Go ahead and pound me: But I believe the Government should be involved in healthcare.

[FR7 Baptist]

Havensdad,
So your wife and children don't have any healthcare insurance?
Why did you make that choice?

For a lot of people it's not a choice. In fact, universal healthcare gives more choice, esp. in the House bill where you can choose from private insurance or a public option. If you can't pay for care, you may have no choice at all.

 

[abcgrad94]

The only option the lower paid people have, is to suffer and die.

The health care should be if you want and need medical care, you can get it.

No, they don't have to suffer and die. We have a free society here in the US. If weu want a better paying job with better healthcare, we have the opportunity to work hard, go to school, and learn a better trade. This thinking that "only the rich get perks" is nothing more than a lie the liberals want us to believe so that we will depend on them and their superior mentality. We already have TONS of government programs already available to help people get more education. Our tax dollars provide food, shelter, healthcare, education, and much more for the "poor." I am already doing my part to give people handouts, and it irks me that people feel "entitled" to demand more. It irks me even more when people use my faith in Christ as an excuse to continue to be lazy and demand more and more and more.

I was from a low income home with no insurance, even though I had several health issues for which my parents couldn't afford treatment. I worked hard in school, earned scholarships and WORKED my way through college so I could get a decent education. I did not make a decision to work at McDonalds my whole life and complain that I was too poor to get insurance, then ask the government to take from others so I could get it.

It is up to us as individuals to use the brains God gave us and work, not sit around begging for handouts from others, which is what most of the "poor" are doing today.

 

[Havensdad]

It is not constitutional for the Fed to be involved in any sort of business not specifically mentioned in the constitution.

Which is why I do not believe Medical care should be a business.

 

[Havensdad]

No, they don't have to suffer and die. We have a free society here in the US. If weu want a better paying job with better healthcare, we have the opportunity to work hard, go to school, and learn a better trade.

This is incorrect. The financial system we have in the U.S. (capitalism) runs on the laws of supply and demand (I do believe that Capitalism is the best possible system in a lost, sinful world, however). It is actually impossible for the entirety of the people to "work hard" and rise to the top. The financial system mandates that a certain number of people, regardless of their work ethic, MUST be at the bottom, and deprived of certain things.

For instance, if everyone suddenly got up and started working as hard as they can, every thing would inflate in price. The balance would be restored.

This concept of financial balance is what is killing our economy right now. The government keeps trying to forestall a recession, by throwing money at the problem, but this is like putting a tall ladder on top of a mountain, to delay walking off the cliff. You keep making the fall higher, instead of changing direction.

 

[abcgrad94]

The financial system mandates that a certain number of people, regardless of their work ethic, MUST be at the bottom, and deprived of certain things.

For instance, if everyone suddenly got up and started working as hard as they can, every thing would inflate in price. The balance would be restored.
You keep making the fall higher, instead of changing direction.

I don't follow you. If this were true, then the opposite should be true, that is, that socialism works. We just sit on our hands and let "the rich" give us handouts and everyone is equal and happy. We've already seen that socialism does NOT work. Russia is a great example.

One of the many problems with this mentality is that by taking from the hard workers and giving to the unmotivated recipients of government handouts, you remove the worker's desire to contribute. They see that's it's more profitable to sit around depending on others to pay their way through life. Why bother to earn money when some welfare bum will get it instead of your own children?

 

[Revmitchell]

Which is why I do not believe Medical care should be a business.

The constitution does not give the fed the authority to be involved in anything medical period.

 

[Hardsheller]

For a lot of people it's not a choice. In fact, universal healthcare gives more choice, esp. in the House bill where you can choose from private insurance or a public option. If you can't pay for care, you may have no choice at all.

Paul,

It's always a choice. Whether or not a person wants to make that choice is part of the freedom we enjoy as Americans.

The author of the OP has a website where a huge travel trailer is pictured. I assume that was his own which he made a choice to purchase.

The choices are always there. It's the way we arrange them that sometimes cause others to question our judgment.

 

[abcgrad94]

It's always a choice. Whether or not a person wants to make that choice is part of the freedom we enjoy as Americans.

Which is why we the taxpayers should have the choice whether or not to pay for other people's bills.

 

[Havensdad]

Paul,

It's always a choice. Whether or not a person wants to make that choice is part of the freedom we enjoy as Americans.

The author of the OP has a website where a huge travel trailer is pictured. I assume that was his own which he made a choice to purchase.

The choices are always there. It's the way we arrange them that sometimes cause others to question our judgment.

That "huge" travel trailer (it is only a 30 ft. not a big one) is mine, my wife, and my three kids ONLY home. It is far less expensive than a normal house: even a small one. The payments on it, are less than the cost of a small one bedroom efficiency apartment.

Would you prefer for me to let them live in a cardboard box? That's about the only thing I could get that's cheaper.

 

[FR7 Baptist]

Paul,

It's always a choice. Whether or not a person wants to make that choice is part of the freedom we enjoy as Americans.

The author of the OP has a website where a huge travel trailer is pictured. I assume that was his own which he made a choice to purchase.

The choices are always there. It's the way we arrange them that sometimes cause others to question our judgment.

Yes, you assume it's his when we don't know that. I can't comment on the OP's situation specifically. When it's a "choice" between health insurance and food- I don't see that as much of a choice at all.

 

[Havensdad]

The constitution does not give the fed the authority to be involved in anything medical period.

Technically, it could be interpreted that way, since the Constitution includes the mandate to "promote the general welfare".

 

[Hardsheller]

I don't really care what you live in. That's your choice.

But you don't have a right to expect me and other Americans to subsidize your lifestyle regardless of what it is.

I can't begin to tell you where to live or what to do.

But I will tell you this.

In my opinion A man who won't provide for his family's needs is not much of a man. Furthermore, if your wife and kids are not receiving adequate healthcare then that's not my fault or the American People's fault or even Capitalism's fault.

It's your fault.

 

[FR7 Baptist]

What if he can not?

 

[Hardsheller]

What if he can not?

We don't know that. Do we?

If he truly can not, then there are options.

If he's a member of a church then his church should be helping.
If he's got family his family should be helping.
If he's below poverty level every state provides some kind of health care coverage for children, all you have to do is apply.
There are numerous free health services available for those who cannot afford them.

Any time we look to the government for help we are asking for more control of our lives.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

First, wanting everyone to have access to life giving medical care, is not "liberal."

But demanding that government ensure that everyone has the same access, even if it means taking money from one group of people under threat of prison, to give to another, is.

Second, Romans 13 speaks of us paying taxes, in order that the Government might "serve" us, for our good. It is NOT just speaking about military defense, but service. He is not only an "avenger", he is also "God's servant for your good."

Like I said, you're guilty of taking a verse out of context and twisting it to fit your political ideology, which is pretty typical of liberals.

All of us, in my opinion, have been brainwashed by the two parties in our country (Dems and Rep) so that, rather than following what is right and good, when our parties say "jump" we say "how high."

Actually, I don't belong to either one of these parties, so speak for yourself.

 

[Revmitchell]

Technically, it could be interpreted that way, since the Constitution includes the mandate to "promote the general welfare".

The phrase the general welfare is not a catch all left wide open and is defined by the 10th amendment.

But the Founders also ratified the Constitution's 10th Amendment, affirming, "The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people." Thus, the general welfare cannot reasonably be stretched to allow the national level of government to perform functions and exercise powers beyond those specifically and explicitly listed in the Constitution. As James Madison described the limitations on interpretation of the general welfare clause, "If Congress can do whatever in their discretion can be done by money, and will promote the general welfare, the government is no longer a limited one...."

Source

 

[Deacon]

Why am I concerned about the government’s involvement in healthcare?

Politicians have proven that they care only for themselves and are untrustworthy. They care not for people, not for the needy or disenfranchised, not even for the future of their country.

Don’t be fooled into thinking that they have your concerns at heart, politicians care only for themselves.
They proved this over and over again.
Look at the Social Security crisis that is ignored even though it hits the bottom of the barrel in 2011.

When government controls peoples retirement funds AND their healthcare there is an enormous opportunity for political shenanigans.

Rob

 

[Revmitchell]

if anyone thinks that the liberal desire to get their grubby hands on this country's health care is about people they are sadly disillusioned.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

Technically, it could be interpreted that way, since the Constitution includes the mandate to "promote the general welfare".

Actually, the general welfare has nothing to do with healthcare or entitlement programs.

 

[FR7 Baptist]

if anyone thinks that the liberal desire to get their grubby hands on this country's health care is about people they are sadly disillusioned.

Keep drinking the grape Flavor-Aid.