If it's new it ain't true

:laugh: And the world didn't end!

 

12 "I have much more to say to you, more than you can now bear. 13 But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own; he will speak only what he hears, and he will tell you what is yet to come. 14 He will bring glory to me by taking from what is mine and making it known to you. 15 All that belongs to the Father is mine. That is why I said the Spirit will take from what is mine and make it known to you. - John 16

Not trying to debate this point, because I agree with it in part. I don't believe the spirit would speak to us in a way that contrasts with scripture, but I do believe he can and does speak to us at times when we aren't reading the scriptures. And I believe he can and does prompt us to do things, speak to others etc.

Do you think John 16, quoted above, was unique to his apostles, or do you believe it applies still to us today?

 

Probably so. But just remember that how you say something really does matter. When you pound people over the head, they rarely listen.

 

Moses was the first Calvinist I am aware of:thumbsup:He wrote the first five books, the teaching is there.:wavey:

 

That's apples and oranges.

He was the leader of the chosen nation. That has nothing to do with chosen individuals, especially gentiles.

John the cultist

 

Oh puuuleeeese!


Yes, God chooses people and nations for His specific purposes, but He offers salvation to everyone. Even Gentiles could convert and become part of Israel.

 

And thank you!!! AmyG
Moses spoke of God as creator ,sustainer, redeemer and judge....He spoke of the fall and how death came to Adam,and us in adam,He spoke of the covenant promise of the seed that would come ,and those in Him.
Sounds like a calvinist to me.....Noah found GRACE in the eyes of the Lord,
God hath appointed me another seed...
God chooses people,and nations, and individuals among the nations for salvation...Alot of Paul's teaching...[calvinism} is quoting Moses {rom}9
so Moses the first to write calvinism openly,before it has been systematized.:wavey::wavey:

 

You're correct. And He wanted to know more about the God who judged some, showed grace and mercy to others, to which Moses was witness, yet still desired to know God in a greater way, while this same God said "...and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy."

 

Hello cultist friend...:laugh: Moses wrote the first 5 books....he wrote about the godly line , the seed of the woman.....that is chosen individuals my friend,
oh yes...calvinism...he wrote of jacob and Esau.....
Paul learned from Moses: calvinism:

 

You are so welcome! :1_grouphug:

But we ALL believe those things, not just Calvinists. :thumbsup:

 

Luke, there is new and there is NEW.

Universalism is new.

Mormonism is NEW. What's the difference? Mormonism adds to scripture (you know the whole gold plated book of mourn-ah-Mormon).

Universalism has been bandied about probably as long as Calvinism. Both are interpretations that come from scripture itself.

C/A has been debated for centuries and will be debated until we are sitting in the clouds and God settles the argument once and for all.

New isn't the point. The point is: does it agree with scripture? Does the interpretation agree with generally held ideas of theology?

History isn't going to settle some of the arguments. It can be of some help, but most of what we argue about is just window dressing anyhow. C/A? It's not gonna change our destiny. We've already made the decision to follow Christ, however we came to it. Young earth/old earth/big bang. Same thing. Not gonna matter in the end.

What matters is what we do with Christ. What matters is that we preach Christ crucified and risen again. When we add or take away from that fact, then we are lost and the history of the idea, the length of time that idea has been around won't make it better. Wrong is wrong no matter how long it goes on.

 

Stray Dog

Exodus 19:4-6

4 ‘You yourselves have seen what I did to Egypt, and how I carried you on eagles’ wings and brought you to myself. 5 Now if you obey me fully and keep my covenant, then out of all nations you will be my treasured possession. Although the whole earth is mine, 6 you[Or possession, for the whole earth is mine. You] will be for me a kingdom of priests and a holy nation.’ These are the words you are to speak to the Israelites.”

Exodus 22:
21 “Do not mistreat or oppress a foreigner, for you were foreigners in Egypt.

Leviticus 19:34
The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

Deuteronomy 10:19
And you are to love those who are foreigners, for you yourselves were foreigners in Egypt.

Deuteronomy 31:12
Assemble the people—men, women and children, and the foreigners residing in your towns—so they can listen and learn to fear the LORD your God and follow carefully all the words of this law.

Exodus 12:48 “A foreigner residing among you who wants to celebrate the LORD’s Passover must have all the males in his household circumcised; then he may take part like one born in the land. No uncircumcised male may eat it. 49 The same law applies both to the native-born and to the foreigner residing among you.”


I praise God that He made a way for a non-elect stray dog like me. I can not lift myself that high that i deserve election apart from Christ who is my salvation, and I will praise all His work..

 

Thank you for posting those verses Psalms. :thumbs:

 

Ok, then did ALL of the Jews go to heaven?

Wasn't the "chosen" the nation of isreal?

If the chosen were individauls then why did they have to obey so many laws to find favor with God to get into heaven?

It seems to me that the children of Isreal were given a choice to worship God or the golden calf. If they were "chosen" as individuals then how were they able to make the choice to worship the calf in the first place?

But mostly, tell me if the Jews were "Chosen" as individauls and not as a nation, then is every dead Jew now in heaven?

John (I have left the cult, thanks Brother Don)

 

Actually universalism can be traced back to Origen, whereas Calvinism can only be traced back to Augustine.

 

Paganism is older than Christianity, but it's not true.

Although I did see the most evil bumper sticker I have ever seen in my life at the grocery store here in Maine. IT said "Paganism gave birth to Christainty"

I wanted to throw up.

But you have to understand that Maine is probably the most atheistic, liberal, pot smoking hippie state in the union. The few that do go to church are mostly RCC.

We need more missionaires here.

John