Then you would be wrong.
Right...they left because the RCC became an intolerable farse posing as the true church of Jesus Christ.
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Then you would be wrong.
In what way? To ask you questions like do you love Catholics? How is that bad?
Good. I pray that they are in heaven.
I am not a Baptist. I believe there are people who are spiritually blind, and I believe God considers that too.How? I've had many baptist tell me I'm hell bound. It seems a fair question.
I told you I gave up sins, why do you keep saying I have not.Which you said you haven't since you still sin.
That's not what Jesus said. He said if those parts of your body causes you to sin cut them off. He didn't say if you're still working on your salvation you can keep them.
If you take what Jesus says seriously, then you will seriously start cutting sin out of your life and not your limbs! However, if you make what Jesus says as a hyperbole, then you will not take him seriously, and you will be in danger of hell fire.Yes he does he wants us to stop sinning. But that doesn't mean he wants us to cut off limbs.
That is precisely why most people leave the Baptist faith - they simply do not grasp the truth. For example, you do not grasp the truth that there is no such thing as a justified man by faith without works who is not also a regenerated man whose profession of faith is evidenced by good works (Eph. 2:8-10) without confusing justification with regeneration.
Solid point Bible Boy!
Yes I did question it. I don't know what you think which is why I asked. As I've told you I've gotten that from other baptist. But you are CoC right? I haven't had dealings with the CoC except on this board so it might not have been a fair question. But if you were inundated with Anti-Catholic Chick tracts from a fundamentalist Baptist brother in law who insist I'm going to hell wouldn't you ask the same question?You asked me if I was secretly praying that Catholics go to hell just to find out I am right.
I was questioning the motivation. I wasn't implying that you did that which is why it is phrased in the form of a question. I was implying that could have been a motivation for you. However, since you are offended by it I apologize and take it back. Still in what spirit do you come at Catholic using Anti-Catholic Rhetoric? Note, I don't go around calling other denominations devil worshipers and their pastor are proclaiming the doctrines of Satan. I don't use anti-protestant rhetoric. I pray all protestants are saved and will obtain grace.That is evil thinking about me.
I believe God considers whether someone ever heard the truth, as they never did. Catholics were taught not to listen to others beliefs about God.
Hey so do I. BTW I just remembered that you were CoC.I am not a Baptist. I believe there are people who are spiritually blind, and I believe God considers that too.
because you have admitted previously that you still sin. You gave up some sins but you haven't stopped sinning.I told you I gave up sins, why do you keep saying I have not
Yes with fear and trembling.Paul says to work out our salvation.
Yes it is. It is intentionally strong. But do you think Jesus is actually saying to cut off your arm or is he exagerating the point to give strength to his emphais? I hold to the latter. And since you still sin and still have body parts I believe that is what you actually think as well.Jesus tells us if your hand causes you to sin cut it off better to enter the kingdom of God with one than to have two and thrown in hell. This is a strong statement against sin.
Jesus doesn't say anything about making progress and progress is a relative term progress in relationship to what?If a person were getting sin out of their life, then why would they cut off a body part when they are making progress?
I've been attempting to.Can we reason together here?
Let us reason then. You say you have stopped sinning yet you have had you still sin. Now. What I think you are trying to get at is that you don't commit the same sins you use to but commit different sins. But Jesus doesn't make that distinction either. He's not saying when you stopped the current sin and start a new one then its ok not to cut off your arm. He's saying don't sin period and if a body part causes a sin cut it off. New sins are included in Jesus' discourse. And if its only thoughts in which you sin then cut out your brain following the example if you take it literally. But Jesus was speaking in hyperbole.If I stopped sinning with my eyes, and I feel accomplished with this, and I see it can be done, so then I stop sinning with my hand, and I see this is good, why would I stop there and now just start cutting off body parts?
Exactly! So you don't take him literally either! But you do get the seriousness of sin and Jesus' call for us to cut sin out of our lives!If you take what Jesus says seriously, then you will seriously start cutting sin out of your life and not your limbs!
, Because it is.However, if you make what Jesus says as a hyperbole
Not at all I take that passage very seriously! I try to operate in grace so that I don't fall into sin! Because you are right all sins put you in danger of hell.then you will not take him seriously, and you will be in danger of hell fire
Yes I did question it. I don't know what you think which is why I asked. As I've told you I've gotten that from other baptist. But you are CoC right? I haven't had dealings with the CoC except on this board so it might not have been a fair question. But if you were inundated with Anti-Catholic Chick tracts from a fundamentalist Baptist brother in law who insist I'm going to hell wouldn't you ask the same question?
I was questioning the motivation. I wasn't implying that you did that which is why it is phrased in the form of a question. I was implying that could have been a motivation for you. However, since you are offended by it I apologize and take it back. Still in what spirit do you come at Catholic using Anti-Catholic Rhetoric? Note, I don't go around calling other denominations devil worshipers and their pastor are proclaiming the doctrines of Satan. I don't use anti-protestant rhetoric. I pray all protestants are saved and will obtain grace.
That isn't true as well. BTW more same old misinformation. The Catholic Church teaches that truth can be revealed in some way in faiths apart from the catholic faith but that the truth is fully represented in the Catholic faith.
Which often gets confused with people implying that the Catholic Church muslims and budhist are saved. That is not what the church is saying it is saying that there is some truths in their religion such as it is but that doesn't equate to the fulness of saving truth.
Hey so do I. BTW I just remembered that you were CoC.
because you have admitted previously that you still sin. You gave up some sins but you haven't stopped sinning.
Yes with fear and trembling.
Yes it is. It is intentionally strong. But do you think Jesus is actually saying to cut off your arm or is he exagerating the point to give strength to his emphais? I hold to the latter. And since you still sin and still have body parts I believe that is what you actually think as well.
Jesus doesn't say anything about making progress and progress is a relative term progress in relationship to what? I've been attempting to.
Let us reason then. You say you have stopped sinning yet you have had you still sin. Now. What I think you are trying to get at is that you don't commit the same sins you use to but commit different sins. But Jesus doesn't make that distinction either. He's not saying when you stopped the current sin and start a new one then its ok not to cut off your arm. He's saying don't sin period and if a body part causes a sin cut it off. New sins are included in Jesus' discourse. And if its only thoughts in which you sin then cut out your brain following the example if you take it literally. But Jesus was speaking in hyperbole.
Exactly! So you don't take him literally either! But you do get the seriousness of sin and Jesus' call for us to cut sin out of our lives!
, Because it is.
Not at all I take that passage very seriously! I try to operate in grace so that I don't fall into sin! Because you are right all sins put you in danger of hell.
My prayers are for BOTH of you to see the Gospel truth and hold to just that!
Right now, you 2 are like Jesus saying the blind leading the blind, both going into the ditch!
Biblicist has a fan club I see.
Get ready for Biblicist to knock you on the head if you do not believe everything else he says. Lol
That isn't true as well. BTW more same old misinformation. The Catholic Church teaches that truth can be revealed in some way in faiths apart from the catholic faith but that the truth is fully represented in the Catholic faith.
Which often gets confused with people implying that the Catholic Church muslims and budhist are saved. That is not what the church is saying it is saying that there is some truths in their religion such as it is but that doesn't equate to the fulness of saving truth.
Ive know him in different iterations already & we have tangled from time to time. While I generally agree with him regarding RCC, Im not a fan of some of the tactics he employs....but thats my opinion. And you know what opinions are like. :smilewinkgrin:
A case of the Pot calling the Kettle black if I have ever seen it.
Well, if what you are saying isn't true than that what I will say. It isn't true.Stop saying what I say is not true. I was taught not to listen to other religions.
By whom your family? Not all lay people get the Actual teaching of the Church. In one sense you are right if you leave the Church teaching having been properly taught and turned away from Christ you would be apostate. But thats different from what you previously said. which wasI was told that if I did not believe all what the Catholics taught that I would be apostate.
Certainly we can see that there is some truth in other beliefs but that is not the same as the full truth.I believe God considers whether someone ever heard the truth, as they never did. Catholics were taught not to listen to others beliefs about God.
Well, you were mistaught. The Church Documents actually state that if you weren't properly Catachized and left out of ignorance to lets say a protestant faith that you still may be saved. But if you had invincible ignorance that is knowing the full truth and left the church then you truelly apostated.I was taught that if I left the Catholic Church I would be condemned to hell.
If it is not I will still say it.Not stop saying what I have said is not true.
I think you are right there!
Really...so what's your definition of a real church? :tongue3:
I am not CoC. I have no denomination, not even non-denomination. I am a Christian who belongs to the body of Christ.But you are CoC right? I haven't had dealings with the CoC except on this board so it might not have been a fair question. But if you were inundated with Anti-Catholic Chick tracts from a fundamentalist Baptist brother in law who insist I'm going to hell wouldn't you ask the same question?
I do not get into telling people if they are saved or not. I usually get told by others that I am not saved, and when I measure to them what they measured to me they do not like it.I was questioning the motivation. I wasn't implying that you did that which is why it is phrased in the form of a question. I was implying that could have been a motivation for you. However, since you are offended by it I apologize and take it back. Still in what spirit do you come at Catholic using Anti-Catholic Rhetoric? Note, I don't go around calling other denominations devil worshipers and their pastor are proclaiming the doctrines of Satan. I don't use anti-protestant rhetoric. I pray all protestants are saved and will obtain grace.
I think Jesus is serious about cutting off what cause us to sin. If I did not take Jesus serious, I might not have gotten rid of the sins that I have.Yes it is. It is intentionally strong. But do you think Jesus is actually saying to cut off your arm or is he exagerating the point to give strength to his emphais? I hold to the latter. And since you still sin and still have body parts I believe that is what you actually think as well.
Jesus doesn't say anything about making progress and progress is a relative term progress in relationship to what?
If I am not sinning with my hand, then it means I am not sinning with my hand. It does not mean I traded sins.Let us reason then. You say you have stopped sinning yet you have had you still sin. Now. What I think you are trying to get at is that you don't commit the same sins you use to but commit different sins. But Jesus doesn't make that distinction either. He's not saying when you stopped the current sin and start a new one then its ok not to cut off your arm.
If you are sinning with your thoughts, then you can stop doing that too. The Bible tells us what to think about,And if its only thoughts in which you sin then cut out your brain following the example if you take it literally. But Jesus was speaking in hyperbole.
Its a sound you make with your tongue. Its the equivalent of one shaking their head side to side.
It is. Because its the same rhetoric always used against Catholics. You certainly love your version of Jesus. Do you love me? Do you love Catholic Apologists? Do you love Catholics who disagree with your interpretation of scripture? Or are you secretly praying that we go to hell just to find out you're right?
Nope I read scripture and I obey God. But thanks for the offer.
You haven't as you have already admitted you still sin. You haven't eradicated sin from your life yet.
Honestly, that is good and I congragulate you. Really, however, Jesus says to avoid sin to cut off that body part you sin with and doesn't say if you stop desiring to sin you're cool he said to stop sin not just stop desiring to sin.
I do understand. You say you still sin. You say you take it literally that Jesus wants you to avoid sin by cutting off that part of the body which causes the sin or commits that sin to prevent future sin with that body part. either you don't take him literally or you don't follow what he said.
But you still sin according to you. are you sayiing you no longer sin with your eyes or arms what about your brain? cut that out too.
He absolutely does if you read most bible commentaries.
I think you need to go back to the dictionary. Jesus means what he said in both cases but he used an extreme to make his point. Just as a book doesn't actually weigh a ton neither does Jesus think you should cut off your arm but makes the point not to allow for temptation to sin in your life.
The Catholic religion taught us that, and my parents taught us too.By whom your family? Not all lay people get the Actual teaching of the Church.
No, it is not turning away from Christ, it is turning away from the Catholic’s false teachings.In one sense you are right if you leave the Church teaching having been properly taught and turned away from Christ you would be apostate.
You are sounding contradictory. What I said was clear, that we were taught not to even listen to the false teachings of other denominations, that they taught falseness, or else they would be Catholic.But thats different from what you previously said. which was
Certainly we can see that there is some truth in other beliefs but that is not the same as the full truth.
Well, you were mistaught. The Church Documents actually state that if you weren't properly Catachized and left out of ignorance to lets say a protestant faith that you still may be saved. But if you had invincible ignorance that is knowing the full truth and left the church then you truelly apostated.
Even if you said you can prove it, I would question it, because I have said things to you and you say I am wrong but then you end up saying the same thing I did. What is that? To say I am wrong and then act as if you are correcting me.If it is not I will still say it.
PLEASE! No cutting off of arms and legs!
Just stop sinning. :thumbsup: