Grace and discipleship

[HisWordIsTruth]

It's all part of faith.

Amy welcome back to the conversation. I will ask you as I did webdog. Where is the Scripture that says believe/faith is the "same" thing as confess, repent and whatever else you might want to add to the mix.

I just don't see it. If they were the "same" thing then why Paul say believe AND confess if they meant the same thing? Again talk about mental gymnastics. I supposed to believe that the Spirit guided Paul to use two "different" words yet he "meant" the same thing. Whew.

 

[Amy.G]

If it was baptism by water, then Jesus either lied in that verse, or He lied to the thief on the cross when He told him 'This day thou shalt be with me in Paradise.'

It cannot be water Baptism for the thief did not come down off the cross to get Baptized.

It can only be referring to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

I agree.

Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.*



Belief in Christ results in baptism of the Holy Spirit.

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

If it was baptism by water, then Jesus either lied in that verse, or He lied to the thief on the cross when He told him 'This day thou shalt be with me in Paradise.'

It cannot be water Baptism for the thief did not come down off the cross to get Baptized.

It can only be referring to the Baptism of the Holy Spirit.

OR . . . and I know this may come as a huge shock to you . . . just maybe your understanding is off. Oh wait that's not possible is it .

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

Belief in Christ results in baptism of the Holy Spirit.

And what chapter and verse can I find this statement?

 

[Amy.G]

Amy welcome back to the conversation. I will ask you as I did webdog. Where is the Scripture that says believe/faith is the "same" thing as confess, repent and whatever else you might want to add to the mix.

I just don't see it. If they were the "same" thing then why Paul say believe AND confess if they meant the same thing? Again talk about mental gymnastics. I supposed to believe that the Spirit guided Paul to use two "different" words yet he "meant" the same thing. Whew.

I know that you believe that a born again person doesn't neccessarily show a changed nature. That's why you refuse to accept that when we believe we will "do" something that reveals that change, like confession.

That's why you do not understand "faith without works is dead".

The Holy Spirit changes us. Accept it.

 

[Amy.G]

And what chapter and verse can I find this statement?

Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Unless you believe in baptismal regeneration, this is speaking of the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

Believe + Holy Spirit indwelling = SAVED

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Believing a born again person does not have to show a change is the only way they can make their Mercy Exclusion doctrine work.

IOW, one can believe, do nothing for the Lord, live in sin, and still be saved... they will just be put in the Joey Faust purgatory for a thousand years untli someone from Grace Evangelical Society shows Jesus their twisted view of Scripture, at which time He pardons them and allows them into His Father's kingdom.

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

I know that you believe that a born again person doesn't neccessarily show a changed nature.

That's because that's what Scripture teaches. Our flesh is at war with our new spirit. It is not an automatic given that we are going to responded positively.

Again Scripture says that when Jesus made some very hard teachings that many "disciples" followed Him no more.

Now there are only two options. One these people weren't really saved (yet nowhere in Scripture do we find this - why would an unsaved person "follow" Jesus - doesn't make much sense). Or folks don't automatically live the right way and do the right thing.

Look at Corinthians. Doesn't look like they were automatically doing what they were supposed to be doing just because they had a new nature.

Amy do you have children?

 

[Amy.G]

Believing a born again person does not have to show a change is the only way they can make their Mercy Exclusion doctrine work.

IOW, one can believe, do nothing for the Lord, live in sin, and still be saved... they will just be put in the Joey Faust purgatory for a thousand years untli someone from Grace Evangelical Society shows Jesus their twisted view of Scripture, at which time He pardons them and allows them into His Father's kingdom.

:laugh: Good explanation!

 

[Joe]

Joe it really doesn't matter to these folks obviously. It's easier to talk about the meaningless than it is to focus on the meaningful!

Either you are jjump, or someone cutting and pasting his words from his posts. This is beyond coincidence.
If you are jjump, I hope you quit harassing revmitchell by constantly signing up on his board causing problems, thus he has to keep banning you. Stalking someone online or in person is not normal behavior.

 

[Amy.G]

That's because that's what Scripture teaches. Our flesh is at war with our new spirit. It is not an automatic given that we are going to responded positively.

2Cr 5:17 Therefore if any man [be] in Christ, [he is] a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

How do you explain how a "new creature" behaves in the same "old" way?

Again Scripture says that when Jesus made some very hard teachings that many "disciples" followed Him no more.

They did not truly believe.

1Jo 2:19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would [no doubt] have continued with us: but [they went out], that they might be made manifest that they were not all of us.

Now there are only two options. One these people weren't really saved (yet nowhere in Scripture do we find this - why would an unsaved person "follow" Jesus - doesn't make much sense). Or folks don't automatically live the right way and do the right thing.

Remember Simon?

Act 8:20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

Amy do you have children?

NOYB

 

[Amy.G]

Either you are jjump, or someone cutting and pasting his words from his posts. This is beyond coincidence.
If you are jjump, I hope you quit harassing revmitchell by constantly signing up on his board causing problems, thus he has to keep banning you. Stalking someone online or in person is not normal behavior.

No, it's not normal. It's creepy.

Yes, it is JJump. I'm not sure why he's being allowed to stay here, but that's not my call.


Hi Joe :wavey:

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

How do you explain how a "new creature" behaves in the same "old" way?

Well let's see what Scripture has to say about it. “I have the desire to do what is good, but I cannot carry it out...the evil I do not want to do—this I keep on doing.”

Sure doesn't sound like Paul agrees with you. At least not for himself. He kept on doing evil. Doesn't sound to me like an occasionaly mess up .

NOYB

Well if you did it would help your understanding I think.

Remember Simon?

Act 8:20 But Peter said unto him, Thy money perish with thee, because thou hast thought that the gift of God may be purchased with money.

So let me guess you are going to associate everlasting life with this text, because the word "gift" is there huh? Was Simon trying to purchase everlasting life or was it something he already had? What was he trying to purchase Amy?

 

[Amy.G]

JJump, I am tired of playing your games. ME is heresy, plain and simple. Your heart is hardened to the truth, yet you think you have the right to come on this board (for the 4th time now?) to judge us and claim that we do not know the truth and that we just follow traditions of men and do not understand the "truth" of the scriptures as you do.

I have more important things to do today than argue with you. You should be ashamed of your behavior. You have been banned. You are breaking BB rules by being here now. You are being deceptive in not admitting who you really are.

Hope you enjoy your 1000 years in outer darkness for the sin you have committed.

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

So again instead of deal with Scripture let's return to childish drivel. :tonofbricks:

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Now there are only two options. One these people weren't really saved (yet nowhere in Scripture do we find this - why would an unsaved person "follow" Jesus - doesn't make much sense). Or folks don't automatically live the right way and do the right thing.

Remember Judas? He followed Jesus, but was not saved... He was the son of perdition.

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

Remember Judas?

I do. Do you?

Then Judas, which had betrayed him, when he saw that he was condemned, repented himself, and brought again the thirty pieces of silver to the chief priests and elders,

He even met "your" standard standingfirm. Says he repented.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

Judas' repentance was not a godly repentance.

 

[Revmitchell]

................

 

[HisWordIsTruth]

Judas' repentance was not a godly repentance.

Where does "Scripture say" this?