Government murder

[atpollard]

Do we get a pass at the gate -for supporting the sinful acts by our government.

God says:

Ezekiel 18:20, 32 [ESV]
"The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself. ... For I have no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Lord GOD; so turn, and live."

 

[Silverhair]

That is NOT the OP, this is:


... to which the answer is "No."

murder (noun)​

1: the crime of unlawfully and unjustifiably killing a person : such a crime committed under circumstances defined by statute
2: something very difficult or dangerous
3: a flock of crows

The action by the US Military was not "unlawful", there are statutes that permit the attack of Terrorists and for better or worse, the Drug Cartel has been designated a Terrorist Organization [change the Law if you disagree]. The attack did not violate US Statutes [file criminal charges if you disagree].
The action by the US Military was not especially "difficult or dangerous". [definition 2]
The action by the US Military was not a flock of crows. [definition 3]

An argument can (and has) been made that the action by the US Military was a violation of "International Law", however, International Law is not a real and enforceable thing ... who enforces violations of International Law? Why have they not enforced International Law in places where actual genocides are taking place (like N. Korea, Ukraine and parts of Africa)? Why were they not in Venezuela removing the "illegal government"?
... No, "International Law" is a fiction: a shadow of a toothless lion cast on the wall that some people pretend is real.

So what your saying is that if the US writes a law then the whole world has to abide by that law. Wow is that arrogance or what.

The US can write laws for the US but that is it.

What the US did with the drug boat and it's invasion of another country was wrong. If you cannot see or understand that then you have a serious problem with reality.

 

[Van]

Is the killings in the Caribbean by this administration murder?

Lets say the killing by illegal drugs in America is murder by those who supply these lethal substances. Since the number of deaths runs in the tens or hundreds of thousands each year, that constitutes an act of War which would trigger Presidential War Powers to respond without Congressional authority, as Presidents Obama, Biden and Trump have done. When a Democrat acts, that is ok with the Democrats, and when a Republican acts, that is ok with the Republicans.

Therefore the question might just be anti Trump bluster. The other side seems to want the Drug suppliers to continue their war on Americans, but for the President to continue ineffectual action against the suppliers, like Obama, Biden, Bush, Clinton and so forth.

 

[KevinThrowe]

That is NOT the OP, this is:


... to which the answer is "No."

murder (noun)​

1: the crime of unlawfully and unjustifiably killing a person : such a crime committed under circumstances defined by statute
2: something very difficult or dangerous
3: a flock of crows

The action by the US Military was not "unlawful", there are statutes that permit the attack of Terrorists and for better or worse, the Drug Cartel has been designated a Terrorist Organization [change the Law if you disagree]. The attack did not violate US Statutes [file criminal charges if you disagree].
The action by the US Military was not especially "difficult or dangerous". [definition 2]
The action by the US Military was not a flock of crows. [definition 3]

An argument can (and has) been made that the action by the US Military was a violation of "International Law", however, International Law is not a real and enforceable thing ... who enforces violations of International Law? Why have they not enforced International Law in places where actual genocides are taking place (like N. Korea, Ukraine and parts of Africa)? Why were they not in Venezuela removing the "illegal government"?
... No, "International Law" is a fiction: a shadow of a toothless lion cast on the wall that some people pretend is real.

1 the OP,was and is where is the divide between salvation and damnation. As the shooting in Minneapolis is a killing and biblically some one needs to ask for redemption.

 

[KevinThrowe]

Lets say the killing by illegal drugs in America is murder by those who supply these lethal substances. Since the number of deaths runs in the tens or hundreds of thousands each year, that constitutes an act of War which would trigger Presidential War Powers to respond without Congressional authority, as Presidents Obama, Biden and Trump have done. When a Democrat acts, that is ok with the Democrats, and when a Republican acts, that is ok with the Republicans.

Therefore the question might just be anti Trump bluster. The other side seems to want the Drug suppliers to continue their war on Americans, but for the President to continue ineffectual action against the suppliers, like Obama, Biden, Bush, Clinton and so forth.

Thus the clerk at CVS filling the illegal Ozy script is a murderer. How are the Sackler family not narco terrorist? But please address the OP. Where is the divide in Nazi germany . The spectrum from Hitler to the resistance.

 

[atpollard]

So what your saying is that if the US writes a law then the whole world has to abide by that law. Wow is that arrogance or what.

The US can write laws for the US but that is it.

What the US did with the drug boat and it's invasion of another country was wrong. If you cannot see or understand that then you have a serious problem with reality.

Was it illegal for Russia to invade Ukraine?

Under Russian Law, no. So if you ask a Russian then the correct answer is "No, the invasion was not illegal".
Under Ukrainian Law, yes. So if you ask a Ukrainian then the correct answer is "Yes, the invasion was illegal".
Under "International Law" ... actions speak louder than words.

I am in the US and was asked if the Attack by the US military on "Narco-terrorists" was illegal ... I correctly answered that under US Law, "No, it is not illegal" (because it is not). As I stated:
1. If you don't like the Law, then change it.
2. If you believe that it was illegal under US Law, then file charges.

If you are not an American or a Venezuelan, then I ask ... "So what ARE you going to do?" (same thing you are doing about the murder of Ukrainians by Russia, Jews by Hamas, Gazans by the IDF and whites in South Africa I would expect ... nothing).

So much for the view from the "moral high ground".

 

[atpollard]

it's invasion of another country

How many US soldiers are presently in Venezuela?

invasion (noun)​

1: an act of invading : incursion of an army for conquest or plunder

 

[KevinThrowe]

How many US soldiers are presently in Venezuela?

invasion (noun)​

1: an act of invading : incursion of an army for conquest or plunder

Taking oil is not plunder?

 

[Silverhair]

Was it illegal for Russia to invade Ukraine?

Under Russian Law, no. So if you ask a Russian then the correct answer is "No, the invasion was not illegal".
Under Ukrainian Law, yes. So if you ask a Ukrainian then the correct answer is "Yes, the invasion was illegal".
Under "International Law" ... actions speak louder than words.

I am in the US and was asked if the Attack by the US military on "Narco-terrorists" was illegal ... I correctly answered that under US Law, "No, it is not illegal" (because it is not). As I stated:
1. If you don't like the Law, then change it.
2. If you believe that it was illegal under US Law, then file charges.

If you are not an American or a Venezuelan, then I ask ... "So what ARE you going to do?" (same thing you are doing about the murder of Ukrainians by Russia, Jews by Hamas, Gazans by the IDF and whites in South Africa I would expect ... nothing).

So much for the view from the "moral high ground".

So you are under the impression that might makes right.

What Russia and the USA did makes them both wrong.

Thinking it is right does not make it right or lawful. We do have international laws and both Russia and the USA have violated those laws.

The world called Russia a rogue nation for what they did by invading Ukraine and the world sees the USA as a rogue nation by their invading Venezuela.

 

[Silverhair]

How many US soldiers are presently in Venezuela?

invasion (noun)​

1: an act of invading : incursion of an army for conquest or plunder

Did the US invade Venezuela via it's armed forces and kidnap the leader of that country?

You can try to white wash the issue but the reality is that what the US did is wrong.

Your moral compass needs a reset.

 

[atpollard]

So you are under the impression that might makes right.

I am under the impression that ...

"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - Theodore Roosevelt

I am indifferent to the 'nay-saying' of those on the side lines doing nothing in the face of evil, but criticizing any effort by others to confront it.

 

[Van]

Thus the clerk at CVS filling the illegal Ozy script is a murderer. How are the Sackler family not narco terrorist? But please address the OP. Where is the divide in Nazi germany . The spectrum from Hitler to the resistance.

I am sorry Sir, but I addressed Presidential War Powers used by Mr. Obama, Biden, and Trump. We were talking about illegal drug suppliers waging war by killing thousands of Americans, and you want to talk about medical malpractice? Give me a break...

 

[Ben1445]

1 the OP,was and is where is the divide between salvation and damnation. As the shooting in Minneapolis is a killing and biblically some one needs to ask for redemption.

So you believe that every time the government does something wrong, you lose your salvation??

What is your religion? The real name that you would invite me to worship with you in?

 

[KevinThrowe]

Did the US invade Venezuela via it's armed forces and kidnap the leader of that country?

You can try to white wash the issue but the reality is that what the US did is wrong.

Your moral compass needs a reset.

The hypocrisy of the Trump world is a sad by product. But what of the OP?
Where is the line for salvation?
The spectrum from active support to active stopping the government action?

 

[Ben1445]

Did the US invade Venezuela via it's armed forces and kidnap the leader of that country?

You can try to white wash the issue but the reality is that what the US did is wrong.

Your moral compass needs a reset.

The US also invaded Germany in WW2. Was that wrong? Germany had not invaded us.

 

[KevinThrowe]

So you believe that every time the government does something wrong, you lose your salvation??

What is your religion? The real name that you would invite me to worship with you in?

Could be the case . That is the topic I am trying to get discussion of. With the anniversary of Auschwitz and hearing the stories of the actions of the German government and the fact that there was no earthly justice. So I ask do we believe that these men and women were not called out for their support of the genocide? Did the butcher who knew of the actions and supported “the final solution “ clear of judgement?

 

[Ben1445]

Could be the case . That is the topic I am trying to get discussion of. With the anniversary of Auschwitz and hearing the stories of the actions of the German government and the fact that there was no earthly justice. So I ask do we believe that these men and women were not called out for their support of the genocide? Did the butcher who knew of the actions and supported “the final solution “ clear of judgement?

Based only on his relationship with the Saviour.
As far as all your hypothetical arguments, they don’t change anything. My salvation has nothing to do with the President. (Unless I’m the President. And I’m not)

 

[KevinThrowe]

Based only on his relationship with the Saviour.
As far as all your hypothetical arguments, they don’t change anything. My salvation has nothing to do with the President. (Unless I’m the President. And I’m not)

So praising the “final solution “ would not get a German judged for those thoughts and the actions it allowed the government to do.

 

[Ben1445]

So praising the “final solution

You will have to give context for this kind of language. It is too vague to justify an answer.

So praising the “final solution “ would not get a German judged for those thoughts and the actions it allowed the government to do.

 

[xlsdraw]

So you are under the impression that might makes right.

What Russia and the USA did makes them both wrong.

Thinking it is right does not make it right or lawful. We do have international laws and both Russia and the USA have violated those laws.

The world called Russia a rogue nation for what they did by invading Ukraine and the world sees the USA as a rogue nation by their invading Venezuela.

And which imperialist country do you live in?