It is only in your mind.
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How would you define "following God"?
- Thread starter steaver
- Start date
Of course, I love Christ perfectly. Of course, I love all my family perfectly. You say, “If not, it is sin.” Show me the scripture that says exactly that. You cannot show me that scripture, because you do not speak the Word of God. I do not recognize such speech anywhere in the Bible. You sound as if you are repeating some kind of brainwashing as DHK has. You sound like an accuser. Listen to how you speak to me…”If you would be honest and humble.”
Give me an example from one of the Apostles writings that say what you say to me here. Show me the same contradiction that you speak.
What a pathetic decieved human being you are! No truely saved person could ever utter such blasphemy! You are claiming equality with God and don't even reaize what you are saying is blasphemous!
No human can keep the Second great Commandment without keeping the first great commandment which is to love the Lord your God with 100% of your WHOLE BEING 100% of the time because it requires perfect love for God to perfectly love others. You have done neither and you are incapable of doing either.
To love perfectly (and that is what you are professing you do) requires absolute sinless perfection because it means that you NEVER FAIL to treat others as God would treat others and you NEVER FAIL to do unto others what God would do unto them and that you NEVER FAIL to say what should be said to them and you NEVER FAIL to act toward them as God would act toward them and you NEVER FAIL to be to others what you want others to be to you.
The only person that can NEVER FAIL to "love" others in this manner must first NEVER FAIL to love in the same manner the Lord His God with all his being all the time.
The only human being that could claim this truthfully is Jesus Christ. All others who claim this are deceived and liars and completely clueless to the nature of sin.
You are a brute speaking deceiver. You did not speak to me in such a way, but to Peter.
Peter says, “Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth…”
1 Peter 1:22 Now that you have purified yourselves by obeying the truth so that you have sincere love for your brothers, love one another deeply, from the heart.
From what you say here, you have no use for God, and you teach against Him.
Show me those words in the Bible. Do it now or repent. Show me those words EXACTLY in the Bible. For I only speak EXACTLY what the Lord says. Now you do the same and show me exactly.
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: Excellent point. If we paraphrase their words they accuse us of lying or slander, BUT they do it every day with the very Word of God as well as to our words. They tell us the things God commands are impossible, but they never show us plainly from the Word of God that they are. They tell us that the reason why the Word of God says what it does is to simple highlight that we cannot keep it, BUT they never once have shown that from the Word of God itself. We have shown clearly where it says the commands of God are reasonable and we are commnded to keep them. If the truth is as they say, we must demand them to either show us where the Word of God plainly states their position or retract their slander and lies against the Word of God.
It also does not suffice for them to take ONE solitary verse in 1John:8 as the gospel concerning every believer, while ignoring other clear passages to the contrary of the manner in which they interpret this one verse. To deny that the blood of Christ can and does cleanse us from ALL sin, and to suggest that sin must remain or we are liars, is far from the truth of the Word of God. To suggest that we must all continue to sin and that God has not made a way of escape from all sin is to deny the very power of the gospel and the Word of God. Of a truth their arguments are not with us but with the Word of God intself.
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Well, now this is obviously an overstatement...in fact I have just quoted you saying 26 words that make up 3 sentences that the Lord never said...
None of us "only speaks EXACTLY what the Lord says. We all paraphrase it and interpret it. That doesn't mean it's necessarily false, but it could be if we aren't careful...
Example: "God made you, You have sinned, Jesus died and rose for your salvation." There is no where in the bible that says exactly it, but I believe it is an accurate summary of biblical teaching.
I think the question we would like to hear answered from you two is how does this work out in your life?
-The Bible says we are perfect.what exactly does that mean?
-Have you sinned since your salvation?
-If so, does that mean you were NOT perfect for a time, then repented and became perfect again?
-Is it even possible for a believer to sin?
-If a believers sins, do they remain saved, or must they repent to become re-saved?
I sure would like to hear what your family has to say about that. Of course, I am family and you sure haven't loved me perfectly.
What's ironic is that you and HP cannot say if you sin. So we must assume that you believe you do not sin, that you are perfect, like God. But then you will cry out "I never said I was sinless" . Which would mean that you sin!
Which is it? Do you sin Moriah? Just tell us plainly yes or no and this will all be cleared up.
I am giving you the Truth, how much more love is there?
So you are giving me the truth with perfection, just like Jesus did? Basically, all you have said to me has been said with perfection and perfect love? Is this your claim?
Heavenly Pilgrim
New Member
HP: You missed the mark on both ends. First, you can assume anything you so desire, but when one goes from assumption to personal attacks, lies and slander, charging one as saying something they did not, such a one would be in error.
Now if one desires to keep silent for any reasons they might have, it does not prove the point you say it does, i.e., that they must sin. Are you saying that if Christ did not answer one for whatever reason, it would be proof of sin in His life? I think not, neither is your assumption based on fact but again on your mere assumption that well end up as wrong.
God will judge myself Steaver, and he will judge Moriah and yourself as well. We serve a just and Fair Holy God that will judge correctly in our lives. Be patient. We shall all most likely know the fate of others in the end. Patience is in order, NOT leveling false charges or jumping to unwarranted conclusions.
Now on the other hand, if one tells us they sin everyday, well that is a different story. We have their own testimony as to the life they live, and have every right to examine such a testimony in light of Scripture. Maybe it would have been wiser on some of their parts to use a little more wisdom before telling us they sin on a daily basis. Maybe they should have asked God to help them live a more consistent life of holiness before telling us all about the sin in their lives.
It is God who has said we have sin. You say you do not. I agree with God, you do not. So who is it here between us that is following God on this point?
I stand by what I say.
Do you think that Jesus did wrong when he called people dogs, vipers, and liars?
Why do you think you can judge me as speaking to you in a sinful manner? I have not cussed at you, or cursed you. I have not said you should go to hell.
Why do you not stop accusing me of sins here? Would you try to stop doing that to people you debate?
Don't you see how you cannot answer the most basic questions which would prove your points? Just answer plainly, are you perfect? Are you without sin? Answer these simple questions and your points will be established as applicable. Otherwise, you lose the debate by default.
You accuse me of sinning in my answers to you. Can you stop doing that or not?
First, there is no accusation on Steaver's part. He is asking you to answer some simple questions.
Second, you are the one that is accusing him. Your accusatory words go like this:
"Why do you think you can judge me as speaking to you in a sinful manner?"
He is not judging you. He is asking you some simple questions that you refuse to answer.
You are wrong DHK.
This what Steaver said to me in post #50:
So you are giving me the truth with perfection, just like Jesus did? Basically, all you have said to me has been said with perfection and perfect love? Is this your claim?
Now, if you do not mind, I would like to debate Steaver. Now, why do you not go and check out what Biblicist has said to me that is wrong, or do you just like to gang up wrongfully on HP and me?
Do you see the question mark behind what Steaver said?
It is a question. One you apparently haven't answered yet.
So the question remains: Why do you have such a hard time answering his simple questions. That is not harassment; it is not accusations; it is simply an attempt to find out where you stand. Why not answer him?
Don't be rude.
If he is not satisfied with your answer then you haven't answered him.
Try again.