In Defiance of Christ’s Teachings Right Wing Evangelicals Become Gun Toting Maniacs

[carpro]

We would expect no less from Crabby. He simply being true to form and as always shows his complete ignorance of sound Biblical interpretation and application. His Bible must be the Leftist's Study Bible..You know the one with an introduction to world peace written by John Kerry.

It was written by an unbeliever who is also a Mahayana Zen-Buddhist.

Where does he get all this trash?

 

[Crabtownboy]

We would expect no less from Crabby. He simply being true to form and as always shows his complete ignorance of sound Biblical interpretation and application. His Bible must be the Leftist's Study Bible..You know the one with an introduction to world peace written by John Kerry.

Did not Christ say and does not scripture teach:

• Blessed are the peacemakers
  
• Do unto others as you would have them do to you.
• Those who live by the sword die by the sword.
• Do not be anxious for anything.
• I will trust and not be afraid.
• Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
• Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all.
• And a harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.
  

So, please answer, where is it taught that we are to carry weapons into services worshiping Christ?

 

[Salty]

Did not Christ say and does not scripture teach:

• Blessed are the peacemakers

• 
  [*]Do unto others as you would have them do to you.
  [*]Those who live by the sword die by the sword.
  [*]Do not be anxious for anything.
  [*]I will trust and not be afraid.
  [*]Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
  [*]Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all.
  [*]And a harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.

so are you advocating that the United States does away with its military and police forces?

 

[Crabtownboy]

[/LIST]
so are you advocating that the United States does away with its military and police forces?

Salty! Salty! The topic is carrying weapons into worship services, not national defense. Come on friend, I expect better understanding, not necessarily agreement, but understanding of the real topic from you.

 

[Tom Bryant]

So, please answer, where is it taught that we are to carry weapons into services worshiping Christ?

The same place it says not to - nowhere.

There's your answer. So where does it say that we are heretics if we do?

 

[sag38]

I am not living by a sword. I am not anxious. Carrying a pistol, concealed, is not a sign that someone is afraid or violent. Just because someone is concealed carry does not make them a warmonger or take away from them being a peace maker. You are simply making false assumptions based on your erroneous interpretation of the scripture.

In the end we will have to see who is right because you and I will never see eye to eye on this issue. In the meantime, you go to your church and I will go to mine.

 

[Revmitchell]

Hey! Here are some fun facts!


Ready?


1. Standing there like silhouette at the shooting range is not making peace.

2. Carrying a gun for personal protection does not keep one from making peace.


Now! Go and do the right thing.

 

[Crabtownboy]

The same place it says not to - nowhere.

There's your answer. So where does it say that we are heretics if we do?

Thanks for a good honest answer. Now if that is the case and looking at the teachings and how Christ lived his life in relationship with with others which side of the question do you think he would come down on in the context of this discussion?

 

[Tom Bryant]

Thanks for a good honest answer. Now if that is the case and looking at the teachings and how Christ lived his life in relationship with with others which side of the question do you think he would come down on in the context of this discussion?

No, you don't get another question until you answer the question we have been asking. Where does it say we are heretics? Stop dithering and act like a man and answer.

 

[Yeshua1]

There has been a shift among evangelical Christians of late to openly oppose everything Jesus taught and commonplace to openly judge people, withhold sustenance from the hungry, deny healthcare to the infirm, and harbor hate based on race, religion and sexual orientation. They have also been fierce advocates for guns that appears to be a fundamental principle defining evangelicals and belies their Christianity they claim spurs them to do “the lord’s work.” The new “American Christianity” has adopted Old Testament lessons of vengeance, massacres, slavery, and intolerance and summarily rejected Christ’s teachings of peace, charity, and concern for humanity. Oddly, pseudo-Christians do not even follow the Old Testament’s Mosaic Law they cite to justify their hatred towards gays, mistreatment of women, and their gross misconception of when a fetus becomes a person. They do not even adhere to the scriptural Ten Commandments they claim should replace the U.S. Constitution.

Although they violate most of the Ten Commandments, they are particularly guilty of sacrilege for disregarding the 4th commandment. It says, “You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or serve them” (Exodus 20:4-6, Deuteronomy 5:8-10). The evangelicals claiming to be “real Americans” show reverence for, devotion, and service to the American flag with its likeness of “anything that is in heaven above” (50 stars). The faithful also eat pork, shellfish, wear mixed fabrics, work on the Sabbath, and violate most of the Mosaic Laws leading a skeptical person to believe their claim to follow their holy book is one of convenience and not devotion to the scriptures.

It is irrelevant, really, why so many Americans claim they adhere to Christianity when they hardly adhere to any of their bible’s tenets, but it is relevant that they use that designation as their divine right to impose their harsh form of Christianity on the rest of America, including other Christians. Doubtless, their religion’s namesake, Jesus Christ, would condemn their rejection of his simple commandment to “love your neighbor as yourself,” and the Old Testament god would condemn them for violating most of the Ten Commandments. The real Christians in America, and there are many, and real clergy, there are few, should condemn them for disparaging their shared faith; particularly the Texas preacher advocating open-carry sidearms and frightening people in the name of his real religion; the 2nd Amendment and the National Rifle Association.

http://www.politicususa.com/2013/08...ngs-wing-evangelicals-gun-toting-maniacs.html

So you would be saying that God has changed his mind regarding things such as Homeosexuality, and that He would advocate us being under no laws, so lets just have wide open borders, and have Government feed and cloth all people, and provide health care for all, regardless that the means to do that much better is through capitalism and free markets, and through Christians and those of concerned helping others apart from government?

Do you also see it no problem to have those who work hard and willing to help others, forced to "share their wealth?', instead of allowing to have the economy grow as it ahould be?

 

[church mouse guy]

Thanks for a good honest answer. Now if that is the case and looking at the teachings and how Christ lived his life in relationship with with others which side of the question do you think he would come down on in the context of this discussion?

Did you know that Heaven once had a war and that Lucifer lost and was thrown out of Heaven?

To be really pure--as you suggest--the church would have to ask that the police never answer any calls from the church or arrest anyone who attacks a Christian. In other words, the church should just let the wolves take down all the sheep at will, huh? Maybe the church should just tell the jihadists in your town, Crabtown, that the best time to get even for the crusades that Obama mentioned would be on Sunday morning as the church does not believe in self-defense but does believe in suicide by criminal and jihadist, not to mention Hindu and Shinto.

You first, Crabtown.

 

[Crabtownboy]

No, you don't get another question until you answer the question we have been asking. Where does it say we are heretics? Stop dithering and act like a man and answer.

To me carrying a weapon into a church service denies the following scripture:

Blessed are the peacemakers
Do unto others as you would have them do to you.
Those who live by the sword die by the sword.
Do not be anxious for anything.
I will trust and not be afraid.
Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all.
And a harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.

To deny, that is to deny it by not living it is heresy. I use the meaning of heresy as a controversial or unorthodox opinion or doctrine. Defending carrying weapons to a service of worshiping Christ is, to me, controversial and unorthodox. I have never, until very recently, ever, anywhere in the world heard anyone suggest that carrying a weapon to a worship service is proper and within the teachings of Christ or in keeping with the way he treated others.

So, which side of this issue do you think Christ would come down on?

 

[Tom Bryant]

I think Jesus would ask to see my Glock. And compliment me on making a good choice of a self-defense weapon.

And I would say "thank you. I bought it with the money you gave me the energy to work hard for. It was bought to make sure that my family and friends were safe from the world the leftists have created by their stupidity."

1 Timothy 5:8 - Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

 

[just-want-peace]

Crabby:

--------So, which side of this issue do you think Christ would come down on?

I think we can see which side He "comes down on" by looking at the past massacres!
Now just use a little common sense and decide why He allowed these to be killed!!!!
Would He have "disarmed" a carrier so the death toll could remain; or could (would?) He have used a carrier to immediately stop the slaughter?
Of course He could have stopped the slaughter anyway, BUT He didn't.
Seems to me that if you are going to put God on the spot to condemn those who would carry in the church, why not blame Him for not stopping the one(s) who DID carry into the church
Oh, and Crabby, don't ever lock your car, or home doors, or drive following the traffic signals, yada, yada, yada - IOW at least be consistent.

 

[Crabtownboy]

I think Jesus would ask to see my Glock. And compliment me on making a good choice of a self-defense weapon.

And I would say "thank you. I bought it with the money you gave me the energy to work hard for. It was bought to make sure that my family and friends were safe from the world the leftists have created by their stupidity."

I respectfully disagree. Can you show me any examples from his teachings or life that support your belief?

1 Timothy 5:8 - Anyone who does not provide for their relatives, and especially for their own household, has denied the faith and is worse than an unbeliever.

A very liberal interpretation of that verse. There is nothing in that verse about a worship service.

Here is how a commentary described the meaning of that verse:

The apostle was speaking 1 Timothy 5:4 particularly of the duty of children toward a widowed mother. In enforcing that duty, he gives the subject, as he often does in similar cases, a general direction, and says that all ought to provide for those who were dependent on them, and that if they did not do this, they had a less impressive sense of the obligations of duty than even the pagan had. On the duty here referred to, compare Romans 12:17 note; 2 Corinthians 8:21 note. The meaning is, that the person referred to is to think beforehand ( προνοεἶ pronoei) of the probable needs of his own family, and make arrangements to meet them. God thus provides for our needs; that is, he sees beforehand what we shall need, and makes arrangements for those needs by long preparation. The food that we eat, and the raiment that we wear, he foresaw that we should need, and the arrangement for the supply was made years since, and to meet these needs he has been carrying forward the plans of his providence in the seasons; in the growth of animals; in the formation of fruit; in the bountiful harvest. So, according to our measure, we are to anticipate what will be the probable needs of our families, and to make arrangements to meet them. The words “his own,” refer to those who are naturally dependent on him, whether living in his own immediate family or not. There may be many distant relatives naturally dependent on our aid, besides those who live in our own house.

And specially for those of his own house - Margin, “kindred.” The word “house,” or “household,” better expresses the sense than the word “kindred.” The meaning is, those who live in his own family. They would naturally have higher claims on him than those who did not. They would commonly be his nearer relatives, and the fact, from whatever cause, that they constituted his own family, would lay the foundation for a strong claim upon him. He who neglected his own immediate family would be more guilty than he who neglected a more remote relative.

http://www.studylight.org/commentary/1-timothy/5-8.html

Putting 5:8 into context we can see it has nothing to do with carrying or now carrying weapons to worship services. Indeed, it has nothing to do with worship services at all. Here is a description putting the verse in context:

Instructions Concerning Widows
Here is a scene that is played out far too often in our churches today. A woman (or man) loses a mate to death. After a few weeks' flurry of attention, she finds it more and more awkward to fit into relationships that had once been natural. Friends, feeling uncomfortable or embarrassed around her, do not know how to relate, and she finds it difficult to relate to them. Her grown children have their own lives to get on with. Gradually, she eases toward the periphery of the church.

Yes, I am aware that this is not always the case, and it is certainly not a problem limited to the church. But when it happens in the church, the heads of even unbelievers shake in amazement and scorn. And they will ask, whether hypocritically or not, the questions that our behavior was supposed to have answered, and answered well. Where is Christian compassion? Where is Christian love for one another?

From the time of Israel's inception, God has been known as the defender of widows (Deut 10:18; 24:17). "Justice" among God's people was measured in part by the treatment of widows (Is 1:17). God's compassion for the widow became the covenant community's responsibility, which the early church naturally took up (Acts 6:1; Jas 1:27).

The present passage is the Bible's most extensive treatment of the subject. Through instructions to Timothy, Paul addresses the issue of community support for widows. At the same time, the widow is encouraged to make positive contributions to the church's ministry.

The passage reflects a fairly advanced system of care--a "roll" or "list" of widows eligible for support (v. 9). But the system was being abused; families of widows were not shouldering their responsibility, thus placing financial strain on the church. Then certain younger widows, who may have managed to get on the list, were threatening the church's reputation by involvement with the false teaching and scandalous behavior. The instructions address three related topics: the identification of the honorable widow, family responsibility for widows, young widows.

https://www.biblegateway.com/resources/commentaries/IVP-NT/1Tim/Instructions-Concerning-Widows

 

[Revmitchell]

Did not Christ say and does not scripture teach:

• Blessed are the peacemakers
  
• Do unto others as you would have them do to you.
• Those who live by the sword die by the sword.
• Do not be anxious for anything.
• I will trust and not be afraid.
• Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you,
• Repay no one evil for evil, but give thought to do what is honorable in the sight of all.
• And a harvest of righteousness is sown in peace by those who make peace.
  

So, please answer, where is it taught that we are to carry weapons into services worshiping Christ?

These have nothing to do with protecting one self from muderers. The use of these for that ideology is to rip them out of context. Couldn't be more inappropriate.

 

[church mouse guy]

Do the police protect your church, Crabtown? If so, isn't that just as bad as carrying a gun to church (which might have saved a lot of lives in Charlotte, or would you have been against that, too?).

 

[InTheLight]

I use the meaning of heresy as a controversial or unorthodox opinion or doctrine. Defending carrying weapons to a service of worshiping Christ is, to me, controversial and unorthodox.

That's not the traditional definition of heresy. Heresy is an unorthodox CORE doctrine, not any unorthodox doctrine. Unless KJVO, not using musical instruments in worship, or women wearing slacks (just to name a few) is heresy in your book. Likewise, carrying weapons is hardly a core doctrine.

 

[church mouse guy]

So blacks should not carry guns to church to protect themselves from the KKK? Or is it just whites that should be disarmed in church?

 

[Tom Bryant]

I'm out of this conversation.we are never going to agree. I believe Jesus would carry. After all he brought a whip to the Temple.