How do you know you are saved?

[Particular]

Why?

Do you know why a give responce was not understood?

It makes me sad that someone doesn't understand or know how God is alive and well in our big cities. The fields are ripe for harvest as God brings the world to our doorstep.

 

[37818]

It makes me sad that someone doesn't understand or know how God is alive and well in our big cities. The fields are ripe for harvest as God brings the world to our doorstep.

Are you sure that was the missunderstanding? You do undestand generalizations about any group do not constitue specifics regarding God's working in the lives of individuals?

 

[Particular]

Are you sure that was the missunderstanding? You do undestand generalizations about any group do not constitue specifics regarding God's working in the lives of individuals?

My goodness. Re-read the back and forth. I'm done with this foolishness.

 

[37818]

My goodness. Re-read the back and forth. I'm done with this foolishness.

You never had a responce where one is oblivious to what one had written for which you had given a responced to?

. . God-forsaken American big cities.

 

[Dave G]

This thread sort of de-railed a bit, it seems, so I'd like to see if any of this has happened for others as it has for me.
How do I know that I am saved?

1) The world hates me ( John 15:18 ) for the sake of the Lord.
2) I have many trials and tribulations in this life ( John 16:33 ).
3) Those tribulations work patience ( Romans 5:3 ), of which I've only recently become far more patient than I ever was in years past.
4) I've grown in knowledge and grace ( 2 Peter 3:18 ). Though far from perfect, I know and understand much more about His word than I did just 5-10 years ago, simply by availing myself of two passages: 1 Peter 2:2 and 2 Timothy 2:15.
5) Friends have made comments that they see a change in me over the years.
6) I've gradually experienced the fruits of the Spirit ( Galatians 5:22-23 ) instead of the works of the flesh ( Galatians 5:19-21 ) over the years since my first believing on Christ during the preaching of His word.
7) I've experienced times when I knew that me doing something for someone was definitely His will ( Philippians 2:13 ).
8) I've believed on His Son ( John 3:16, John 3:36, John 5:24 ), and my hope in Him has never left, but only gotten stronger.
9) Instead of falling back into the world and my faith failing, that faith has only gotten stronger as well. I'm now strongly convinced that I am of the 4th "soil" in the parable of the sower ( Matthew 13:3-9 ), which the Lord revealed the meaning of to His disciples in Matthew 13:18-23. In the past, my fear was that I was of the 3rd "soil", and I wouldn't make it through all my trials. I also now understand the "things" that 1 John 5:13 speaks of.
10) I've found that I can read and ( eventually ) understand the Bible apart from reading commentaries and relying on the teachings of men. This shows the work of the Holy Spirit as Teacher ( 1 John 2:20-27 ). However, this took time and serious study, and I experienced frustration because of my lifelong lack of patience ( that has only gotten better over the years ).
11) I began to experience a growing distaste for the things of the world some years back...even as a believer in my teens and well into my 30's, I watched "action movies" and listened to rock and other styles of music...all that has faded over the decades, to be replaced with a strong love for the Lord and His people and an indifference ( or even a strong distaste at times ) towards my former desires.
12) I've come to see, more and more, the Lord as my personal Deliverer in times of trouble... and I know from past experience, that His promise to deliver me ( Psalms 50:15 ) out of those trials is true.


There are many more evidences that I see, but what comes to mind the most is this:

" Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.
2 For by it the elders obtained a good report.
3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear." ( Hebrews 11:1-3 ).

This tells me that true faith ( the kind that endures ) is the substance, the essence of things hoped for...in this case, I hope for a new world wherein dwells righteousness ( 2 Peter 3:13 )...one where my Saviour is, instead of Him being at the right hand of the Father. Like Abraham, I look for a city founded by God, and not of this world's ways.
It also tells me that my faith is the evidence of things not seen...the working of God in me, and the favor of Almighty God upon me.
The more I realize that He has saved me from my sins and His coming wrath, and to Himself for an eternal relationship with Him, has only made me more confident towards Him and in His promises.

Finally, this tells me that the faith that He gave me ( and the Spirit that it came by ) was the source of my being able to believe and understand His word...that God created the heavens and the earth out of nothing, they didn't "evolve" from nothing.

How do I know that I am saved?

Not because a pastor "coached me" or convinced me that if I did something biblical, that it would "settle it" forever.
But because something happened to me during the preaching of His word in 1978, and that "Someone" has never let go of me since then.

He truly is the best Friend anyone could ever have.
If He can save a wretch of a mess like me, constantly disobeying Him and then seeing my sins against Him and failures to obey Him time and again... and coming back to Him in repentance, over and over, He can save anyone.

That's how I know that I am saved.
Because He did it, not me.

 

[mailmandan]

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

 

[Dave G]

1 John 5:11 - And this is the testimony: that God has given us eternal life, and this life is in His Son. 12 He who has the Son has life; he who does not have the Son of God does not have life. 13 These things I have written to you who believe in the name of the Son of God, that you may know that you have eternal life, and that you may continue to believe in the name of the Son of God.

I was reading this as recently as this morning, and it came to me that the "things" spoken of in verse 13, are the things developed prior to John being inspired to write verse 13.
Here are some of them:

1) " Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the Son of God, God dwelleth in him, and he in God." ( 1 John 4:15 ).

2) " If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
21 And this commandment have we from him, That he who loveth God love his brother also." ( 1 John 4:20-21 ).

3) " Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him." ( 1 John 5:1 )

4) " For whatsoever is born of God overcometh the world: and this is the victory that overcometh the world, [even] our faith.
5 Who is he that overcometh the world, but he that believeth that Jesus is the Son of God? " ( 1 John 5:4-5 )

5) " This is he that came by water and blood, [even] Jesus Christ; not by water only, but by water and blood. And it is the Spirit that beareth witness, because the Spirit is truth. 7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.
8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one." ( 1 John 5:6-8 )


6) " He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.
11 And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.
12 He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life." ( 1 John 5:10-12 ).

 

[MB]

Often in the old churches, the songs sung were about salvation and the walk of the believer.
Such songs as:

Savior Like a Shepherd Lead Me,
He Leadeth Me,
All the Way My Savior Leads Me,​

have been relegated to rarely sung in the modern church.
Other songs such as:

Have Thine Own Way,
Come Every Soul by Sin Oppressed,
Lord, Lead Me to Some Soul, Today,​

are just never to be mentioned.

Now this thread is NOT about music, but INDICATORS of a drifting taking place in presenting both the message of Salvation and the Call for Salvation.

I have (in the last 30 years) noticed that as more congregations move into a more contemporary worship style, that not just the music becomes a focus of praising.

Now there is nothing in itself wrong with the theme of praise, but it is becoming almost to the exclusion of a demand for repentance, salvation, and Lordship-submission. It is one thing to praise the Lord for being Lord, and another for the complete submission to the Lord in leading and in mission.

I have noticed that the literature of many Baptist churches are less likely to oblige one to carry their own Bible, and to search the Scripture references for themselves. Rather, the convenience (or whatever excuse used) of printed Scriptures has left many believers unable to find their place, much less be able to cite where a certain book of the Bible is even located. Just ask the typical modern church goer to find Hezekiah 3:16 where the identity of the Beast with the number 666 is revealed.

In the design of the "Sactuary" of the typical Baptist church, there was (in the old days) a table, called an altar, between the congregation and the pulpit. The pulpit was directly behind the altar with the baptistry typically behind the pulpit. Now granted there were some modifications such as the addition of "choir loft" which set either to the side or between the pulpit and baptistry and height so more could actually see the preaching. But the design was not just a matter of architecture in a Baptist church, but had implied meaning. Meaning lost in the "warehouse" stage presentation look.

The modern gathering actually sees no need to come to Christ without confession of sin, without the sacrifice of the worldly life style.

The modern gatherers get to hear the delivery of the message not from a stand in which the sacred text is placed between them and one who delivers, as a symbol that all words must be sifted through the Scriptures and that the Scriptures are the focus. If the modern preaching carries a Bible at all, it is more often laid to the side while a socialization of the word is proclaimed. The preacher becomes the focus not the Scriptures.

Comfortable places to worship has (imo) left folks desiring a comfortable presentation, a comfortable gospel, a comfortable life they think is well blessed by being comfortably enticed by a non-threatening, soft spoken, sweet intoned, well mannered, pep talk.

This thread is devoted to discerning how do you know you are saved?

It is not about salvation as one typically considers its use, but about that which demands compliance.

Does the worship place just by the appearance present salvation appropriately as needing repentance as a sinner proclaiming the Lord as not only Lord of their life, but Lord of their ways?

Does the furniture of the worship, just as the temple furniture, depict that the Word of God is honored above all, that submission before the Word results in a changed heart and newness of mind.

Does the music and the preaching present a Christ not only living in us, but through us and causes the life to be driven farther away from worldly enticements and seeking more and more that which conforms to the Kingdom of God?

How does one know they are saved if all they have is a presentation of the Gospel in which the position of God's word is not primary, in which the repentance by the Word does not lead to the symbolic death of the old and a new life lived in Him, in which the worldly has become so intwined as to make the message appealing and in doing there is no obliging to conform to the truth, in which the emotional is the primary focus?

How does one know they are saved when there is more desire to cheer ungodly athletes than to share the gospel?

How do you know you are saved if you have nothing to bring to the Savior after He has entrusted you?

Do you really know that you are saved when you consider that the Savior rejects those that bring nothing of increase or even of interest when one buries that which He has given? Matthew 25:14-30

This Sunday, who is brave enough to ask this serious question to those who claim to believe?

HOW do you know you are saved?

The Scriptures state, "By their fruits you shall know them."

I was first convinced of the truth of the scriptures by the preaching of the Word and the conviction of my sins by the Holy Spirit. The way I know I'm saved is because I believe in Christ Jesus and His word and His word tells me I'm saved because I have confessed Jesus as my Savior. That He is the Son of God who gave Him Self for me.
MB

 

[37818]

. . . because I have confessed . . .

Trusting a work? Trosting what you did? (Romans 10:9-10 NASB)

 

[agedman]

Trusting a work? Trosting what you did? (Romans 10:9-10 NASB)

The heart believes, the mouth confesses that a change of the heart has occurred.

That is basic psychology and also basic to the presentation of the gospel. Behavioral change never lasts without a core change, and core change always results in attitude and actions. This applies not only to that which betters a person, but also that which enslaves a person.

Example: Ted Bundy was not born a perverted killer, but sin (pornography) settled into his heart and he lived out of that heart.

Matt Baker didn’t set out to spend his life in prison, but his lived out his heart desires. (Deadly Little Secrets - Wikipedia)

Too often the “easy believism - pray this prayer after me” teaching was used from gauging how “right with God” one was, to the excusing all manner of evil excess because, “they are a great soul winner.”

We must all agree that it is by the work of the Holy Spirit using the Word (Christ) in which all saved are indeed, saved.

Romans 10 has been abused into a formula rather than a statement of facts.

Out of the heart come all the issues of life, even that change that has taken place when the core is quicken into the belief expressed of salvation in Him.

 

[church mouse guy]

What was Bundy born as, if you don't mind the question?

 

[agedman]

What was Bundy born as, if you don't mind the question?

A baby.

 

[church mouse guy]

A baby.

Ha!ha!

You sound like the French enlightenment.

Do you say Cain was a baby? Adam was never a baby. What about Judas?

Do you call that an answer? It's not the environment.

 

[agedman]

Ha!ha!

You sound like the French enlightenment.

Do you say Cain was a baby? Adam was never a baby. What about Judas?

Do you call that an answer? It's not the environment.

Tabula rasa was long ago shown to be false. Aristotle and Locke were wrong on many levels.

However, intellect, environment and temperament do play major roles in the perceptions of adults.

The authority to which a person “gives” submission will control that person.

 

[church mouse guy]

Tabula rasa was long ago shown to be false. Aristotle and Locke were wrong on many levels.

However, intellect, environment and temperament do play major roles in the perceptions of adults.

The authority to which a person “gives” submission will control that person.

Still dancing around?

 

[church mouse guy]

Adam was never a baby yet he sinned. He had a perfect environment. Judas Iscariot knew Jesus face-to-face yet he sinned. It must be a bad heart. Man is born a sinner.

 

[Dave G]

It must be a bad heart. Man is born a sinner.

Amen.

" For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:" ( Matthew 15:20 ).

" Do ye indeed speak righteousness, O congregation? do ye judge uprightly, O ye sons of men?
2 Yea, in heart ye work wickedness; ye weigh the violence of your hands in the earth.
3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies." ( Psalms 58:3 ).

 

[church mouse guy]

Amen.

" For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:" ( Matthew 15:20 ).

" Do ye indeed speak righteousness, O congregation? do ye judge uprightly, O ye sons of men?
2 Yea, in heart ye work wickedness; ye weigh the violence of your hands in the earth.
3 The wicked are estranged from the womb: they go astray as soon as they be born, speaking lies." ( Psalms 58:3 ).

Thanks for posting that Scripture about the heart!

 

[agedman]

Still dancing around?

Adam was never a baby yet he sinned. He had a perfect environment. Judas Iscariot knew Jesus face-to-face yet he sinned. It must be a bad heart. Man is born a sinner.

Adam was not born in sin but chose loyalty to his wife rather than trusting God to resolve the trickery. There in he sinned, and took what was forbidden. He chose what we might even (in our sinful flesh) consider the noblest of choices. He chose to die with the one whom he loved rather than choosing the relationship of love with the creator.

Did not Jesus say that unless one hates (a relative term) father, mother, brother, sister...?

Judas of course was born a sinner.

Both became a slave to sin, hiding from God. Judas hiding that which God already knew of him. "Son of perdition (ruin, loss)" the Lord called him.

Christ protected them all except He purposefully did not protect Judas, but such was that the Scriptures were to be fulfilled.

Does not that show the specific and irresistible grace in which one is called, preserved, and presented in comparison to those who are not?

 

[evenifigoalone]

I know I am saved because I had many close encounters with God in my teens, started by one big one that changed my life and much of my behavior. I asked for wisdom as The Bible says to do, and God granted me that in the form of telling me to change my behavior when interacting with others.
I suppose for those who believe you can lose your salvation, it's more complicated.

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