In Context reading of scriptures

[Seth3]

Paul was not an "in context" reader. He knew how through the Spirit to rightly divide the word of truth and scripture captures his example (seen in the footnotes).


For example in just a single chapter in Romans Paul uses "only verses" pulled from variuos books. In no order whatsoever, or with what might be judged today as not reading "in context".

The Chapter referred to here is Romans 10:1-21

Lev 18:5 jumps to Duet 30:12-14 jumps then to Isaiah 28:16 jumps again Joel 2:32 then goes back to Isaiah 52:7 then skips up to Isaiah 53:1 he then jumps back into Psalms 19:4 again jumps to Duet 32:21 then finally back to Isaiah65:1-2

There are other examples as well, this is a vivid one.

But here is a perfect example of How the Spirit in Paul chose to share from the Old Testament scriptures, though some tell you its not reading in context, you really have to talk to the Holy Spirit about that because He's not interested in being directed, His Job is to Teach and direct all of us.

Paul would be reproved today if his example was used in proving anything scripture. Take the verses he quotes from these books and read from each one within its "context" and you'd wonder where on earth he came up with what he did using the natural mind and its reasonings and methods.

Some argue,"well that was Paul He was the apostle". But we too have been given the Spirit in Christ (those who are in Him) to know what God freely gives us. If the Spirit left his footprints through this example used by Paul would anyone fail say that if Paul was alive today that his approach would be considered heresy and "twisting" of scripture, "out of context" as some call it?

If one were to be as a "Berean" to search to see if what Paul was saying was true, all these references would need to be gone through and the LIGHT of it is in Pauls revelation and within HIS CONTEXT.

So as the Bereans were of more Noble Character for searching these things out. The truth of who these are in Spirit are as "kings" in Gods eyes in so doing.

Proverbs says, "It is to Gods GLORY to CONCEAL a matter but the GLORY of KINGS to SEARCH IT OUT.

The treasures of the knowledge of Christ hidden in Gods foreknowledge and brought forth by the teaching and leading of the Holy Spirit.

If anyone is interested heres an interesting link on the subject as well

Click here for Rightly Dividing the Word of Truth

God bless

Seth3

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by Seth3:
Paul was not an "in context" reader. He knew how through the Spirit to rightly divide the word of truth and scripture captures his example (seen in the footnotes).


For example in just a single chapter in Romans Paul uses "only verses" pulled from variuos books. In no order whatsoever, or with what might be judged today as not reading "in context".

The Chapter referred to here is Romans 10:1-21

Lev 18:5 jumps to Duet 30:12-14 jumps then to Isaiah 28:16 jumps again Joel 2:32 then goes back to Isaiah 52:7 then skips up to Isaiah 53:1 he then jumps back into Psalms 19:4 again jumps to Duet 32:21 then finally back to Isaiah65:1-2

The Book of Romans is one of the most organized books in the Bible. It discusses the theme of soteriology in great detail. Paul, at no time picks out verses in any chapter at his own will, willy-nilly, at random. The Holy Spirit guides Him exactly what He wants to Paul to write. This is the very Word of God, what God wants us to hear. It is the very opposite of the way that Seth and Me2 present their ideas of Scripture—pulling verses here and there out of random and then giving them some kind of Gnostic meaning. Paul is totally opposed to this kind of teaching, but rather uses the O.T. Scripture to support his N.T. teaching.

The Book is divided into three basic parts. The first is:

A. Doctrinal (chapters 1-8)
1. In the first chapter he explains how all gentiles are under sin.
2. In the second chapter he explains how all Jews are under sin.
3. In the third chapter he explains how both Jews and Gentiles are both under sin.
4. In chapter four Righteousness is defended and justification is established.
5. In chapter five we have the results of righteousness.
a. In the last half of the chapter there is an important part of how God makes man righteous.
6. Chapter 6—Personal sanctification includes death to sin; and being alive in Christ.
7. Chapter 7 reveals a struggle with the flesh (the old man vs. the new man)
8. Chapter 8 is a glorious chapter dealing with the believers victory over sin.

B. Dispensational (chapters 9-11)
1. Chapter 9-- The sovereign election of Israel in God's plan for the nation.
2. Chapter 10-- The human responsibility of Israel in God's plan for the nation.
3.Chapter 11--The Final Restoration of Israel According to Divine Plan

C. Practical (chapters 12-16)
1. Chapter 12--The will of God revealed in relation to God, self, and others
2. Chapter 13--They were to be obedient to civil authorities
3. Chapter 14--Ethical matters are discussed.
4. Chapter 15.-- The will of God revealed in relation to one's ministry.
5. Chapter 16—The Conclusion of the epistle.

This is a very general outline of the epistle to the Romans. I could have given you a much more detailed one, going verse by verse. But for our purposes on this board I thought that this was sufficient to show that Paul was very organized in the way that he constructed his epistle. He wasn't just willy-nilly, putting forth whatever came to mind, as L. Ray Smith seems to be.

The allegorical approach to Scripture is the gnostic approach to Scripture. Gnosicism is a heresy which John, in his first epistle exposed.

Here are a couple of reviews of L. Ray Smiths works and/or website.

"Exposing Those Who Contradict." L. Ray Smith rants and raves with sophomoric sarcasm against the doctrine of eternal punishment. He also insists evil was "created" by God. He seems to have a particular vendetta against Dr. James Kennedy. This would be amusing if it were not so thoroughly unbiblical. (Phil Johnson)

[This is the second email Ray received from a Florida Bible College student named Robert]

Just a note. I am sorry I did not mean to get you upset. But the class of Comparative Religions is not only interesting but demanding. I perhaps should have worded it better.

My professor says hello also. He had the other students visit other web sites also. We view your web site directly in class.

But he did tell me to tell you that your doctrine is contrary to Billy Graham, Billy Sunday, D.L. Moody, Charles Wesley, Charles Spurgeon, the Fist Apostles Creed that was established in 70 A.D., but most important Jesus Christ and the Scriptures.

But your doctrine and he quotes your web site in class, goes along with Charles Taze Russell, founder of Jehovah Witness, Joseph Smith, founder of Mormon or Latter Day Saints, Mary Baker Eddy, founder of Christian Science and Sun Young Moon founder of the Unification Church.

Though you may not consider yourself a cult you have many of their doctrines that go against the Scripture and that these known cults hold fast too. He uses your material on power point slide presentation to show the manner people go completely off the Scriptures by criticizing men of the Gospel.

He asked me to ask you if you have reached the Gospel as these men on the Internet that you criticize. Or if you have led these many as they to the Lord. Your response, as the last one was, will be read in its entirety to the class.

http://www.bible-truths.com/student.htm

As you can see they are not very complimentary. I went to the link that you provided, and read much of the sermons that he wrote. I couldn't believe all the heresy that he espouses. No wonder anyone who reads his material would become confused. He doesn't even know the way of salvation, and could not explain to someone who inquired of it. His views on many basic doctrines, such as the trinity, were totally irrational. This is a man who is a heretic who must be avoided at all costs. And lest you point your finger at me for judging him, go to his website and read the venom that he spews out against Dr. James Kennedy and John Hagee, for being false teachers in this world, even false teachers as representative of evangelcal doctrine that is taught in all the evangelical churches in the world today. This is what gnosticism is. He is right and everyone else is wrong. He has the secret "spiritual" meaning to the Scripture, whereas the other leaders of Christianity do not. He is a gnostic.
DHK

 

[Seth3]

DHK says,

The Holy Spirit guides Him exactly what He wants to Paul to write.


Seth3 replies,

Thats all I needed. Thank you DHK.


So we can see looking at Paul (Using the Old Testament) Just HOW he was led. Its like the footprints of the Holy Spirits leading were footnoted by men. Showing in the scriptures themselves from where Paul himself was "led" by the Spirit Himself. Its remarkable. Even God through the scriptures has left us an example of what it means to rightly divide and how the Spirit teaches us through Pauls example.

Christ and Him Crucified is the simplicity of the gospel.

For correction purposes L Ray Smith did NOT write the above link as is misrepresented by another His Name is Mike Vincent (Might be off on the last name). Whatever a "Gnostic" is I don't know what that is, though I am accused of it. Christ and Him crucified, and the blessing of Christ in us is what I believe in.

God Bless

Seth3

[ November 22, 2004, 09:16 AM: Message edited by: Seth3 ]

 

[steaver]

Sorry Seth, but we are not Apostles who have a direct vocal voice coming in from Jesus Christ.

We are warned (by Paul, a true apostle ) about those claiming to have this type of communication with God.

"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ" (2 Cor 11:13)

I would be very careful about those placing themselves on this level of "apostle". It goes on to tell us of their end.

God Bless!

 

[Seth3]

Steaver,

False Christs and false appostles spoken of here are shown in the proceeding verses and the verses in between and following. No one is claiming "apostleship" as you seem to imply. I've already said on another thread that Paul was the appostle of the Lord and the 12 stones are already set in the book of revelation.

Lets look (and read in between) I pulled verses showing who Paul is speaking of.


2Corinth 10:8 For though I should boast somewhat more of our authority, which the Lord hath given us for edification, and not for your destruction, I should not be ashamed:

2Corinth 10:12 For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.

2Corinth 10:17 But he that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

2Corinth 10:18 For not he that commendeth himself is approved, but whom the Lord commendeth.

2Corinth 11:12 But what I do, that I will do, that I may CUT OFF OCCASION FROM THEM which desire occasion; that WHEREIN THEY GLORY, they may be found even as we.


2Corinth 11:18 Seeing that MANY (not few) GLORYafter the FLESH

2Corinth 11:19 For ye SUFFER FOOLS GLADLY, seeing ye [yourselves] are wise.


Heres what they were doing IN CONTEXT OF PAULS CONVERSATION

2Corinth 11:20 For ye suffer, if a man bring you into BONDAGE, if a man DEVOUR [you], if a man TAKE OF YOU, if a MAN EXALT HIMSELF, if a man SMITE YOU IN THE FACE.


They were glorying in their flesh not Paul
2Corinth 11:30 If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities.


Now look who Paul might glory in (interesting)


2Corinth 12:1-10 It is not expedient for me doubtless to glory. I will come to visions and revelations of the Lord.

I knew a man in Christ above fourteen years ago, (whether in the body, I cannot tell; or whether out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth such an one caught up to the third heaven.

And I knew such a man, (whether in the body, or out of the body, I cannot tell: God knoweth

How that he was caught up into paradise, and heard unspeakable words, which it is not lawful for a man to utter.

Of such an one will I glory: yet of myself I will not glory, but in mine infirmities.

For though I would desire to glory, I shall not be a fool; for I will say the truth: but [now] I forbear, lest any man should think of me above that which he seeth me [to be], or [that] he heareth of me.

And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.

For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.

Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.


Adding nothing to these they speak for themselves. In other places throughout scripture it speaks of those glorying in their "flesh". Their fruits are evident, they devour, smite you in the face, take of you and exalt themselves over you. As Jesus said they "Lord over them" but NOT SO WITH YOU as even Paul within His context shows His authority given was for edification not for destruction. The Yoke of Bondage is clear in Acts it was the Law of Moses. Smiting you in the face is exactly what happened to Christ by those sitting in Judgement in the seat of Moses (Glorying in the flesh) Is the justifying one self by the law and judging each other (expressed by smiting them in the face) is seen.

If you guys are going to nail me with "context" please start using it here. Paul is the one who defines the context. If anything you have imposed your own thoughts over what Paul was even talking about here.

God Bless

Seth3

 

[Me2]

Seth3,

the writer mentioned is mike vinson. an excellent writer.

mike vinson website

L Ray Smith website

Ive just recently read articles (not the first time either) from both. may I suggest reading mike vinsons "Strong Delusion" or "The law of Moses vs th Law of the Spirit".. or L Ray Smith article covering "the lake of fire" series. (and determine your own opinion.)

of course D__ would not want you to read "rightly dividing the word" written by vinson. one might discover d__ is just an opinion of Ones viewpoint.

D__ is following his standard replies. insinuate and obviscate. shuck and jive. and the last ditch effort...call everyone that disagrees with HIS OPINION a gnostic. in the least a heretic.

(as if anyone knows what this means OTHER than D__ and his own opinion.)

notice all the indepth scriptures in His insinuations?

if one reads L Ray Smith responses to this particular writer (robert..whoever)
Smith details his response WITH Scripture in depth.
ad nauseum. Why? because anyone that thinks their somebody must meet the same standards of understanding scripture. and there are many called (a blind student) but few chosen (a leader who sees). this standard God has established is only being proven time after time. the many will not get it for God sends them strong delusion.

L Ray Smith as well as Mike Vinson both can see VERY Clearly.(IMHO)
but dont take my word for it..visit their sites. read their articles for yourself before You make a judgement that might expose who you are!. (try the spirit to see if it is of God.)

Me2

 

[Seth3]

Me2 I agree I love the scriptures and understanding the words of our Lord. I appreciate in them the their careful handling of them and labour of showing from "everywhere" in scripture,in both Old and New etc all the truths as laid out in Gods word. Not just a single verse but many.

I'm adding these here as well (for thought)

John 7:51 Doth our law judge [any] man, BEFORE IT HEAR HIM, and know what he doeth?

Acts 23:3 Then said Paul unto him, God shall smite thee, [thou] whited wall: for SITTETH TO JUDGE ME after the law, and commandest me to be SMITTEN CONTRAY to the law?

Romans 2:27 And shall not uncircumcision which is by nature, if it fulfil the law, JUDGE THEE, who by the letter and circumcision dost transgress the law?

James 4:11 Speak not evil one of another, brethren. He that SPEAKETH EVIL of [his] brother, and JUDGETH HIS BROTHER, SPEAKETH EVIL OF THE LAW, and judgeth the law: but if thou judge the law, thou art NOT A DOER of the law, BUT A JUDGE

Mat 23:2 The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat.


God Bless Me2

Seth3

 

[Seth3]

P.S

Someone quoted from a "second letter" not "the first" and from it is said this

But your doctrine and he quotes your web site in class, goes along with Charles Taze Russell, founder of Jehovah Witness, Joseph Smith, founder of Mormon or Latter Day Saints, Mary Baker Eddy, founder of Christian Science and Sun Young Moon founder of the Unification Church.

Seth3 replies,

Now in the link provided above by this person you can read his very lengthy reply to the charges so that the man is given his chance to explain himself.

But I do believe we should stay on the "topic" at hand which always gets led astray somehow by diverting from the topics to accusations and I truly wish to discuss the topic only and according to scriptures alone.

As we were admonished to do this by the moderators themselves. Unless there is another rule change we are unaware of, I pray only that we be advised of these rules before they change that we might keep in step with them.

God Bless

Seth3

 

[tamborine lady]

Seth and Me2,

As I was reading this thread, I began to think of all manner of answers, but as I read on, you two had aswered just about everything.

Peace,

Tam

 

[Me2]

Tamborine lady,

it is indeed as though we're tuned in...

I too read seth3 posts closely. I find many times...wow I was thinking exactly the same idea and hving the same scripture seth3 posts to back up my own viewpoints. I just lean back and say that the lord speaks to groups of peoples at time. and not just one individually.

Mat 18:19 Again I say unto you, That if two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 18:20 For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.

just goes to show ya. you dont have to be in the same room to be sitting at the feet of the master.

we're just loving the truth and seeking it together. Tamborine lady. welcome to the class

In His Name

Me2

 

[Seth3]

"Peace" back at cha Tam (don't cha love getting a little clarity?)


God Bless you

Seth3

 

[Seth3]

Me2! Amen is this not true? Its identifying our own hearts searching in another. Hearing the same thing taught to us in private before the Lord in someone else who sits at His feet.

Great observation, never thought to express it that way. I feel the same way in your posts, said differently but in accordance with the same Spirit. The Lord has added to my learning through you as well.

God Bless you brother

Seth3

 

[Me2]

Seth3,

As you and I relate with each others language. we are all receiving the "same" revelations. both in word and understanding.
interestingly we find many also receiving the very same revelation, yet their tongues are different in expression. almost defining their individual personalities as they are living witnesses to what they comprehend and know to be truth.

When we come together to covenant together. we all bring a dish for each other to taste. my bread and wine is your bread and wine, if you accept it. I accept your bread and wine, if it is pleasing to my palate.

we help each other for convinience sake. we help each other grow by providing additional food we might not have "picked" from the tree of life that day..we are indeed helping each other harvest for ourselves and our meal for the day, from Our Longsuffering and merciful Provider.

When we read articles written of others. there is a time delay between when we received the revelation of wisdom in some regards. mind you we are learning to say the same things in another tongue. we are continually building our "language base".

today when I read others articles. I already know of the revelation and can express thought and doctrine in my own tongue. yet Im constantly finding others with tongues speaking the same understanding through revelation yet differently.

reminds one of the tower of Babel. the breaking apart of the tongues of mans understanding.
salvation is the rebuilding of the "temple". bringing together the many tongues that make man whole again.
We know its not the rebuilding of carnal mans tower. but it is the temple of the Lord we are building.

1Pe 2:3 If so be ye have tasted that the Lord [is] gracious.
1Pe 2:4 To whom coming, [as unto] a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, [and] precious,
1Pe 2:5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

Me2

 

[gb93433]

To say what the author of the link said is to say each person can have his own private revelation and call it scripture. Sounds just like Mormonism and any other theology that is changing such as progressive dispensationalism.

2 Peter 1:20,21 says otherwise.

2Peter 1:20,21, "But know this first of all, that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one's own interpretation, for no prophecy was ever made by an act of human will, but men moved by the Holy Spirit spoke from God."

 

[Me2]

gb93433,

with that scripture posted. Did the prophets of old speak their own individual interpretation. or did the speak wha the holy spirit intended to be said exactly word for word.

2Pe 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:
2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2Pe 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake [as they were] moved by the Holy Ghost.

a more sure word of prophecy..the indwelling resurrected spirit of Jesus Christ within the believer. the day star within us. Is it the spirit speaking and interpreting or our carnal minds as it thinks what is being expressed.

is God the potter and is he molding each individual. GOOD AND BAD.

then we are individuals with individual designs made by the potter himself. we are discovering this design and being amazed as it unfold itself before our eyes. God is sovereign, not man. It brings to mind that even God controls mans tongues.
Is it man who builds Gods temple?.Is it man who creates himself to be a sturdy stone?.
each individual is a precious stone purposefully designed as an individual as well as to act as an individual. yet still within his purposed design.

2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.

this statement is speaking of each verse requiring an accompanying verse to back up it claim of truth.

no one verse can stand alone in it interpretation.

not that one person can tell you an interpretation and it be false. each person is a living testament with many verses within themselves.

peter is speaking of interpreting scripture rightly. with accompanying proof from the resource of using another verse of scripture.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

here is a perfect example. the lake of fire is the second death. one statement. we need another scripture to define further truth verifying this statement concerning "lake of fire=second death".

take your e-bible. type in lake of fire. or second death and we find addition and verifying truth backing up the statement of rev 20:14 "Lake of fire=second death". or better yet. read L Ray Smith article. he'll give you pointers with scriptural verification concerning the very scripture and rightly interpreting scripture with verifying scripture. or..read mike vinsons article of rightly dividing the word. it further brings to the surface 2 pet 1:20 in a clearer understanding.

Me2

 

[DHK]

take your e-bible. type in lake of fire. or second death

I don't have to type it in. I know where it is. Here is what it is says, and here is what both Ray Smith and you deny vehemently:

Revelation 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet are, and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Revelation 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

You both believe in universalism. You both believe that there is no eternal punishment for the wicked. You have taken these verses and disregarded them (perhaps thrown them out of your Bible). The Bible has only one meaning of "and shall be tormented day and night forever and ever." The context of the passage requires that the same fate awaits those in verse. There is eternal torment. It is stated plainly in verse 10. But you, through allegorization, do not believe the Bible.
DHK

 

[Seth3]

Heres some more on this as well Me2 they have to make one think.

Isaiah 28:15 Because YE HAVE SAID, We have made a covenant with DEATH, and with HELL are we at agreement; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, it shall not come unto us: for we have made LIES our refuge, and under FALSEHOOD have we hid ourselves:

Isaiah 28:18 And your covenant with DEATH shall be *DISANNULLED (MADE VOID) and your agreement with HELL SHALL *NOT STAND; when the overflowing scourge shall pass through, then YE SHALL BE TRODDEN DOWN BY IT.

1Corinth 3:13 Every man's work shall be made MANIFEST: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be REVEALED BY FIRE; and the FIRE shall TRY EVERY MANS WORK of what "sort" it is.

Is not my WORD a FIRE?

1Corinth 3:14 If any man's work ABIDE which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward. (Wise and foolish builders= foolish builders house FALLS, wise builders HOUSE STANDS)

Listen closely (1Corinth 3:18 LET HIM *BECOME a FOOL, that HE *MAY BE WISE.

1Corinth 3:15 If any MANS *WORKS shall BE BURNED, HE SHALL SUFFER LOSS: but HE HIMSELF SHALL BE SAVED; YET SO BY FIRE. (Rev 20:18) and they were judged every MAN according to *THEIR WORKS.

Rev 1:18 I [am] he that liveth, and was dead; and, behold, I am alive for evermore, Amen; and have the keys of hell and of death.

Rev 20:13 And the sea GAVE UP the dead which were in it; and DEATH and HELL DELIVERED UP the dead which were IN THEM: and they were judged every man according to THEIR WORKS.

Rev 20:14 And DEATH and HELL were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Hab 2:5 HIS *DESIRE AS hell, and IS AS death, and CANNOT BE SATISFIED

Prov 27:30 Hell and destruction are NEVER FULL; so the EYES OF A MAN are NEVER SATISFIED.

(Better to have ONE EYE?) Eye is the Light of the body. (Eye for an EYE?)

Job 26:6 Hell [is] NAKED before him, and destruction hath NO COVERING. Compare Isaiah 28:15 and under falsehood have we hid ourselves: (Where did NAKED Adam and Eve HIDE?)


Psalm 139:8 If I ascend up into heaven, thou [art] there: if I make my bed in hell, behold, THOU ART THERE.

Amos 9:2 Though they dig into hell, THENCE shall MINE HAND take them; though they climb up to heaven, thence will I bring them down: (Either way He's there)


Also Notice Jesus telling overcomers they would NOT BE HURT of the SECOND DEATH=Lake of Fire. The Second death has NO POWER over them.

Now compare this picture with the picture of Daniel (Three men in the fire and the forth like the son of man). Here when they were cast into the fire they were walking around in it. The wording is similiar in this picture as it is with the "second death". It says THEY HAD NO HURT and the FIRE HAD NO POWER OVER THEM. Both pictures concern "bowing to an IMAGE" (form of godliness? they were not "buying" perhaps?

Our GOD IS A CONSUMING FIRE and so is His Word, as a fire infolding into itself.

Lake (WATER) of FIRE. Peter says BY THE SAME "WORD" comparing the flood (symbolizing the baptism that SAVES) to that which is reserved unto FIRE which paul says SAVED YET SO BY FIRE.

Its the SAME WORD. Water and Fire.

Notice also the men who got TOO CLOSE to the fire were completely CONSUMED BY IT (Our God is a CONSUMING FIRE). Works burned but saved YET SO BY FIRE.

If anyone was NOT FOUND (Though Jesus seeks to FIND the ONE LOST and rejoices when its FOUND. One wonders if He cannot find that lost person.It would mean He failed. Love never fails.

Love bears NO RECORD of wrongs.

God bless

Seth3

[ November 22, 2004, 01:57 PM: Message edited by: Seth3 ]

 

[DHK]

Seth:
I noticed you started a thread that asked a legitimate question:

If a Woman is married and years later comes to know the Lord as her savior. Must she submit unto her husband in all things if the husband is not being abusive but has strong opionons which are not her own?

Then, ironically, you asked others (pastors and teachers) do give you advice on how to solve this dilemma.

Why did not the SPIRIT lead you into all truth as you claim it does? You have lied. You have shown your true colors here. You need others who know the Bible, who can expound the Scriptures properly, who know how to rightly divide the Word of truth, to give you the right answer. You couldn't come to the right answer yourself. You had to pose this question to others because you didn't have the answer to it.

Your willy-nilly allegorical method of gnosticism doesn't work in the real world. It doesn't solve problems. It only leads into heresy. The "spirit" that leads you is another spirit, not the Spirit of God. The Spirit of God never leads into heresy as has been spouted off on this board. It never leads into venemous attacks as has been demonstrated on this board (see "doves dung and babies boiled"). It is not the Spirit of God that is leading in the gnosticism that you claim to have. You are not being led by the Holy Spirit of God, but by another spirit. The fruit is obvious--false conclusions about Scripture, damnable heresies, and plain confusion.
When you want real answers you go to teachers (whom you claim you don't need) on the board. Don't you sense that something is wrong?
DHK

 

[Seth3]

DHK,

That WOMAN was ME. I was following your advice to ask and recieve the permission of others according to the councel of God if staying out of church for those reasons was valid. In fact I had hoped you would join the discussion, but apparently you felt the answer given was justified or you would have jumped on that one to correct the women I sought counsel from.

Please can we stay on the topic of the thread as you have corrected us before in this.

So actually I never felt the need to indulge you on the privacy of my affairs and I have not lied but stay with my present position I have always felt led to. (It was really to get you off my back about it, I hope that helps you).

You keep accusing me of something called gnostic, and claiming that I have claimed this. I have said nothing of the sort.

So YOU are saying the Spirit I have is evil? Just say it then. You believe the Spirit in me is evil and not of God am I correct? Knowing that if you speak a WORD against the HOLY SPIRIT (even by mistake) it will not be forgiven you, in this age. If your sure please do come out and say so.

Thank you

Seth3

 

[DHK]

Originally posted by Seth3:
DHK,

Please can we stay on the topic of the thread as you have corrected us before in this.

Thank you

Seth3

The topic here is "rightly dividing the word of truth." I have just given you a very good example of how the Bible cannot be rightly divided given the approach that Ray Smith takes to the Scripture. It only leads to heresy and confusion, but no real answers to the problems that people have.
DHK