Is Harry Potter and Narnia good for the church?

[fatbacker]

I have never read the Chronicles books but have seen and heard enough of the HP, Lord of the rings and wizard of Oz to denounce them all.

I have read all of the books relating to Lord of the Rings before I was saved and even to this day I rememeber how well written it was and how I got so involved with the books.

But the day we have to use sourcery and witchcraft to convey God's word is the day I throw my bible in the trash.

Yes I do denounce the OZ, HP and Lord of the ring by the discernment givin me by Jesus Christ.

I have yet to read a story or read a parable from Jesus or a proverb from Solomon that uses sourcery to get God's message across. In fact there was a sourcerer in the book of Acts who sought the power of the Apostles and offered to buy the source and later repented of his ways and served God.

 

[TexasSky]

I grew up reading things like, the Lord of the Rings, A Wrinkle In Time, Alice In Wonderland, and The Wizard of Oz. I saw Bewitched, and I Dream of Jeannie and I never once thought, "Oh this is cool, I can become a witch or have great magical powers."

My children have read Harry Potter, and they do not now, nor have they ever, talked about even wanting to have magical powers. If you actually read the books you'll find that magic has caused Harry Potter nothing but trouble.

On the other hand though - I have known children who are involved in the Occult. The majority of them started out reading the daily Horoscope in the paper, then moved on to Ouija Boards and Tarrot Cards. Some were into television shows about "real life psychics". Others were huge fans of people like Madonna.

Children should know the difference between fact and fiction. If they don't. The parents failed.

The wildest, most ungodly people I have ever met in my life came from the most sheltered environments. They are kids who had the real world hidden from them, instead of kids who were taught to deal with the real world. As adults they didn't have a clue how to deal with the real world, nor did they have the ability to distinguish between "over-reacting parents" and "real concern." They lost faith in their parent's ability to judge right from wrong, and decided that everything their parents taught was an over reaction. They had to find their way back to middle ground with a lot of hard work and prayer.

A lot of them got into things they shouldn't have because they wanted to know what Mom and Dad were making such a big deal of.

If you sit down and read WITH your child, you can go, "Oh, this is a cool story, but of course God disapproves of witchcraft." If you DON't sit down and read with your child, if you just said, "Reading this will turn you into a witch." Eventually your child will look around and go, "Geeze, I don't know ANYONE who turned into a witch because they read that book. My Mom and Dad must have lied to me."

 

[fatbacker]

The only way I can see legitimizing using sourcery and spells and sootsaying in a story is if the whole point is to get people to turn from their ways and to turn to Christ.

 

[Eric Rolen]

its as specific as it is stated. Film makers have one purpose in mind. Money...

What do you tell achild that asks: If i can watch HP why cant I watch the other witchcraft movies?

What about the trailors these children are subjected to when they go see these movies?

while bible believeing christians are teaching their child discernment, what about those children in there who are not taught discernment of these movies?

I believe that these theatres are not condusive to a christian environment furthermore I believe it hardens one's ability to discern between whats morally right and wrong. This is only my opinion. God Bless

 

[TexasSky]

Just out of curiosity - how many of you actually know someone who decided they wanted to grow up to become a witch or wizard after reading Harry Potter?

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by fatbacker:
The only way I can see legitimizing using sourcery and spells and sootsaying in a story is if the whole point is to get people to turn from their ways and to turn to Christ.

Okay then, you will need to denounce Lord of the Rings, Oz, and Narnia.

 

[Eric Rolen]

Originally posted by TexasSky:
Just out of curiosity - how many of you actually know someone who decided they wanted to grow up to become a witch or wizard after reading Harry Potter?

I dont think this is the issue. I think this issue is if you open them up to this, it opens them up to other paths of immorality

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
its as specific as it is stated.

That's not good enough. You said the producer and directors of Narnia also make "vile and perverse". Which producer and director are you referring to, and which "vile and perverse" films are you referring to. Lacking specifics, you're simply engaging in rumor and gossip, a scripturally forbidden activity. Additionally, the argument comes off sounding like the KJVOist arguments who condemn the NKJV because its publisher, Zondervan, also prints secular books.

Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
This is only my opinion.

Then be convinced in your own mind, and kindly refrain from implying that anyone who does not share your opinion is wrong on the topic.

 

[Eric Rolen]

Originally posted by Johnv:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by fatbacker:
The only way I can see legitimizing using sourcery and spells and sootsaying in a story is if the whole point is to get people to turn from their ways and to turn to Christ.

Okay then, you will need to denounce Lord of the Rings, Oz, and Narnia. </font>[/QUOTE]Denounce them then.

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
Denounce them then.

At least you're consistent. You're the first person to denounce the Narnia series of books on this board.

 

[Eric Rolen]

Originally posted by Johnv:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
its as specific as it is stated.

That's not good enough. You said the producer and directors of Narnia also make "vile and perverse". Which producer and director are you referring to, and which "vile and perverse" films are you referring to. Lacking specifics, you're simply engaging in rumor and gossip, a scripturally forbidden activity. Additionally, the argument comes off sounding like the KJVOist arguments who condemn the NKJV because its publisher, Zondervan, also prints secular books.

Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
This is only my opinion.

Then be convinced in your own mind, and kindly refrain from implying that anyone who does not share your opinion is wrong on the topic. </font>[/QUOTE]I have never implied anyone being wrong with their opinion. That is why i stated it was only my opinion. Are we not allowed to post our thoughts on the subject on here? Im not trying to push my agenda on anyone. Im sorry if that is the case.

 

[Eric Rolen]

Originally posted by Johnv:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Eric Rolen:
Denounce them then.

At least you're consistent. You're the first person to denounce the Narnia series of books on this board. </font>[/QUOTE]I denounce the liberal filmaking more than i would say that i denounce a series of books without thoroughly studying them.

 

[fatbacker]

?????????????????

Texas you are the second one to make no sense whatsoever.

Here is what you said : If you sit down and read WITH your child, you can go, "Oh, this is a cool story, but of course God disapproves of witchcraft."

How can it be a cool story if God disapproves of it? The whole Harry Potter series does things God knowingly disapproves of.

Sourcery in Harry potter
Sourcery and forseeing the future in Lord of the rings.
Witchcraft in the wizard of oz ( good witch bad witch) all bad.


One of you really needs to answer my question.

Why would God ever want one of His children to use these types of sorcery filled books to get His message across?

This is not a retorical question. If one of you liberally minded HP,Narnia and Rings fan won't answer the question then you really need to think about what your approving in. Oh yeah, no answering the question with a question.

Texas, just because you do not know anyone who has not turned to the occult from reading books like this does not mean it does not happen. Look at the role playing games that use magic and sorcery. Dungeons and Dragons was huge amongst teenagers and young children and alot of them god sucked into it. There are countless games and video games that use sorcery and magic in them and people spend billions on the stuff. You cannot tell me it is harmless.

 

[Eric Rolen]

My point is that if a film maker will make a christian and a secular movie. What are their goal? money. If a book publisher or author will publish or write both a christian and secular book what are their goals? Money. Where does God's will come in as a factor in their priorities?

 

[TexasSky]

Fatbacker,

No contradition.

Harry Potter is about a bunch of kids in funny hats running around waving wands at trolls.

That isn't the real occult.

By reading the book with my child, bringing in God's word about witchraft, and explaining to my child the difference in the silly stuff in Harry Potter vs the real occult I've had an important discussion with my child, relating it to something they DO understand, and going into great depth.

I've had the chance to say, "This is a fun book, but it isn't real. There are no trolls, there is no one who can take a piece of cat hair and the juice of a plant and turn themselves into someone else. There are though, people who make God furious by trying to become witches. Those people are NOT like the kids in this book. They are NOT people "born with magical powers" they are people who use Satan to disobey God."

This then lead to a long discussion of the dangers of horoscopes, tarrot cards, ouija boards. The fact that sometime in their life they will encounter people who are calling themselves white-witches and druids, and how what those people practice is dangerous and it is NOT a cute fiction story.

Now - what did your "Harry Potter is sinful don't read it" conversation give you the opportunity to discuss with your child?

 

[fatbacker]

I think I already denounced those things John. I did state already that I have never read the Narnia series.

My reply is again to Texas who has never really spent any time with people who consider themselves real witches and warlocks. The fact of the matter is that they are really out there and the number is growing. No one but them know why they turned to sorcery and spells but these movies certainly do not show any reason for them not too and that can be just as dangerous.

You need to google the words: witchcraft, sorcery and magic and see what you come up with.

Sorcery: 3,260,000 results
Magic: 131,000,000 results
Witchcraft: 6,390,000 results
Witch craft: 7,220,000 (space used between witch and craft)

Jesus Christ: 25,000,000 results
Harry Potter: 65,000,000 results
Lord of the Rings: 17,500,000 results
chronicals of narnia: 34,000 results

 

[fatbacker]

Sorry Texas I used the bible to get my point across not Harry Potter, you should try it.

 

[TexasSky]

What you don't seem to understand is that a book about a little boy with a terrible scar on his head that hurts, who is attacked by trolls and who flies on dragons and who plays ball by flying on a jet-powered-broomstick 60 feet in the air is NOT going to be the thing that introduces your child to witchcarft. Unless your child is REALLY stupid.

Because your child will KNOW that broomsticks are NOT jet powered, that they never fly, that you don't play ball 60 feet in the air, that they are NOT going to have to fight trolls in their bathroom with just a stick made out of wood and a phoenix feather.

What WILL introduce your child to the occult is the kid next door who believes that the horoscope in the daily paper is real, or the advertisement that promises your child they can win the lottery if they pay $9 to get the right numbers from the psychic, or the kid in his class who says, "I can predict the future, let me teach you how."

What WILL introduce your child to the occult is the college professor who brings a Wiccan into class, or the Discovery Channel's "haunted mansions" or a slumber party with a Ouija Board.

It might be the kid in class who hands them that cool crystal and swears it channels good energy.

But it will NOT be the book about the invisible horses, flying trains, trolls, giants and 30 foot spiders in the woods.

Have you ever met someone who claims to be a practicing witch? I have. They scare the blazes out of me. They aren't at all like even the most vile creatures in Harry Potter though.

If you think your kid will read Harry Potter and decide it is real I've GOT to ask - have you READ Harry Potter?

 

[fatbacker]

I have seen the movie Harry Potter but I have also known real witches and warlocks and to have my children view something like Harry Potter as innocent and then bump into someone who practices these things is what concerns me. This person could be a very nice person who tells them of the fortune telling and the spells which todays witches really do believe they can put on people and they really do make potions still and they see that this person may not be seen as a threat and decide to check it out themselves.

For those naive parents out there who think that HP cannot be a catalyst for future problems let me remind you that most drug addicts did not start out by shooting heroin or smoking crack.

It starts something like this: Go to school and make friends, friends smoke cigarettes your child tries it, wants to be cool so child works at getting past all the gagging and coughing and finally can take a full drag without choking. Friend is going to a party and invites your child, child sees drinking but although scared tries it cause friends do, gets a good buzz and realizes it is not as bad as parents say it is. Friend has some marijuana your child already smokes and has started drinking figures why not, takes a hit.

I am not going to drag it on but most everything starts out innocent and ends up in pain.

As for what I told my children. I showed them what the bible said about witchcraft and sorcery I told them that it was wrong and to entertain themselves with books that make it innocent and harmless are wrong. I told them that even though I did not read the books would go see the movie with them and I would give them my opinion on it after the movie. I also told them that I am telling them that there are certain things that I am very much against and movies and books like that are a couple of those things. I told them I am not punishing them but wrather I am standing up for what I believe God would just assume us not enterain ourselves with and that if they will just honor what I say until they are adults then when they get older they can test these things out and choose for themselves if they are right and wrong. I tell my kids that so when they get older they will know that it is okay to stand up for what you believe in and especially if it is God's word.

I saw the movie and I saw sorcery and spells which is still practiced in real life today and was against the movie.

 

[fatbacker]

And what you don't understand Texas is that there are people out there who take elicit drugs that can cause you to hallucinate and imagine you see things like that and will use those drugs in rituals and have no problems trying to get young people involved in it with them.