Is a little alcohol alright with the Bible?

. . .when you say "Drinking has caused destruction of life, I choose not to based on the Bible and my convictions," you are right, and you INSPIRE others to follow in your footsteps.

When you say: "I wish others would follow in my footsteps," you may even CONVICT some.

When you say "I follow the Bible and you don't," and the Bible gives wisdom and yet leaves room for discretion, you fight from a weak position and you win nobody.

Not an accusation, just general experience learned.

Brett

 

Just as soon as you address my entire posts of the last 20-some pages across multiple threads. You ignored more of my posts than I can keep track of.

Everything has already been explained, multiple times. Why should I believe another repetition is going to make any difference?

 

Oh, the irony...

I am not sidestepping it. The answer is already given in black and white for you to read. *You* are sidestepping *that*.

 

My view was posted on page one of this thread and, as yet, has gone unanswered (possibly because I limited myself to what the Bible said, and not heartrending stories of abuse and destruction).

[ October 09, 2002, 11:19 AM: Message edited by: Ransom ]

 

Wine was a permitted part of a celebration that was commanded in the Law. If drinking wine (or other fermented beverages, as the Law clearly says) was sinful, why would God command his people to do so on a yearly basis?

If drinking wine is sinful, then why does this God-inspired praise song list wine amongst the many gifts of God? Indeed, why does it associate wine with the very necessities of life such as vegetation, bread, and animal fodder?

2. Thirst.

Bread and wine was an everyday meal; bread to fill the stomach, wine to satisfy the thirst. If drinking wine is sinful, then why does the Scripture mention this meal so matter-of-factly; furthermore, how could such a sinful drunkard like Melchizedek ever be considered a type of Christ?

Of course, this is figurative language, using water, wine, and milk as metaphors for God's grace. But that only raises the question: if drinking wine is sinful, then why in the first place would God invite people to drink spiritual wine to satisfy their spiritual thirst? (Imagine if the verse had instead said, "Everyone who is lonely, come to the brothel and satisfy yourself without cost and without price." Same thing.)

3. Ceremonial.

Again, if drinking wine is sinful, why would God a) permit the Israelites to keep vineyards; b) offer this sinful beverage on his holy altar?

5. Medicinal.

Self-explanatory advice, given under inspiration by an apostle. Clearly the medicinal use of wine is not sinful.

5. Aesthetic appreciation.

By saying that some wine is better than other, this passage says implicitly that the purpose of wine is not simply to get drunk, but that evaluating its taste and quality and other such properties are also appropriate uses of wine. The Bible approves of wine-tasting, in other words. If drinking wine was sinful in the eyes of God, how could the steward even have made such a judgment (how would he know?), and why would Holy Scripture take such an evaluation for granted?

I could also add Jesus' matter-of-fact use of the new wine/old wine tasting analogy in Luke 5:39. For a God who supposedly thinks wine is intrinsically sinful, Jesus seems altogether too casual with everyday examples like this, it seems to me.</font>[/QUOTE]Just in case page 1 is somehow inaccessible to some.

 

C.S. Murphy said:

I do wonder why he would waste his typing finger to announce that he has already answered when it only takes a few keystrokes to type YES or NO.

Because my view is more complex than simply answering YES or NO to your loaded question.

Because I already stated my views on alcohol very early in the thread and I grow weary of having people tell me what I believe, when I wrote it all out in longhand.

Because I would expect someone who claims to know what I believe to have read what I believe.

That being said . . . are you going to keep pretending to know my beliefs on alcohol better than me?

[ October 09, 2002, 04:50 PM: Message edited by: Ransom ]

 

C.S. Murphy said:

Ransom once again if I have mistated your stance then why not straiten me out.

It's in the post Optional was so kind to copy for your convenience.

*boggle*

 

YES

NO

Murph, I think you are the only one on this forum who hasn't got it by now. You are a moderator, please put this thread out of its misery.

 

Give it a rest Murph. I have spent way too much time explaining it to you already, I'm not going to continue trying. Seriously. You can stop asking now. Because I give up. Really. Stop. Please. I can spend no more time helping you understand.

And I honestly don't understand why you even care what I believe. I honestly don't believe you are even sincere in wanting to understand my comments on this subject anyway. So drop it, this isn't going anywhere. Deal with it.

Edit: Whoo hoo! page 14!

[ October 10, 2002, 02:54 PM: Message edited by: BrianT ]

 

No, it tastes better with Italian food.

 

When you drink alcohol--it puts your brain in prison. It is a mind inhibitor! Your brain is not free to act and think!

OOOHHHHH! But when I get my mind on Jesus--He releases my mind to be like His!! I am free to think like He thinks!

So, is a little alcohol alright with the Bible? Not if you want to think like Jesus! You can't think like Jesus when something is in your brain that inhibits it--even if its just a little bit!

Your friend,
Blackbird

 

Not that anyone will care but, any amount of alcohol will affect you in some way. You may not care but, I do not want my thinking clouded in anyway.

Note the follwoing:

The effects of alcohol are directly related to the concentration (percentage) of alcohol in the blood; however, the effects vary among individuals and even in the same individual at different times. In the following description, the blood alcohol concentrations (BAC) are those that would probably be found in a person weighing about 150 pounds:

At a BAC of 0.03% (after about one cocktail, one glass of wine, or one bottle of beer), the drinker will feel relaxed and experience a slight feeling of exhilaration.
At 0.06% (after two cocktails, two glasses of wine, or two bottles of beer), the drinker will experience a feeling of warmth and relaxation; there will be a decrease of fine motor skills and he or she will be less concerned with minor irritations.
At 0.09% (after three cocktails, three glasses of wine, or three bottles of beer), reaction time will be slowed, muscle control will be poor, speech will be slurred and the legs will feel wobbly.
At 0.12% (after four cocktails, four glasses of wine, or four bottles of beer), his or her judgment will be clouded, inhibitions and self-restraint lessened, and the ability to reason and make logical decisions will be impaired.
At 0.15% (after five cocktails, five glasses of wine, or five bottles of beer), vision will be blurred, speech unclear, walking will be unsteady, and coordination impaired.
At 0.18% (after six cocktails, six glasses of wine, or six bottles of beer), all of the drinker's behavior will be impaired, and he or she will find it difficult to stay awake.
At a BAC of about 0.30% alcohol in the blood (after 10 to 12 drinks), the drinker will be in a semi-stupor or deep sleep. Most people are not able to stay awake to reach a BAC higher than 0.30%.
If the BAC reaches 0.50% the drinker is in a deep coma and in danger of death. As the alcohol level reaches 1% in the blood, the breathing center in the brain becomes paralyzed and death occurs.

This came from: http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~cas2/fact15.shtml

If you have one glass of wine you are under the control of wine. I would rather be under the control of the Holy Spirit.