Grieved over today's events in Charlottesville

[Bro. Curtis]

I have a great Springer. Full size 1911 Mil-spec .45. Milled from billet stainless. But too heavy, when loaded, to carry all day.

Got the exact stainless 1911. Heavy, yes. But I can't think of a better close in self defense weapon.

 

[Alcott]

The context of Jesus comment to take a sword is very particular to the task Jesus told the disciples to do.

Which was what that required a sword?

We later see Jesus denying Peter the act of fighting for him.

And adding that the Father would send thousands of angels for their defense if asked-- but that would contradict the very reason the situation was as it was.

Combine this with the sermon on the Mount and you have a strong argument for non-violent behavior. Now add to this that none of the Apostles and their disciples ever are recorded as fighting to save their lives and we can see a clear pattern in the early church.

And further add that on at least 2 occasions Jesus chased the crooked moneychangers out of the temple with a whip, overturning their tables with coins and animals. Is that an argument for violent behavior?

What earthly treasure do we possess that is worth killing an unregenerate human to keep? I don't understand that thought process.

A temple? [What is the temple-- a structure Jesus violently defended-- in the NT era?] A family?-- would you sacrifice your family members to nevil?

 

[Reynolds]

Got the exact stainless 1911. Heavy, yes. But I can't think of a better close in self defense weapon.

You know Colt 10mm Delta Elite is where it's at. Seriously we can still be brothers, so long as you don't say Kimber.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Also saw David Duke say this on video tape.

Sent from my Motorola Droid Turbo.

David Duke says Charlottesville is 'a turning point' | Daily Mail Online

I would tell David Duke I never heard Trump promise America to ANY ethnic group.

 

[LowOiL]

I don't understand Christians wearing fire arms to protect themselves on the incredibly minimal chance that an evil person comes along. If a person is going to die, why not have it be us who are redeemed? We know that we'd be going home and leaving this foreign land. The other person would be in hell.
I tend to side with Jesus commands in the Sermon on the Mount, which is what we observed in Christianity until Augustine came up with the concept of a "just war."
The US Constitution gives every citizen the right to carry weapons, but that doesn't mean it's the right thing to do for Christians.
I won't tell anyone the can't carry, but I won't personally promote it as biblically sound.

The way I rationalize it is that gift of life was given by the Almighty Lord, to protect something so precious that is God given is not something to be taken lightly. Life is precious to Christians, the exception is when you fortieth that right when you commit evil in wrongly threatening another's life that is also God given.

There is a time and place for everything under the sun... including a time to fight (defend one's life). All lives matter, including Christian lives.


I know this is just a forum and you are throwing thoughts around, but yes, I have thought of your question before and that is how I rationalize gun carrying.

I also want to give a thumbs-up to the person that suggested a good deacon group will have a seating arrangement in church to best protect members of the church. Yes, while Concealed Carrying, thus to cover more area and reduce chance of hitting each other during battle.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Remember when the left wouldn't call Nidal Hassan a terrorist ?

Good times.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

Got the exact stainless 1911. Heavy, yes. But I can't think of a better close in self defense weapon.

Sig 226.

 

[777]

So do I. But I would not curtail their constitutional rights because I don't like them. If I did that I would be as bad as they are.

Metal detectors in school, in courthouses, anywhere - is that not a violation of the 2A to you? Roadblocks and the Fourth? I am just trying to gauge if you are an absolutionist on all of the Bill of Rights, think you are.

Agree that the TSA is worthless and rather jackboot.

And it's not that I just don't like them - most of those groups call for violent revolution, they are openly subversive. Why should the police protect BLM when their whole aim is to kill them all? Not giving them a permit to protest in the middle of a city is not being as bad as what they want to do to their enemies.

Most of them want a race war, they are that angry and unhinged. Count me out.

 

[TCassidy]

Metal detectors in school, in courthouses, anywhere - is that not a violation of the 2A to you?

Yes. All are 2nd amendment violations.

Roadblocks and the Fourth?

4th, 5th, and 6th amendment violations.

I am just trying to gauge if you are an absolutionist on all of the Bill of Rights, think you are.

Yes.

Why should the police protect BLM when their whole aim is to kill them all?

Because that is our job. "To Protect and Serve." We used to be called "Peace Officers." We maintained the peace. Today most LEOs are revenue enhancement agents.

Count me out.

Me too. I am in my 70s. Old. Sick. Tired. And retired.

 

[TCassidy]

Sig 226.

My SIG P-225 is one of two everyday carry pistols.

 

[MennoSota]

Yep. Kinda like us. "Go into all the world and preach the gospel to every creature."

Not sure how this comment supports your will to carry a weapon.

LOL! Peter though he could protect the God of all Creation! Talk about hubris! And that is your "example?" LOL!

LOL, you think you are responsible to save lives, which God is in charge of. We live only as long as God says and we don't die until God determines. Do you really think God needs your gun?

Sorry, but, no. Jesus was not wrong when He told the disciples to be prepared to defend themselves.

Of course he wasn't wrong. What I said is that his command was for a very specific situation, not for all time. The context of the passage lets us know this.

Paul used every legal avenue open to him to protect his life and freedom. And its pretty had for a virtually blind man to use defensive weapons.

First, you are making my point by using God's ordained government to seek justice.
Second, you are making an argument about Paul's sight, which is not fully supported by scripture.
Third, we don't read about any of Paul's companions carrying weapons.

My loved ones are worth defending. If yours are not, do your wife and kids know you don't care enough to defend them?

That's a strawman.
Use the legal system like Paul did.
Make it your goal to follow Jesus teaching is the sermon on the mount. Entrust your family to God's care as He has their lives in the palm of His hand. You are not as important as you seem to imagine.

 

[MennoSota]

The injustice in the legal system is based on wealth, not race.

Wealth is certainly a part of it, but you cannot dismiss a racist system.

 

[Reynolds]

Wealth is certainly a part of it, but you cannot dismiss a racist system.

In the past, sure. I do not see race as a factor today. If anything, minorities are favored. Money grease the legal system wheels.
When I worked in law enforcement, about 80% of my arrests were black males. It was not because I was racist, its because they were the ones who committed the crimes. In the vast majority of the cases, black people were the victims of the crime I was arresting them for. That was during the time when Crack Rock was king. With the rise of Meth, we began seeing many more young white men being arrested. For some reason, Crack hit the black community at an extremely disproportionate rate. Meth seemed to hit white and black about equal.

 

[Reynolds]

That's a strawman.
Use the legal system like Paul did.
Make it your goal to follow Jesus teaching is the sermon on the mount. Entrust your family to God's care as He has their lives in the palm of His hand. You are not as important as you seem to imagine.

Funny. If I come over and rape your wife, are going to watch and call 911?

If I found someone raping my wife, I would kill them dead as a box of hammers and then dial 911. If I caught someone messing with my kids, they would not receive the mercy of a quick death.

 

[carpro]

The injustice in the legal system is based on wealth, not race.

Mostly, but not to the race hustlers.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[TCassidy]

Not sure how this comment supports your will to carry a weapon.

Ya gotta pay attention. Jesus told them to arm themselves while going in harms way. I do the same. QED

you think you are responsible to save lives, which God is in charge of.

Again, you gotta pay attention. Peter tried to protect the God of all Creation. God (the Son) was in no danger. He can take care of Himself.

Do you really think God needs your gun?

God uses means to protect his people. There are many, many instances in the bible where God commanded the use of weapons to achieve His desired results.

Use the legal system like Paul did.

Yeah. After the crime has been committed and a dozen people are dead. Then the court will say "Bad Boy" to the killer and the dead victims will come back to life.

You need to try living in the real world. Jesus gave orders for His disciples to arm themselves. If you choose not to, that is your choice. I chose to do so. And that is my choice.

Time for you to butt out.

 

[MennoSota]

In the past, sure. I do not see race as a factor today. If anything, minorities are favored. Money grease the legal system wheels.
When I worked in law enforcement, about 80% of my arrests were black males. It was not because I was racist, its because they were the ones who committed the crimes. In the vast majority of the cases, black people were the victims of the crime I was arresting them for. That was during the time when Crack Rock was king. With the rise of Meth, we began seeing many more young white men being arrested. For some reason, Crack hit the black community at an extremely disproportionate rate. Meth seemed to hit white and black about equal.

I have a number of Godly friends who are black. In talking with them there is no doubt in my mind that systemic racism is still strong in our society. It is sad and burdensome to hear the stories of mistreatment and prejudice they face. We are far from being just and we need to repent when we support the racist system we live within.

 

[Reynolds]

I have a number of Godly friends who are black. In talking with them there is no doubt in my mind that systemic racism is still strong in our society. It is sad and burdensome to hear the stories of mistreatment and prejudice they face. We are far from being just and we need to repent when we support the racist system we live within.

I don't see it. Sure individuals are racist, but government is not.

 

[MennoSota]

Funny. If I come over and rape your wife, are going to watch and call 911?

If I found someone raping my wife, I would kill them dead as a box of hammers and then dial 911. If I caught someone messing with my kids, they would not receive the mercy of a quick death.

You bring up what-if scenarios. Do you imagine that God is unaware of evil around you and that He is incapable of caring for your family without your assistance?
Would you forgive God if evil fell upon your family?
I do not understand these fears, which I hear from otherwise Godly brothers. Why do we give in to fear when God promises that he is with us and will never leave us? Why let such fanciful fears cause us to neglect loving our neighbor because we are afraid that we will lose what was never ours in the first place. Our families are not for us. They are gifts from God and He can choose to ordain what He wills. Why do we cling so hard to things as though they were an idol in our lives?
Jim Elliot said: "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain what he cannot lose."
Corrie TenBoom said: "I have learned to hold things lightly."

 

[MennoSota]

Ya gotta pay attention. Jesus told them to arm themselves while going in harms way. I do the same. QED

Again, you gotta pay attention. Peter tried to protect the God of all Creation. God (the Son) was in no danger. He can take care of Himself.

God uses means to protect his people. There are many, many instances in the bible where God commanded the use of weapons to achieve His desired results.

Yeah. After the crime has been committed and a dozen people are dead. Then the court will say "Bad Boy" to the killer and the dead victims will come back to life.

You need to try living in the real world. Jesus gave orders for His disciples to arm themselves. If you choose not to, that is your choice. I chose to do so. And that is my choice.

Time for you to butt out.

TC, you have provided poor biblical evidence for your position. I have pointed out that the passage you cling to has a contextual function for a specific situation. It is not a universal command.
You ignore the sermon on the mount. You ignore Jesus comment to Peter and spin it that God didn't need Peter, yet you imagine God needs you to carry a gun. God doesn't need your gun, TC.
I live in a real world where God promises to be with me and my family always. He tells me that I am an ambassador in a foreign land, speaking reconciliation to rebels. He tells me to forgive those who trespass against me just as He forgives me. He tells me not to fear, but to trust Him.
Why are you letting fear keep you from loving the rebels around you.
It's time for you to repent.