MV's do not water-down the great doctrines of the Bible .

Not only the KJV , but the MV's are the Word of God .