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"How I Learned the Doctrine of Election"

Discussion in 'Other Discussions' started by KenH, Apr 25, 2022.

  1. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Notice what it says "he chooses to have mercy" "he chooses to harden". Notice what it does not say He chooses who to save. God is sovereign and He has chosen to save those that freely trust in His son. Why do you continue to ignore that truth? Only God can save and He saves those that believe.
    Joh 3:18 "He who believes in Him is not judged; he who does not believe has been judged already, because he has not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

    Joh 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life.

    Eph 1:13 In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit of promise,

    Rom 10:13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."
     
  2. AustinC

    AustinC Well-Known Member

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    LOL, I highlighted your man-centered mantra. As to Matthew 13 and the parable of the sower, we must understand the parable in light of what Jesus actually teaches and what the rest of scripture informs.

    You keep presenting faith as a man accomplished work that God evaluates and then either credits as righteousness or discredits as not showing up. You have presented your view ad nauseum and everyone tells you that you are wrong. Feel free to be wrong and have everyone disagree with you. Just note that I disagree with you because the Bible disagrees with you.
     
  3. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    So it is a good thing that a person trusting in/having faith in Christ Jesus is not claiming credit for ones salvation. Actually having faith in His son is the one condition God has for our salvation.
     
  4. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    So...this faith of yours...why did you believe and another person not believe? Were you smarter? More brilliant? Luckier? What?
     
  5. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Is this the same God that decided to condemn billions to hell just because He could. Why do you believe God "looked down through the telescope of time and "foresaw" that some fallen members of Adam's race - somehow, someway - would conjure up the ability to have faith". I keep hearing this from you calvinists quite a bit, but I do not hear it from the non-calvinist. God is omniscient so He knows who will freely trust in His son. Reading your post I have to conclude you do not believe what the bible says. Either that or you are just trying to be a troll.
     
  6. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    So...this trust of yours...why did you trust and another person not trust? What made you different than another? Were you smarter? More brilliant? Luckier? What?
     
  7. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    It is a matter of source. Apparently, if I understand you correctly, you claim credit for your faith. I claim that God is the source of my faith because otherwise I would have no Biblical, saving faith. No person has ever or will ever have saving faith unless God grants it to Him as God is the cause of the new birth(regeneration) which precedes believing(John 1:12-13).
     
  8. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    I am not a Calvinist. I do not follow Calvin. I am a believer in salvation by the sovereign grace of God through the finished work of Christ, The LORD my RIGHTEOUSNESS, on behalf of His elect, their sins having been imputed to Him, His perfect righteousness having been imputed to them.
     
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  9. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    Apparently, you don't believe that Christ really meant it when He said, "It is finished." You think it requires you to act to complete the process.
     
  10. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Why do you leave out Rom 8:29
    For those whom He foreknew, He also predestined to become conformed to the image of His Son, so that He would be the firstborn among many brethren;

    God knows who will freely trust in His son and has predestined them to be conformed to the image of His Son.

    For those whom He {God} foreknew, G4267
    He {God} also predestined G4309
    {why} to become conformed to the image of His Son,
    {why} so that He {Jesus} would be the firstborn among many brethren
     
  11. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    So you agree then that man can not save himself, only God can save. What you still deny is that God saves those the trust in His son.
     
  12. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Gods' foreknowledge means that He knows who will freely trust in His son, do you deny this or are you just not sure what foreknowledge means?
     
  13. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    "freely"? Why would some "freely" - by their own fallen will - trust? Are they smarter? More brilliant? Luckier? What?
     
  14. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    God knew from BEFORE the foundation of the world who would have faith, @Silverhair, as He is the One Who gives them faith.
     
  15. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes. I can agree that man has to hear the gospel message and believe the gospel message before God by His grace saves them.
     
  16. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    You got tit wrong as per usual. We heard the gospel and trusted the gospel message and then God saved us. God put us in Christ Jesus because we believed. Eph 1:13
    Whereas you calvinists have to hope that what you think is your faith is actually real. As you like to say, God gave you that faith so you would believe. So it is not even your faith is it.
     
  17. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Not everyone says it is wrong just you calvinists do that. You want people to accept your calvinism rather than the bible. Many on here have worked diligently to point out your errors but you just deny those truths. Your pride is the great stumbling block.
     
  18. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    EXACTLY!!!! As Jonah said, "Salvation is of the LORD." (Jonah 2:9)

    Salvation is of God. It is not of man. It is not some kind of "Divine-human" partnership cooperative effort. It is all of GOD! If it was not all of God, then no human being would be saved.
     
  19. KenH

    KenH Well-Known Member

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    You still haven't answered my question, @Silverhair. What do you claim, in your soteriology, makes a believer believe, or differ, from another? Are they smarter? More brilliant? Luckier? What is claim?
     
  20. Silverhair

    Silverhair Well-Known Member

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    Well if you compare me to the average calvinist then it would seem that I am smarter more brilliant. Does that make you feel better.

    The reality is that I trusted the gospel message not because I am smarter or more brilliant or even lucky. Everyone has the same opportunity when they hear the gospel, accept it or reject it. It is not a matter of brains it is a matter of conviction.
    Now if you want to see who has to be one of the lucky ones to be saved, then just look in the mirror or at any of your calvinist friends. According to your theology you were the lucky ones that God picked out to be saved. You had zero to do with it, you just won the lottery. That luck.
     
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