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God Gave Wine: What the Bible Says About Alcohol

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evangelist6589

evangelist6589

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Sad....

Based on the replies I am seeing in this thread and including that of WinMan, it is unfortunate to say that people do not seem to have a good argument for their position. Perhaps they believe as they do, because thats how they were raised, but cannot formulate arguments on their own. I am real surprised as usually WinMan has good arguments, but it appears in this subject he may not. Well I look forward to getting the book for it will "bring scripture" and good arguments in defense of the Biblical view on alcohol. I am also interested in hearing with Gentry has to say to those that say that the wine in Bible times was not really wine, but just grape juice that could not get anyone drunk. I have heard that argument a hundred times and it does not measure up!
 
Greektim

Greektim

Well-Known Member
evangelist6589 said:
Just ordered this book and hope I made a good buy. Since this topic comes up ALL THE TIME here, on FB, and everywhere it may be wise to have a good book on the topic. This review http://www.fundamentallyreformed.com/2008/08/02/god-gave-wine-gentry/
says it will be a good buy. Also the author suggests a book on Calvin & Luthers views on the topic, which seem to be in favor of drinking in moderation. Strange how John MacArthur quotes from Calvin all the time, yet himself believes that drinking is wrong. Is mac aware of what Calvin and Luther believed? This may be one of several areas where I disagree with Mac. Has anyone read it and what do you think?

The Fundamentalist movement (IFB) seems to be as blind as a bat to this issue and seems to be overrun by traditionalism and by those that do not hear what the other argument has to say. Sure not drinking in front of some that will lead them to sin is very wise, however drinking a beverage in front of my TV away from their presence is okay. Its wrong for such people to try and militate total control from a beverage even when away from them!! Thats a control problem not a Biblical problem! Fundamentalists are often afraid of those that disagree with them, and wont even read such a book, but will instantly condemn it. Such blind arrogance, its sickening and sad.

The other day ago I enjoyed a Mikes Pink Lemonade at a reception. I felt ozzy a little at first, but that was quickly taken away after I drank some water and got some food in my stomach. I did not get drunk and enjoyed my beverage. I felt weird because its been more than 6 months since I had a beverage, but I was glad I drank one as it was very enjoyable. One can make their beverage like the wine in the Bible times by mixing it with water and food!.
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You should post a link to the book (like amazon) as well as author details. That would be better than only a link to a review about the book. Just a thought.
 
Jerome

Jerome

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'Bible alcohol'[?] would be nonpasteurized stuff made in wineskins or clay pots. Not that fruity pink concoction you're always gushing about.
 
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thisnumbersdisconnected

New Member
Jerome said:
'Bible alcohol'[?] would be nonpasteurized stuff made in wineskins or clay pots.
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You're obviously claiming the wine of the Bible, the wine Jesus made at Cana, was non-alcoholic.

Explain then the use of the word methuo in John 2:10, and the fact that oinos is used to describe both the poorer wine and the better.
 
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annsni

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thisnumbersdisconnected said:
You're obviously claiming the wine of the Bible, the wine Jesus made at Cana, was non-alcoholic.

Explain then the use of the word methuo in John 2:10, and the fact that oinos is used to describe both the poorer wine and the better.
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Actually, it doesn't sound like he is. Non pasteurized would mean that it would become alcohol (the pasteurization process kills off the yeast). :)
 
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Baptist4life

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Ah, yes. Another "christian trying to justify drinking" thread. Why am I not surprised? :smilewinkgrin:
 
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saturneptune

New Member
Baptist4life said:
Ah, yes. Another "christian trying to justify drinking" thread. Why am I not surprised? :smilewinkgrin:
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I am not going to disagree with your conclusion. I do not drink because of my witness to a lost world and the weaker Christian brother. Another reason I do not drink is that when I drank in the service, it was so extreme there were times I could not remember how I got back to base or the ship. Of course, the number one reason is it makes my wife uncomfortable to be around it. It really does not matter why, as a husband, I respect her wishes, especially in her home. Besides that, to me it is a waste of money. Having said that, you are hard pressed to make a case for abstinence from Scripture. The thing is, that reasoning rings a Pharisee lead life, not a Christ lead life.

I have given you my reasoning for not drinking. The reading of Scripture does not give me the right to condemn one who does drink in moderation.
 
evangelist6589

evangelist6589

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saturneptune said:
I am not going to disagree with your conclusion. I do not drink because of my witness to a lost world and the weaker Christian brother. Another reason I do not drink is that when I drank in the service, it was so extreme there were times I could not remember how I got back to base or the ship. Of course, the number one reason is it makes my wife uncomfortable to be around it. It really does not matter why, as a husband, I respect her wishes, especially in her home. Besides that, to me it is a waste of money. Having said that, you are hard pressed to make a case for abstinence from Scripture. The thing is, that reasoning rings a Pharisee lead life, not a Christ lead life.

I have given you my reasoning for not drinking. The reading of Scripture does not give me the right to condemn one who does drink in moderation.
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What if you have a beverage when away from your wife and everyone? What is wrong with having a beverage while watching TV or eating dinner when its you and yourself only? Thats the PROBLEM I am having with some people is that they condemn others whom chose to drink away from everyone, or choose to drink with family and friends whom also find no harm in having a drink. Its that kind of CONTROL that is unbiblical and unchrist like.

I have not been drunk in many many many many years and have had a beverage on occasion for years. Sure if I drank in front of my wife, or weaker brethren I would be in sin. However for them to try and CONTROL MY PRIVATE LIFE is completely uncalled for!!!!!
 
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W

Winman

Active Member
Evangelist6589 said:
Sure if I drank in front of my wife, or weaker brethren I would be in sin. However for them to try and CONTROL MY PRIVATE LIFE is completely uncalled for!!!!!
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Good for you John! Lay down the law, tell your wife who is the boss!

 
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annsni

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evangelist6589 said:
What if you have a beverage when away from your wife and everyone? What is wrong with having a beverage while watching TV or eating dinner when its you and yourself only? Thats the PROBLEM I am having with some people is that they condemn others whom chose to drink away from everyone, or choose to drink with family and friends whom also find no harm in having a drink. Its that kind of CONTROL that is unbiblical and unchrist like.

I have not been drunk in many many many many years and have had a beverage on occasion for years. Sure if I drank in front of my wife, or weaker brethren I would be in sin. However for them to try and CONTROL MY PRIVATE LIFE is completely uncalled for!!!!!
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Sorry to tell you dear - you have no private life apart from your wife. If you do, you have a bigger problem than a Mike's Hard.
 
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saturneptune

New Member
evangelist6589 said:
What if you have a beverage when away from your wife and everyone? What is wrong with having a beverage while watching TV or eating dinner when its you and yourself only? Thats the PROBLEM I am having with some people is that they condemn others whom chose to drink away from everyone, or choose to drink with family and friends whom also find no harm in having a drink. Its that kind of CONTROL that is unbiblical and unchrist like.

I have not been drunk in many many many many years and have had a beverage on occasion for years. Sure if I drank in front of my wife, or weaker brethren I would be in sin. However for them to try and CONTROL MY PRIVATE LIFE is completely uncalled for!!!!!
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The problem with all these threads is the condemning other part. It is not just limited to the subject of alcohol. Many on this board "think" that because they interpret a Scripture one way or that the Holy Spirit lead them to a certain conclusion for their life, that it applies to everyone else also. Most cannot discern the difference between Biblical principles and opinion. I think the Lord puts it quite well with the speck in the eye and log comparison.

It is like the local gossip at church that runs to tell others what another member was seen doing Saturday night.
 
W

Winman

Active Member
saturneptune said:
The problem with all these threads is the condemning other part. It is not just limited to the subject of alcohol. Many on this board "think" that because they interpret a Scripture one way or that the Holy Spirit lead them to a certain conclusion for their life, that it applies to everyone else also. Most cannot discern the difference between Biblical principles and opinion. I think the Lord puts it quite well with the speck in the eye and log comparison.

It is like the local gossip at church that runs to tell others what another member was seen doing Saturday night.
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No, it's just that John (Evangelist) has a real talent for saying funny things. When you tell everyone you felt "ozzy", that is funny. Sure, it's a typo, but it is an hilarious typo.

Then if you say your wife should not interfere in your personal life, that is funny. Well, maybe not to her, but to everyone else... :laugh:

He has just started another thread recommending books on marriage to all of us. He has been married what? Two months?

Now that is funny. This guy missed his calling, he should be writing comedy. The problem is, he doesn't realize he is saying funny things.

I am not making fun of John, I sincerely enjoy his posts. Not for the reason he intended, but I truly enjoy them.
 
evangelist6589

evangelist6589

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Winman said:
No, it's just that John (Evangelist) has a real talent for saying funny things. When you tell everyone you felt "ozzy", that is funny. Sure, it's a typo, but it is an hilarious typo.

Then if you say your wife should not interfere in your personal life, that is funny. Well, maybe not to her, but to everyone else... :laugh:

He has just started another thread recommending books on marriage to all of us. He has been married what? Two months?

Now that is funny. This guy missed his calling, he should be writing comedy. The problem is, he doesn't realize he is saying funny things.

I am not making fun of John, I sincerely enjoy his posts. Not for the reason he intended, but I truly enjoy them.
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You know I get allot of kicks from the Three Stooges. I own every episode and every movie. The ones with Curly and Shemp are the best of course. You need to watch them.
 
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