Is it ok for a Church to have female deacons?

[trumpet]

Originally posted by Johnv:
"Women [deacons] must likewise be dignified, not malicious gossips, but temperate, faithful in all things." (1 Timothy 3:11 NASB)

Well I'll be, BB!! You're right. I never read it in context before. It DOES allow for women to be deacons.

I don`t get it,in the other so called bibles,it is as anyone wants to make it. My Bible on the other hand disputes this question. I do not even have to go to the greek to figure this out. Just so you know, the word servant does not mean deacon.

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by trumpet:

I do not even have to go to the greek to figure this out. Just so you know, the word servant does not mean deacon.

If you DID go to the Greek, you would see that "diakon-" is translated in the KJV as "deacon" 3 times, "servant" 8 times, and "minister" (in the sense of attending to the needs of others) 20 times.

[ December 30, 2002, 08:51 PM: Message edited by: BrianT ]

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by trumpet:

I do not even have to go to the greek to figure this out. Just so you know, the word servant does not mean deacon.

You really should go to the Greek...

Deacon literally means "servant". It's a transliteration of the Greek word, diakon-os.

[ December 30, 2002, 09:02 PM: Message edited by: Baptist Believer ]

 

[Headcoveredlady]

Originally posted by Me2:
It seemed that Paul was pretty clear in his opinion about women teaching any men or having authority over them.

One in which even Paul could live with...

Can we imagine Paul being subject to the deaconess Phoebe.?

(I dont think so..)

Great point. I always wondered too, why if so many today claim that women are to be in authoritative roles over men didn't Jesus appoint female apostles.

HCL

 

[Me2]

Anyone representing the word(s) of God is in a position of authority. It comes with the territory. Any resemblance of any authority of women over men, is called upsurping authority. any women, over any man...

The world is filled with many situations like that. Paul was quite specific using no unquestionable words towards that idea...towards those inside the church organisation

1 tim 2:11 Let the woman learn in silence with "all subjection"...
I think that means..no observable subject over man. or...
1 tim 2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach. nor to upsurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.... That about covers a woman taking the position of deacon, elder or pastor.

 

[Ben W]

If you study your bible carefully referring to the greek translation of words, it is clear that Phoebe was a deacon, Romans 16:1.

 

[John3v36]

Is it ok for a Church to have female deacons?

That depends on what you mean by deacons!?

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by Me2:
Anyone representing the word(s) of God is in a position of authority. It comes with the territory. Any resemblance of any authority of women over men, is called upsurping authority. any women, over any man...

What does this have to do with deacons?

 

[Me2]

ahem...

1 cor 13:33 For God is not the author of confusion.....
1 cor 13:34 Let your women keep silent...it is not permitted for them to speak:but they are commanded to be under obedience, as saith the law.

1 cor 13:35 ....for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

Paul speaks volumes of common sense

PS..Hi BB...Just reminding folks that I only have authority over my own house..no one elses.
My wife is my helpmeet...no one elses. A man can offer suggestions to me but cannot order or rule me. The idea of one man being under any subject of another is not correct.

Today with the idea of any subject of any christian under another is obsurd...but that is what the world imagines...even moreso the idea of a female ruling a male...

(But thats my opinion in my house...and we're serving the lord.)

Me2

[ December 30, 2002, 09:50 PM: Message edited by: Me2 ]

 

[russell55]

I always wondered too, why if so many today claim that women are to be in authoritative roles over men didn't Jesus appoint female apostles.

The problem as I see it is that in most Baptist churches, the office of deacon is indeed an authoritative one, and biblically, women don't qualify for that role.

But as used in scripture, I think a deacon was not an authoritative position. A deacon did not teach, but rather took care of the nuts and bolts of things--distributing stuff to the poor, for instance. These sorts of things are often looked after by women in our churches today, we just don't call them deacons. But I see no reason why this sort of "office" (or job) within the church cannot be filled by a women.

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Me2:
ahem...

1 cor 13:33 For God is not the author of confusion.....
1 cor 13:34 Let your women keep silent...it is not permitted for them to speak:but they are commanded to be under obedience, as saith the law.

1 cor 13:35 ....for it is a shame for women to speak in the church.

Paul speaks volumes of common sense

Me2

Ahem...

Where in scripture does it say that deacons fill a "speaking" role? I think you are assuming "deacon" means something it doesn't.

 

[Me2]

Brian T....

A picture is worth a thousand words.

Me2

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Me2:
Brian T....

A picture is worth a thousand words.

Me2

Yes, and there's a picture of a female "diakon-" in Romans 16.

 

[neal4christ]

I would have to agree with those who say that the office of deacon today is not the office that it is supposed to be. Today most deacons are the ruling body and actually do very little serving. Personally I do not think that women should be deacons, at least in the way we have the office nowadays. But I can't say 100% that there can't be women deacons. I say let's go back to the way the office of deacon should be and then I could see it making better sense that women could be deacons, at least to serve other women.

Neal

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by neal4christ:
I would have to agree with those who say that the office of deacon today is not the office that it is supposed to be. Today most deacons are the ruling body and actually do very little serving. Personally I do not think that women should be deacons, at least in the way we have the office nowadays. But I can't say 100% that there can't be women deacons. I say let's go back to the way the office of deacon should be and then I could see it making better sense that women could be deacons, at least to serve other women.

Some of us already have deacons serving in the role of servants for the church to each other and the community. I suspect that those who condemn churches like mine who have women deacons are judging according to their false doctrine and practice.

 

[Me2]

I can agree with her title being a servant...also her age to be 60...

But a deacon represents the local body as a whole and is an example of an "obedient" witness to all.

The role is authoritative. As it is seen by an unbelieving world as representing the power of the whole body of believers.

The bible explicitly states a deacon filled by a male...sorry.

Ever wonder as to the relationship of this subject to Rev 2:20

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, becaue thou suffereth that woman Jezebel which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.....

...sounds like she had some sort of authoritative role before Gods people.
makes you wonder who gave her such authority ?

Me2

[ December 30, 2002, 10:29 PM: Message edited by: Me2 ]

 

[BrianT]

Originally posted by Me2:
The bible explicitly states a deacon filled by a male...sorry.

Where does it explicitly state this? It explicitly states is that a *male* "diakon-" should only have one wife. And it explicitly says the sister Phoebe was a "diakon-".

Ever wonder as to the relationship of this subject to Rev 2:20

No. Jezebel has nothing to do with the subject of deacons. Prophetesses, sure, but not deacons.

 

[Baptist Believer]

Originally posted by Me2:
I can agree with her title being a servant...also her age to be 70...

Where do you get this "qualification"?

But a deacon represents the local body as a whole and is an example of an "obedient" witness to all.

[QB]

Yes...

[QB]The role is authoritative. As it is seen by an unbelieving world as representing the power of the whole body of believers.

Yes... But don't confuse the role being "authoritative" with unbelievers as the same thing discussed as "having authority" (ecclesiastical power) over men.

The bible explicitly states a deacon filled by a male...sorry.

Uh... no. You also just contradicted your first statement unless you didn't really mean it.

Ever wonder as to the relationship of this subject to Rev 2:20

Can't say I have...

Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, becaue thou suffereth that woman Jezebel which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants to commit fornication, and to eat things sacrificed unto idols.....

1.) I didn't realize "Jezebel" was a deacon.
2.) Is the role of a deacon to teach and seduce the congregation to commit fornication and engage in idolatry? (I wouldn't accept male deacons in that role either!)

...sounds like she had some sort of authoritative role before Gods people.

As a deacon?

makes you wonder who gave her such authority ?

Makes me wonder how you think this is somehow relevant...

 

[Sherrie]

Me2 said

So I guess your answer from a real man...would be no women deacons

A real man? Hmmmmmm........(OK I won't say it)

But....

Who are these others, are they imposters?

....Sherrie

Sorry could not resist.

 

[Me2]

Well Clearly Deacons are husbands...

where I Come from...There male.

PS. Sherrie..theres only Real men and Imposters.
Your guess is as good as mine......

[ December 30, 2002, 10:48 PM: Message edited by: Me2 ]