Is "soulwinning" a fundamental?

[pinoybaptist]

Arthur:

You have stated correctly my chief beefs against what "soul winning" has become.
In my early years as a convert and as an Arminian, I was greatly turned off by "seminars in soul-winning" conducted by well-known Philippine pastors who had big memberships in their churches.
From my first day as a working adult I have been exposed to methods and systems of sales and marketing and I saw no big difference in the "methods" to "win souls".
There's this guy who used pebbles to illustrate.
Like, here's the pebble, this is you, then this pebble "wins a soul" and this soul gets baptized, then now you have two who go out there and "win souls", and now each "wins a soul", so now there are four who go out and "win souls", and they make it.
So now there are "eight" souls who are members of this "fundamental, soul-winning" church, and they multiply into 16, and 16, becomes 32, and 32 becomes 64, and 64 becomse 128, and so on and on, until over the years you have hudreds, maybe even thousands, of souls that starts with just one "soul winner" !

Imagine the rewards waiting for that one "soul winner" !
What crowns he has reaped !
He will have a lot of souls waiting for him in heaven to thank him !

Thank him ?
Excuse me. Isn't Jesus the One who died on that awful cross ?
Therefore, without Jesus, where would the "soul winner" be ?

And how does one "win a soul" to God ?
Well, there's the Roman way, and there's the pressing for decision, and then make sure they understand what they believe.

I think the term "soul winning" should better be understood as an effort to impart the gospel in accordance with its purpose: to bring life and immortality to light.

Jesus ALREADY saved and redeemed those whom He intends to save and redeem in accordance with the will of His Father.
His blood was sufficient for their release from the penalty of sin.

If there were thousands of "soul winning" fundamentalists who went out every hour they will still not be able to reach every human being who will ever be born and who will ever live on this earth.

Only the Holy Spirit can do that, because He alone is omnipresent and unhampered by geography and space.

Soul winning then is when one converts an erring brother, or when one points a searching sinner to the right direction, and leaving the conversion and the convicting to the Holy Spirit.

We can add nothing to the complete work of Christ at the cross, or as the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

 

[I Am Blessed 24]

Many times? Could you give a few examples? The only one I can find is Proverbs 11.30. Unless you are taking it that "winning souls" is the same as "spreading the gospel", which surely it cannot be, for not everyone who hears the gospel is saved ("has his soul won").

David: This is one of my earlier posts on this thread where I gave Scriptures:

Yes, soulwinning is a fundamental.

There are several verses that prove it is Biblical. Here are just three of them.

Notice that in all three verses, soulwinning is active...not passive. We are not told to wait for them to come to us...but we are told to go to them.

And he saith unto them, Follow me, and I will make you fishers of men.
Matthew 4:19

And so [was] also James, and John, the sons of Zebedee, which were partners with Simon. And Jesus said unto Simon, Fear not; from henceforth thou shalt catch men.
Luke 5:10

If by any means I may provoke to emulation [them which are] my flesh, and might save some of them.
Romans 11:14

Why do we spread the gospel? To show people the way to Jesus and disciple those who are already saved.

Why do preachers preach?

How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Romans 10:14

There is also a crown for soulwinners which we will cast at Jesus' feet when we get to Heaven.

Here is a verse in the Old Testament which pertains to our salvation and 'winning' souls.

Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isaiah 1:18

God gives us the wisdom and the words. The Holy Spirit convicts. All we have to do is go.

 

[John of Japan]

In my experience, it is usually Calvinists who oppose the term "soul-winning." However, ironically, some of the greatest advocates of soul-winning, even using the term, have also been Calvinists. Note the following quotes.

Charles Spurgeon: "Soul-winning is the chief business of the Christian minister; indeed, it should be the main pursuit of every true believer" (The Soul Winner, p. 15). And I could give many more quotes from this great book.

J. I. Packer: "Paul's ultimate aim in evangelism was to convert his hearers to faith in Christ. The word 'convert' is a translation of the Greek epistrepho, which means--and is sometimes translated--'turn'. We think of conversion as a work of God, and so from one standpoint it is; but it is striking to observe that in the three New Testament passages where epistrepho is used transitively, of ’converting’ someone to God, the subject of the verb is not God, as we might have expected, but a preacher. The angel said of John the Baptist: ‘Many of the children of Israel shall he turn to the Lord their God.’ (Luke 1:16). James says: ‘Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; let him know, that he which converteth the sinner…shall save a soul from death…’ (James 5:19 f.). And Paul himself tells Agrippa how Christ had said to him: ‘I send thee (to the Gentiles) to open their eyes, and to turn them from darkness to light, and from the power of Satan unto God,’ and how he had obeyed the heavenly vision by proclaiming to both Jews and Gentiles ‘that they should repent and turn to God’ (Acts 26:17 ff.). These passages represent the converting of others as the work of God’s people, a task which they are to perform by summoning men to turn to God in repentance and faith” (Evangelism and the Sovereignty of God, pp. 49-50; all emphasis by Packer--JoJ).

Packer actually even uses the term “win souls” a couple of pages later, speaking about Paul: “His aim and object in all his handling of the gospel, even in the heat of the polemics which contrary views evoked, was never less than to win souls, by converting those whom he saw as his neighbours to faith in the Lord Jesus Christ” (ibid, p. 53).

I could give many quotes from Presbyterian D. James Kennedy, who used the term "soul-winning" in his book Evangelism Explosion. In fact, Kennedy also talked about "the five great Laws of selling: Attention, Interest, Desire, Conviction and Close. Did salesmen invent these? No, they just extracted them. They learned that is the way to move people to action. This is what Jesus did, for example, with the woman at the well" (p. 58). Gasp!!! A Calvinist comparing soul-winning to salesmanship? Yep! And I refer you again to the Packer quote above. Packer also believed the soul-winner could convince the sinner.

The term in Matt. 28:18, "teach all nations," is well known to be the Greek matheteuo, "make disciples." Now how can you “make disciples” unless people were not disciples in the first place? In other words, Matthew's Great Commission is about soul-winning, or actually effectively and wisely giving the Gospel in the power of the Holy Spirit so that lost people are saved.

For other Scripture, check out James 5:20, Romans 11:14 (Paul “saving” the Gentiles), 1 Cor. 9:22 (“by all means save some”), etc.

 

[John of Japan]

David: This is one of my earlier posts on this thread where I gave Scriptures:



Why do we spread the gospel? To show people the way to Jesus and disciple those who are already saved.

Why do preachers preach?

How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher?
Romans 10:14

There is also a crown for soulwinners which we will cast at Jesus' feet when we get to Heaven.

Here is a verse in the Old Testament which pertains to our salvation and 'winning' souls.

Come now, and let us reason together, saith the LORD: though your sins be as scarlet, they shall be as white as snow; though they be red like crimson, they shall be as wool.
Isaiah 1:18

God gives us the wisdom and the words. The Holy Spirit convicts. All we have to do is go.

Good post, Sister I Am Blessed 17. I especially love Matt. 4:19. What do people think of a fisherman who never catches fish? :smilewinkgrin:

 

[dcorbett]

I am a born again Christian and a disciple of Christ - and that implies that the commandments that Jesus left to his disciples are directed at ME also.

Calvinists - do you know who the elect are? If you don't, then maybe that is a very good reason to try and seek the lost!

I honestly believe that Christians who don't want to go "soul-winning" are just afraid of failure - or embarrassed to try and let the Holy Spirit work through them. I don't see how you could interpret Jesus' commandments any other way!!! We are COMMANDED to bring the lost to Him. It is not my Preacher's sole assignment. I am a disciple too.

In my FUNDAMENTAL CORE CHRISTIANITY class I am currently taking, the definition of a church can go two directions - an organism (the body of Christ) and also an organization, specifically, a group of believers joining together with the main purpose being that of fulfilling the Great Commission.


If you want to be part of a social club, go join the Elks. They don't witness.

 

[Jarthur001]

Charles Spurgeon: "Soul-winning is the chief business of the Christian minister; indeed, it should be the main pursuit of every true believer" (The Soul Winner, p. 15). And I could give many more quotes from this great book.

Hello Brother John,

You would have to agree John that it is not only Calvinist that have a problem with what it has become, however, many Calvinist are among that group.

Some may want to know what Spurgeon meant by these words you quoted. These are the opening words of his address. The 1st part of his address Spurgeon tells us what is NOT soul winning. Then he tells us what he feels soul wining is. Spurgeon's words follows...


Part 1

What is the real winning of a soul for God? What are the processes by which a soul is led to God and to salvation? I take it that one of its main facets consists in instructing a man that he may know the truth of God. Instruction in the gospel is the beginning of all real work upon men's minds. "Go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, and teaching them to obey everything I have commanded you. And surely I am with you always, to the very end of the age." Teaching begins the work and continues with it to the very end of the new Christian's life.

The gospel, according to Isaiah, is, "Give ear and come to me; hear me, that your soul may live." It is ours, then, to give men something worth their hearing; in fact, to instruct them. We are sent to evangelize or to preach the gospel to every creature; and that is not done unless we teach them the great truths of God's revealed Word. The gospel is good news. To listen to some preachers you would imagine that the gospel was like "smelling salts" to make them wake up. It is nothing of the kind; it is news, there is information in it, there is instruction in it concerning matters which men need to know and statements in it calculated to bless those who hear it. It is not a magical incantation or a charm whose force consists in a collection of sounds; it is a revelation of facts and truths which require knowledge and belief.

The gospel is a reasonable system, and it appeals to men's understanding; it is a matter for thought and consideration, and it appeals to the conscience and to the power of reflection. So, if we don't teach men something, we can shout all day, "Believe! Believe! Believe!" but what are they to believe? Each exhortation requires a corresponding instruction, or it will mean nothing. "Escape!" From what? This requires for its answer the doctrine of the punishment of sin. "Fly!" But where? Then you must preach Christ and His wounds; yes, and the clear doctrine of atonement by sacrifice on the cross. "Repent!" Of what? Here you must answer such questions as, What is sin? What is the evil of sin? What are the consequences of sin? "Be converted!" But what is it to be converted? By what power can we be converted? From what? To what? The field of instruction is wide if men are to be made to know the truth which saves. "It is not good to have zeal without knowledge," and it is ours as the Lord's instruments to enable men to know the truth that they may believe it and feel its power. We are not to try and save men in the dark, but in the power of the Holy Spirit we are to seek to turn them from darkness to light.

And, don't believe, dear friends, that when you go into revival meetings or special evangelistic services, you are to leave out the doctrines of the gospel, for you ought then to proclaim the doctrines of grace rather more than less. Teach gospel doctrines clearly, affectionately, simply, and plainly, and especially those truths which have a present and practical bearing upon man's condition and God's grace.

more coming..

 

[Jarthur001]

Part 2 of what you see above...

Second, to win a soul it is necessary not only to instruct our hearer and make him to know the truth, but to impress him so that he may feel it. A ministry which always appeals to the understanding and leaves the emotions untouched would certainly be a limping ministry. "Like a lame man's legs," says Solomon; and the unequal legs of some ministries cripple them. We have seen such a ministry limping about with a long doctrinal leg but a very short emotional leg. It is a horrible thing for a man to be so doctrinal that he can speak coolly of the doom of the wicked, so that, if he does not actually praise God for it, it costs him no anguish of heart to think of the ruin of millions of our race. This is horrible!

I hate to hear the terrors of the Lord proclaimed by men whose hard expression, harsh tones, and unfeeling spirit betray a very dry doctrine: all the milk of human kindness is dried out of them. Having no feeling himself, such a preacher creates none, and the people sit and listen while he keeps to dry, lifeless statements, until they come to value him for being "sound," and they themselves come to be sound, too: and I need not add, sound asleep also, or what life they have is spent in sniffing out heresy and criticizing men who earnestly preach the gospel. May we never be baptized into this spirit!

A sinner has a heart as well as a head; a sinner has emotions as well as thoughts, and we must appeal to both. A sinner will never be converted until his emotions are stirred. Unless he feels sorrow for sin and unless he has some measure of joy in the reception of the Word, you cannot have much hope for him. The Truth must soak into the soul and dye it with its own color. The Word must be like a strong wind sweeping through the whole heart and swaying the whole man, even as a field of ripening corn waves in the summer breeze. Christianity without emotion is Christianity without life.

But, still, we must be careful how these emotions are caused. Do not play upon the mind by exciting feelings which are not spiritual. Some preachers are very fond of introducing funerals and dying children into their discourses, and they make the people weep through sheer natural affection. This may lead up to something better, but in itself what is its value? What is the good of opening up a mother's griefs or a widow's sorrows? I do not believe that our merciful Lord has sent us to make men weep over their departed relatives by digging anew their graves and rehearsing past scenes of bereavement and woe.

If our hearers will weep over their sins, and after Jesus, let their tears flow in rivers; but if the object of their sorrow is merely natural and not at all spiritual, what good is done by making them weep? There might be some virtue in making people joyful, for there is enough sorrow in the world, and the more we can promote cheerfulness, the better; but what is the use of creating needless misery? What right have you to go through the world pricking everybody with your surgeon's knife just to show your skill in surgery? A true physician only makes incisions in order to effect cures, and a wise minister only excites painful emotions in men's minds with the distinct object of blessing their souls.

I have already insisted on instruction and impression as being most needful to soul-winning; but these are not all they are, indeed, only means to the desired end. A far greater work must be done before a man is saved. A wonder of divine grace must be acted upon the soul, far transcending anything which can be accomplished by the power of man. Of all whom we would eagerly win for Jesus it is true, "No one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again." The Holy Spirit must work a new birth in the objects of our love, or they never can become possessors of eternal happiness. They must be quickened into a new life, and they must become new creatures in Christ Jesus. The same energy which accomplishes resurrection and creation must put forth all its power upon them; nothing short of this will work.

Regeneration, or the new birth, works a change in the whole nature of man, and, so far as we can judge, its essence lies in the implanting and the creation of a new principle within the man. The Holy Spirit creates in us a new, heavenly, and immortal nature, which is known in Scripture as "the spirit" by way of distinction from the soul. Our theory of regeneration is that man in his fallen nature consists only of body and soul and that when he is regenerated, there is created in him a new and higher nature--"the spirit"--which is a spark from the everlasting fire of God's life and love; this falls into the heart and lives there and makes its receiver a partaker of the divine nature. From that time forward, the man consists of three parts, body, soul, and spirit, and the spirit is the reigning power of the three.

Since this God bestowed spiritual life in men is a mystery, we will speak to a more practical effect if we dwell upon the signs following and accompanying it, for these are the things we must aim at. First, regeneration will be shown in conviction of sin. This we believe to be an indispensable mark of the Spirit's work; the new life as it enters the heart causes intense inward pain as one of its first effects. Though nowadays we hear of persons being brought into a certainty of their salvation without ever having lamented their condemnation for their sins, we are very dubious as to the value of such salvations. This style of things is not according to the truth. God never clothes men until He has first stripped them, nor does He arouse them by the gospel until they are first slain by the law of God. When you meet with persons in whom there is no trace of conviction of sin, you may be quite sure that they have not been convicted by the Holy Spirit, for "When he comes, he will convict the world of guilt in regard to sin and righteousness and judgment."

 

[Jarthur001]

Part 3....and the last...

It is equally certain that true conversion may be known by the exhibition of a simple faith in Jesus Christ. You don't need me to tell you that, for you yourselves are fully convinced of it. The production of faith is the very center of the target at which you aim. The proof to you that you have won the man's soul for Jesus is never before you until he has rejected himself and his own merits and has trusted only in the work of Christ. Great care must be taken that this faith is exercised on Christ for a complete salvation and not for a part of it. Numbers of persons think that the Lord Jesus is available for the pardon of past sin, but they cannot trust Him for their preservation in the future. They trust Him for past years but not for years to come; whereas no such a subdivision of salvation is ever spoken of in Scripture as the work of Christ. Either He bore all our sins or none; and He either saves us once for all or not at all. His death can never be repeated, and it must have made full payment for the future sin of believers, or they are lost, since no further atonement can be supposed and future sin is certain to be committed. Blessed be His name, "Through Him everyone who believes is justified from everything." Salvation by grace is eternal salvation.


Together with undivided faith in Jesus Christ there must also be wholehearted repentance of sin. Repentance is an old-fashioned word not much used by modern revivalists. "Oh!" said a minister to me, one day, "It only means a change of mind." This was thought to be a profound observation. "Only a change of mind"; but what a change! A change of mind with regard to everything! instead of saying, "It is only a change of mind," it seems to me more truthful to say it is a great and deep change--even a change of the mind itself. But whatever the literal Greek word may mean, repentance is no small thing. You will not find a better definition of it than the one given in the children's hymn:

Repentance is to leave The sins we loved before; And show that we in earnest grieve, By doing so no more.

Another proof of the conquest of a soul for Christ will be found in a real change of life. If the man does not live differently from what he did before, both at home and in society, his repentance needs to be repented of and his conversion is a fiction. Not only action and language but spirit and attitude must be changed. "But," says someone, "grace is often grafted on a wild tree." I know it is; but what is the fruit of the grafting? The fruit will be like the graft, and not after the nature of the original stem. "But," says another, "I have an awful temper, and all of a sudden it overcomes me. My anger is soon over, and I feel very ashamed. Though I cannot control myself, I am quite sure I am a Christian." Not so fast, my friend, or I may answer that I am just as sure the other way.

What is the use of your soon cooling down if in two or three moments you scald everyone around you? If a man stabs me in a fury, it will not heal my wound to see him grieving over his madness. Quick temper must be conquered and the whole man must be renewed or conversion will be questionable. We are not to hold up a modified holiness before our people, and say, "You will be all right if you reach that standard." The Scripture says, "He who does what is sinful is of the devil."

There must be a harmony between the life and the profession. A Christian professes to renounce sin; and if he does not do so, he is an impostor. A drunken man came up to Rowland Hill, one day, and said, "I am one of your converts, Mr. Hill." "I believe you are," replied that shrewd and sensible preacher; "but you are not a convert of the Lord's, or you would not be drunk." To this practical test we must bring all our work.

In our converts we must also see true prayer, which is the vital breath of godliness. If there is no prayer, you may be quite sure the soul is dead. We are not to urge men to pray as though it were the great gospel duty and the one prescribed way of salvation; for our chief message is, "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ." It is easy to put prayer into its wrong place and make it out to be a kind of work by which men are to live; but this you will, I trust, most carefully avoid. Faith is the great gospel grace; but still we cannot forget that true faith always prays, and when a man professes faith in the Lord Jesus and yet does not cry to the Lord daily, we dare not believe in his faith or his conversion.

There must also be a willingness to obey the Lord in all His commandments. It is a shameful thing for a man to profess discipleship and yet refuse to learn his Lord's will on certain points, or even dare to decline obedience when that will is known. How can a man be a disciple of Christ when he lives in open disobedience to Him?

If the professed convert distinctly and deliberately declares that he knows his Lord's will but does not plan to obey it, you are not to pamper his presumption, but it is your duty to assure him that he is not saved. Has not the Lord said, "Anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple?" Mistakes as to what the Lord's will may be are to be tenderly corrected, but anything like willful disobedience is fatal; to tolerate it would be treason to Him that sent us. Jesus must be received as King as well as Priest; and where there is any hesitancy about this, the foundation of godliness is not yet laid.

Faith must obey her Maker's will As well as trust His grace; A pardoning God is jealous still For His own holiness.

Thus, you see, my brethren, the signs which prove that a soul is won are by no means inconsequential, and the work to be done before those signs can exist is not to be lightly spoken of. A soul-winner can do nothing without God. He must throw himself before the Invisible God or be a laughing-stock to the devil, who regards with utter contempt all who think to subdue human nature with mere words and arguments. To all who hope to succeed in such a labor by their own strength, we would address the words of the Lord to Job, "Can you pull in the leviathan with a fishhook or tie down his tongue with a rope? Can you make a pet of him like a bird or put him on a leash for your girls? If you lay a hand on him, you will remember the struggle and never do it again! Any hope of subduing him is false; the mere sight of him is overpowering." Dependence on God is our strength and our joy: in that dependence let us go out and seek to win souls for Him..

I have no problem with what he said.

As I said before, I have more of a problem with those that feel door to door and the sales man thing is the only right way to share the gospel.

 

[4His_glory]

Great stuff from Spurgeon, one of my greatest heros if not the greatest hero of baptist history.

As I said before, I have more of a problem with those that feel door to door and the sales man thing is the only right way to share the gospel.

I agree. In fact is some areas the door to door thing is a hinderance not a help in spreading the gospel.

 

[4His_glory]

Evangelism is more than just a simple Gospel outline. The Great Commission is more than just share the grace of God in salvation. Christ said teach all that I taught you. So the Great commission is the imparting of theology. Its making known the doctrine of Christ to the world.

 

[Jarthur001]

I am a born again Christian and a disciple of Christ -

Hello dcorbett, tis good to meet you.
I am born again Christian also. Being that is true, you could also say I'm a disciple of Christ.

and that implies that the commandments that Jesus left to his disciples are directed at ME also.

and me as well.

Calvinists - do you know who the elect are? If you don't, then maybe that is a very good reason to try and seek the lost!

Being a Calvinist, I will answer. No I do not. Nor does any Calvinist. Nor do Calvinist claim this. BTW as John of Japan has already shown, most Calvinist do share the gospel.

Here are 7 reasons why Calvinist share the gospel of God to all men.

List http://www.corkfpc.com/

1) Because God has commanded it. The gospel is to preached to every creature (Mark 16:15) This is why Calvinists have been to the forefront of missionary endeavour. The man acknowledged as "the Father of Modern Missions" was William Carey… and William Carey was a Calvinist. If a missionary (strictly speaking) is someone who leaves his homeland to preach the gospel elsewhere, then John Calvin qualifies as a missionary. Spurgeon said of him: " John Calvin…is looked upon now, of course, a theologian only, but he was really one of the greatest of gospel preachers. When Calvin opened the Book and took a text, you might be sure that he was about to preach "Through grace are ye saved, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God." (MTP 14:216) Even if we had no other reason, we would still evangelise…because it is a clear command from God.

2) Because we believe that God has ordained the means of bringing many sons to glory as well as the end. Hyper Calvinists believe He has ordained the end but not the means, non Calvinists/Arminians believe that He has ordained the means but not the end… Calvinists alone consistently take the balanced view that He has ordained both. If we don't evangelise…someone else rightly will. Calvinists believe as much in man's responsibility as they do in God's sovereignty.

3) Evangelism gives Calvinists the glorious opportunity to praise the God whom they believe unconditionally elected them to salvation. We love to preach the gospel in all its fullness. Just to recount the old, old story of Jesus and His love thrills our soul and leads us to praise His name. We glorify God when we proclaim the gospel.

4) Evangelism gives us the opportunity to unburden our souls for the lost. We cannot be silent while souls around us are bound for hell. We believe the gospel ourselves and therefore we speak (2 Corinthians 4:13) Many of us were brought savingly to Christ because someone else was burdened for us and prayed for us and witnessed to us. Any man who names the name of Christ, Calvinist or not, should have the burden to win others. It is an evidence of grace when we want others to experience it for themselves. If there is no burden for the lost, we are left to wonder does the professing Christian (of whatever school) believe there is a Day of Judgement…an immortal soul and an eternal hell?

5) Evangelism gives us an opportunity to serve God. The fields are white unto harvest and yet the labourers are few. There is a great reward awaiting for soul winners (Daniel 12:3) …but even if there wasn't, we would still labour just for the sheer joy of being in God's work and spreading His word.

6) Evangelism gives us an opportunity to bear reproach for the name of Christ. Paul witnessed to the gospel with much contention (1 Thessalonians 2:2) and whilst such is irksome to the flesh, yet the spiritual man rejoices every whit. Such were the Apostles (Acts 5:41) Obviously we do not set out to annoy, but we recognise that the natural heart is going to kick hard against the message of Christ. If we have to bear reproach in our evangelism…then amen! "So be it"

7) Far down our list, but there nevertheless, we evangelise because it nails the lie often uttered against us that Calvinism kills evangelistic endeavour. Why should it? The doctrine of predestination is the only grounds of evangelism. If God did not predestine folk out of their sins to be saved, then no one would be saved. The non Calvinist says that if there were no faith, then there would be no predestination because the latter (which is God's work) is totally and absolutely dependent on the former which is due ultimately to man's decision. The Calvinist says that if there were no predestination, then there would be no faith because the latter (which is man's responsibility) flows from the former. Faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God (Romans 10:17) and the word of God comes to sinners through gospel preachers (Romans 10;13-16)

With the exception of the last point, every Christian (Calvinist or not) has a reason for evangelism. Evangelism is the common lot of every child of God, no matter what his understanding of the outworking of the decree of God may be. Both Whitefield (Calvinist) and Wesley (Arminian) preached together and rejoiced in each others great work. This is the way it ever should be.

I honestly believe that Christians who don't want to go "soul-winning" are just afraid of failure - or embarrassed to try and let the Holy Spirit work through them.

Though this could be true in some cases, you have gone beyond what you know to be true and what is the truth. The fact is you have no idea why some do not. I'm not trying to pick a fight, but it is bold blanket statements without knowing the facts that fundamentalist a bad name.

You should also know this in case you do not know, that some share the gospel in other ways. "Going" is but a charge for us to share.

I don't see how you could interpret Jesus' commandments any other way!!!

Just how do you think others may interpret it?

We are COMMANDED to bring the lost to Him.

Verse please.

My Bible says God draws men to Himself.

It is not my Preacher's sole assignment. I am a disciple too.

I agree. And so do most Calvinist.

In my FUNDAMENTAL CORE CHRISTIANITY class I am currently taking, the definition of a church can go two directions - an organism (the body of Christ) and also an organization, specifically, a group of believers joining together with the main purpose being that of fulfilling the Great Commission.

If the great commission is you number one goal, you missed the point of the Gospel of God.

The main purpose is to worship God. This will cause others to go tell.

If you want to be part of a social club, go join the Elks.

There is no Elk club in my area. But who is talking about social clubs and why bring this up?

They don't witness.

I have no idea if they witness or not, for I know no Elky...or whatever they are called.

But it would be my guess that they do witness (tell others) about the elks.

 

[Jarthur001]

Evangelism is more than just a simple Gospel outline. The Great Commission is more than just share the grace of God in salvation. Christ said teach all that I taught you. So the Great commission is the imparting of theology. Its making known the doctrine of Christ to the world.

I would agree 100% brother.

The gospel of God (romans 1) is for all of life.

I call these verses...The creed of the Gospel.

1Paul, a servant of Jesus Christ, called to be an apostle, separated unto the gospel of God,

2(Which he had promised afore by his prophets in the holy scriptures,)

3Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;

4And declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the spirit of holiness, by the resurrection from the dead:

5By whom we have received grace and apostleship, for obedience to the faith among all nations, for his name:

Man that is good stuff.

 

[John of Japan]

Evangelism is more than just a simple Gospel outline. The Great Commission is more than just share the grace of God in salvation. Christ said teach all that I taught you. So the Great commission is the imparting of theology. Its making known the doctrine of Christ to the world.

Actually, in the five statements of the Great Commission given by Christ, only the Matthew statement can be construed to include teaching theology. So personally I would temper this broad statement.

 

[dcorbett]

Verse please.

John 4:31-38 is just one place....there are many others. That is a lesson within a lesson as (in the surrounding verses) the woman that Jesus preached to went out and spread the good news of the Christ.

My Bible says God draws men to Himself.

Yes, the Holy Spirit will start working on someone the minute they hear the Gospel. And if you can't get them into a church, how will they hear without a preacher? (from Romans)

If the great commission is you number one goal, you missed the point of the Gospel of God. The main purpose is to worship God. This will cause others to go tell.

I can worship God anywhere at anytime, and I do. I don't need to go to church to do it. I go to church to be fed and to do His will.

There is no Elk club in my area. But who is talking about social clubs and why bring this up?

Because many churches are turning into social clubs instead of following the Bible and the Commandments of God. Laodecian in nature, they "play to the masses" with drama, dance, and modern music. "Be Ye Seperate" is what the bible tells Christians, don't bring the worldly ways into the church!!! Take the gospel to the world is what the Great Commission states. And MY world begins right here at home.

I can do nothing - God does it all.

 

[J.D.]

Back to the OP, I found this on Wikipedia:

The original formulation of American fundamentalist beliefs can be traced to the Niagara Bible Conference (1878–1897) and, in 1910, to the General Assembly of the Presbyterian Church which distilled these into what became known as the "five fundamentals":[4]

• Inerrancy of the Scriptures
• The virgin birth and the deity of Jesus (Isaiah 7:14)
• The doctrine of substitutionary atonement by God's grace and through human faith (Hebrews 9)
• The bodily resurrection of Jesus (Matthew 28)
• The authenticity of Christ's miracles (or, alternatively, his pre-millennial second coming)[5]

I didn't see soul-winning listed as one of the fundamentals.

But since most fundamentalists have a very generic creed, if any creed at all, then it's up to the Big Mannagod to determine what the fundamentals are.

 

[David Lamb]

Calvinists - do you know who the elect are? If you don't, then maybe that is a very good reason to try and seek the lost!

Personally, I have not yet come across anyone ("Calvinist" or not) on the BB who says that the know who the elect are, or that we as Christians should not seek the lost.

I honestly believe that Christians who don't want to go "soul-winning" are just afraid of failure - .

As several have said on this thread, some may prefer to talk about "spreading the gospel", preaching or witnessing, rather than "soul-winning", which implies that we can actually win sinners' souls from the devil.

 

[dcorbett]

If the issue is semantics, we need to drop it.

Going soul-winning is an expression for going out and spreading the gospel - inviting people to church, offering to show them the Plan of Salvation, etc.

Nobody I know that goes soul-winning has EVER thought so high of themselves that they didn't give God the glory for anything that results.
When we go out on Saturdays after "soul-winning class", we are attempting to spread the gospel. AND THAT IS A COMMANDMENT, you can't interpret the Great Commission any other way.

By the way...My church calls it "door-knocking" :thumbs: Now I wait to see how that expression is ripped apart.........:BangHead:

 

[dcorbett]

Back to the OP, I found this on Wikipedia:

I didn't see soul-winning listed as one of the fundamentals.

But since most fundamentalists have a very generic creed, if any creed at all, then it's up to the Big Mannagod to determine what the fundamentals are.

Are you a Presbyterian? I am not.

And like I said in the last post, "soul-winning" is one term used for spreading the gospel. It is not meant to imply WE do anything....rather, we let the Holy Spirit work THROUGH us.

I am a born again Bible-believing disciple. I just happen to affiliate myself with an Independent Fundamental Baptist church that believes in carrying out the Great Commission. But I will work alongside anyone that believes in witnessing and bringing the gospel to a lost and dying world (as long as they are scripturally correct). My son attends an Evangelical Free church, and he and I witness to people together.

As I mature in my Christian walk, I cannot sit on my Blessed Assurance and wait for the lost to walk through the door....they won't. "Look unto the fields, they are already white unto harvest"

 

[bapmom]

the term is "soulwinning" - not "soul-saving"....


we do not claim to be the one SAVING the soul, we are simply going out in order to WIN them over to Christ. Not like "win a prize" but like "he has a 'winning' smile"....


It has always amazed me how so many here on the BB can get so caught up in whether or not we use a specific term...and yet those same people will get all worked up over what they call other people's "legalism." It's a Biblically-derived term. If you don't like it, oh well, but don't hang your whole argument on terminology.

 

[skypair]

There's this guy who used pebbles to illustrate.
Like, here's the pebble, this is you, then this pebble "wins a soul" and this soul gets baptized, then now you have two who go out there and "win souls", and now each "wins a soul", so now there are four who go out and "win souls", and they make it.

You're right on this -- of course. :laugh: How big of a "soul winner's crown" can you get before it breaks your neck!! We're gonna cast them at Jesus feet anyway so who cares. "Win one for the Gipper!!" (Sorry if that is disrespectful but it's true.)

And how does one "win a soul" to God ?

Preach/teach the gospel, right?

I think the term "soul winning" should better be understood as an effort to impart the gospel in accordance with its purpose: to bring life and immortality to light.

Or that way is good, too. I'm not picky.

If there were thousands of "soul winning" fundamentalists who went out every hour they will still not be able to reach every human being who will ever be born and who will ever live on this earth.

This is true. But the omnipresent, unhampered Spirit can and will reach everyone. Just hopefully, through you, He can reach them with grace and not justice.

We can add nothing to the complete work of Christ at the cross, or as the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

Why exist if we are not Christ to the lost? We are an "extension" of Christ, Isa 53:10 -- "...he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the LORD shall prosper in his hand." You wonder what we "add." It is testimony.

skypair