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God Wants to Deliver Us from the Evil Instrumental Music of This Present Evil World

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JonC

JonC

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Moderator
Charlie24 said:
We know from Scripture the Church is no better than its leadership. It's somewhat different here in that I can still see the effort to be separated from the world in music, preaching, and outreach to the lost.

The IBF Church I'm in now here near Charlotte is not the same as the one I was raised in on the NC coast.

It was more strict and more separated back then. But I will settle for what fundamentalism I've found here till I meet the Lord in person.
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Ah....good ole Charlotte. I like Optimist Hall. Good Indian street food.

The problem is in that separation. Biblically this is being in the world while not being if the world. But some have taken it to mean other things. I guess part of this, as Baptists, is related to earlier Anabaptists.

Many condemn IFB churches for being worldly (using pianos, organs, secular clothes associated with worldly success, worldly music styles, etc).

IFB churches typically view those who point out their worldly practices as holding to legalism.

Many IFB condemn other churches for being worldly (the praise music they use, their instruments, their common dress, etc).

It is kinda funny, if you think about it.


I was asking about the actual life of the IFB churches in Charlotte.

Here we have two that have life and about 30 that have lost their First Love and are either dead or dying.

Charlotte is a big area. I assume you see the work of God in growing His churches as we do here (I live in a large area, but not nearly as big as Charlotte).

It seems that this work of God kinda slowed for a few generations, but I have been absolutely amazed at the work of the Spirit in our area.

We see so many bad things in the world. It is good to pause and realize the greater things happening around us.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
Ah....good ole Charlotte. I like Optimist Hall. Good Indian street food.

The problem is in that separation. Biblically this is being in the world while not being if the world. But some have taken it to mean other things. I guess part of this, as Baptists, is related to earlier Anabaptists.

Many condemn IFB churches for being worldly (using pianos, organs, secular clothes associated with worldly success, worldly music styles, etc).

IFB churches typically view those who point out their worldly practices as holding to legalism.

Many IFB condemn other churches for being worldly (the praise music they use, their instruments, their common dress, etc).

It is kinda funny, if you think about it.


I was asking about the actual life of the IFB churches in Charlotte.

Here we have two that have life and about 30 that have lost their First Love and are either dead or dying.
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Just give it some time and the average Baptist Church will look like this without safety guards in separation.

https://www.tiktok.com/video/7189167276506254638
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
Charlie24 said:
Just give it some time and the average Baptist Church will look like this without safety guards in separation.

https://www.tiktok.com/video/7189167276506254638
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Lol....maybe some.

You are making a mistake, though. We have not been arguing about removing safety guards. We have been arguing about the safety guards used.

The Pharisees did the same as you advicate. They created safety guards. But in doing so the safety guards they created replaced what it is they were guarding and they became a "Synagogue of Satan", blind to the truth they once cherished.

I am saying that we do not need to create safety guards but rather use the guards God has provided.


I am not - obviously - condemning your worship or doctrine. I am condemning your condemnation of God's people (your decision to judge Another's servants).
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
Lol....maybe some.

You are making a mistake, though. We have not been arguing about removing safety guards. We have been arguing about the safety guards used.

The Pharisees did the same as you advicate. They created safety guards. But in doing so the safety guards they created replaced what it is they were guarding and they became a "Synagogue of Satan", blind to the truth they once cherished.

I am saying that we do not need to create safety guards but rather use the guards God has provided.


I am not - obviously - condemning your worship or doctrine. I am condemning your condemnation of God's people (your decision to judge Another's servants).
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Whether I'm judging another let the Lord be the final say.

I stand for a firm separation with no apologies.
 
DaveXR650

DaveXR650

Well-Known Member
Charlie24 said:
Just give it some time and the average Baptist Church will look like this without safety guards in separation.
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They look pretty solid to me. They are wearing jackets and ties for the most part. They're biblical. And the guy in the blue shirt has some moves for sure.
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
Charlie24 said:
Whether I'm judging another let the Lord be the final say.

I stand for a firm separation with no apologies.
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God will have the final say (that is why I was urging you to caution), but not about whether you are judging the worship of other Christians.

You declared that God rejects the worship of His children who praise Him using contemporary music. There is no "whether" to it.

And it is the same comdemnation Christians used several centuries ago to condemn those who used the hymns you use at a time those hymns were new.
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
DaveXR650 said:
They look pretty solid to me. They are wearing jackets and ties for the most part. They're biblical. And the guy in the blue shirt has some moves for sure.
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It would be interesting to hear the real clip. I wonder what they are singing.

But you are right....given only the visuals and assuming everything else is biblical...they are biblical (although that is not how I worship).

I am not a dancer. If I bust a move I would bust my back.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
God will have the final say (that is why I was urging you to caution), but not about whether you are judging the worship of other Christians.

You declared that God rejects the worship of His children who praise Him using contemporary music. There is no "whether" to it.

And it is the same comdemnation Christians used several centuries ago to condemn those who used the hymns you use at a time those hymns were new.
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Not going to argue, Jon. Not going to give any apologies either.
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
The topic here is sad when we think of churches that are dead or dying. But when things become useless they die.

No church plans to die. Often they do not realize their sickness before it is too late, or ever.

I think there are a few good clues. Churches exist to equip the members. They are equipped to "be the body", to reach people in the world, to bear fruit.

If a church exists in a decently large population yet does not reach the people around them, are not growing, then there is a problem (especially giving the "revival" that has been going on for the past several years).

Many times these churches tell themselves lies like "numbers do not matter" (literally, bearing fruit does not matter).



2794.jpg
 
DaveXR650

DaveXR650

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
But you are right....given only the visuals and assuming everything else is biblical...they are biblical (although that is not how I worship).

I am not a dancer. If I bust a move I would bust my back.
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If I did that I would hope they had one of those new portable defibrillators most places have hanging on the wall somewhere.
 
JonC

JonC

Moderator
Moderator
Charlie24 said:
Sounds like it's reallly bothering you that I condemn rock beat worship.
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It does not bother me that you dislike it, but yes, it does bother me that you condemn the worship of Christians.

It would bother me if you said God rejects the worship of KJVO people, of Calvinists, of Arminians, of Free-Will Baptists as well.

It bothers me when somebody I believe to be a Christian ends up condemning Christ (as you did).

But it does not bother me that you woukd not prefer CWM or the music used in the Bible.
 
C

Charlie24

Well-Known Member
JonC said:
It does not bother me that you dislike it, but yes, it does bother me that you condemn the worship of Christians.

It would bother me if you said God rejects the worship of KJVO people, of Calvinists, of Arminians, of Free-Will Baptists as well.

It bothers me when somebody I believe to be a Christian ends up condemning Christ (as you did).

But it does not bother me that you woukd not prefer CWM or the music used in the Bible.
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Oh, so now I'm condemning Christ.

It's possible for some to travel to far out into the world to see what separation really means.

But I trust that's not you, Jon.
 
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