Is Suicide a sin?

[Cailiosa]

I just realized I didn't address the issue of wether suicide is a sin or not.... :laugh:

I believe that suicide is a sin, because if your going to commit suicide, then you are taking your life into your hands and telling God that your not hapy with the way He is leading you. He has a plan and a purpose for when you are to die, but it is in His timing, not yours. So yes I believe it is a sin, but I definatly don't believe that it is an unpardonable sin.

I believe the unpardonable sin the Bible refers to is the sin of refusing to accept Christ as your Saviour. After all, if you really believe what the Bible says, then that can be the only unpardonable sin.

 

[ccrobinson]

SFIC,

Although I don't agree with you about whether Christians can commit suicide, I do understand your position on it now. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[lgpruitt]

I agree with Phillip. If one sin is unforgivable...why should anyone make it to heaven? We're all sinners. As Christians we try to "sin-less". I have had several people very close to me commit suicide and one was a Christian.(the others may or may not have been...that's for God to judge)
I feel certain my cousin that committed suicide is in Heaven. Just my beliefs....
:Fish:

Murderers don't make it to heaven; neither do liars, fornicators, thiefs, idolitors and any other sin we can think of. Now, when that sin is washed by the blood of Jesus, there is no sin remaining.

If you believe that a person who commits suicide cannot get into heaven, then you MUST believe in loss of salvation. Then you have to ask the question of how many sins is enough to get a person out of heaven? Is murder? Is theft? Is lying?

The bottom line is, if the person is indeed a Christian, they will go to heaven. They are certainly not right with God during this period of time, but how often are we at odds with God's commands?

I know a preacher who was definitely saved who committed suicide after having lost his daughter in a car accident. I have no doubts that he is in heaven at this very moment. Suicide is often the result of physiological illness or chemical imbalances. It is no different than a person who develops Alzheimer's syndrome and forgets who they are and often times begins to curse all of the time when they were never known to in the past.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

I believe the unpardonable sin the Bible refers to is the sin of refusing to accept Christ as your Saviour. After all, if you really believe what the Bible says, then that can be the only unpardonable sin.

The unpardonable sin is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost. Rejecting Christ can be considered to fall in that category since the Holy Spirit does not testify of Himself, but of Christ.

Having said that, if one commits suicide, that one cannot have been 'in Christ.' If that one was in Christ, that one would have a peace that passes all understanding even in the darkest storms of life.

Why do you think Paul never spoke of committing suicide? Because the Lord assured Him that no matter the trial, He was there with him.

Clinical depression? That is a joke. Man tries to treat demon oppression with drugs and psychological babble. Christ treated it with the Word of God. No wonder many times the 'drugs do not work'... they are not meant to. There is only one cure for the mind tormented by satan and that is Christ, not drugs, psychobabble, or suicide.

Christ's true sheep will not listen to a false shepherd telling them life is worthless, telling them no one loves them, no one cares. One is not going to commit suicide when one is a christian, because the Father chastens and disciplines those that He loves. He does not turn His back on them and say 'Go ahead, and I'll see you when you get here.'

 

[canadyjd]

standingfirm

I would be careful claiming you know what sin or sins anyone else is capable of committing. It is the same as claiming you know whether they are saved or not; which you do not! (that is the work of the Spirit).

And your views on depression and mental illness are straight out of the middle ages (not the first century and not the 21st). There is certainly a difference between demon oppression and mental illness. Just as Satan does not cause every physical illness that comes our way, he is not responsible for every mental or emotional one either. One does not necessarily go with the other. And, God most certainly gave us plants for medicine and that includes medicines which help us physically and mentally.

peace to youraise:

 

[standingfirminChrist]

canady,

Show me scripture where someone was suffering from a chemical imbalance in the Word of God? show me where one suffered from mental illness?

I can show many that point to people who were possessed or oppressed by devils.

Christ never once said 'This person has a bi-polar disorder,' or 'This person is mentally unstable.' No, He recognized it was devil oppression and possession that caused these things, not chemical imbalances.

 

[Rex77]

Jesus knew the difference between mental illness and demon possession.

Mt 4:24 And his fame went throughout all Syria: and they brought unto him all sick people that were taken with divers diseases and torments, and those which were possessed with devils, and those which were lunatick, and those that had the palsy; and he healed them.

 

[tinytim]

CCRobinson. I meant what I said. A christian cannot lose his or her salvation. If one claiming to be a christian commits suicide, that one could not have been a christian, other than in his own mind.

No murderer shall inherit heaven.

When one commits suicide, one shows they do not place their faith in Christ. One cannot be a christian and intentionally kill oneself. God has promised that He would not allow more to be put on the child of God than he is able to bear. If one thinks that a burden is so unbearable that one has to take his own life, that one apparently was never in Christ in the first place.

Also, Christ Himself said He gives us a peace that passes all understanding. How can one claim to be in Christ and not have the peace of Christ?

SFIC, one correction here... No where in the Bible does it say that he will not allow a burden to come upon us that we are unable to bear. That is a misconception...
The Bible says,

1Co 10:13
(13) There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

It is not saying that God will not put more on us than we can bear.
It says He will not allow us to be tempted more than we can bear.

There is a difference.
He allows things to come on us more than we can bear to force us to run to Christ.

Mat 11:28-30(28) Come unto me, all [ye] that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.(29) Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.(30) For my yoke [is] easy, and my burden is light.


Also, folks, it is no use arguing with SFIC. I tried a few months ago, and we came to an impasse... sometimes we just have to agree to disagree. Right SFIC:thumbs:

 

[webdog]

Show me scripture where someone was suffering from a chemical imbalance in the Word of God? show me where one suffered from mental illness?

Show me one Scripture where someone had an ingrown toenail? Hemorhoids? Kidney stones? Colitis?

What you say, there are none? Well then I guess these must not be real conditions, and anybody that claims to have these medical conditions are just plain 'ole demon possessed!

SFIC, someone with your knowledge should know that arguing anything from a negative is plain foolishness. This is how occults form, let alone false doctrine, some of which you have adhered to.

 

[Linda64]

SFIC, one correction here... No where in the Bible does it say that he will not allow a burden to come upon us that we are unable to bear. That is a misconception...
The Bible says,

1Co 10:13
(13) There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God [is] faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear [it].

It is not saying that God will not put more on us than we can bear.
It says He will not allow us to be tempted more than we can bear.

There is a difference.
He allows things to come on us more than we can bear to force us to run to Christ.

Mat 11:28-30(28) Come unto me, all [ye] that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.(29) Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.(30) For my yoke [is] easy, and my burden is light.


Also, folks, it is no use arguing with SFIC. I tried a few months ago, and we came to an impasse... sometimes we just have to agree to disagree. Right SFIC:thumbs:

How about these verses?

We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; (2 Corinthians 4:8)

Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; (2 Corinthians 4:9)

Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. (2 Corinthians 4:10)

Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft. (2 Corinthians 11:23)

Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one. (2 Corinthians 11:24)

Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep; (2 Corinthians 11:25)

In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; (2 Corinthians 11:26)

In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness. (2 Corinthians 11:27)

Beside those things that are without, that which cometh upon me daily, the care of all the churches. (2 Corinthians 11:28)

Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is offended, and I burn not? (2 Corinthians 11:29)

If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities. (2 Corinthians 11:30)

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. (2 Corinthians 12:9)

Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong. (2 Corinthians 12:10)

These trials of Paul were not simply "temptations"--Paul went through alot of "suffering" for the Gospel. In all of his suffering, God's grace was sufficient for Paul, as it is for us.

 

[saturneptune]

Maybe out on a limb here, but the only sin that prevents someone getting into heaven is blasphamy of the Holy Spirit. (which includes rejection of Christ). Now, the Roman Catholics believe that suicide is an unforgiveable sin because it is kind of hard to confess the sin (their theology).

God's mind is way beyond mine, infinite in wisdom. Paul gives a whole list of sins that he says will not see the kingdom of God, lots more than murder. In context, I have always thought of people practicing those sins at the time without Christ. If one follows the logic that a murderer cannot enter the kingdom of heaven, that would exclude David. And of course, included in the list are all sorts of sexual sins, which since Christ says that includes thoughts, lots of us are doomed.

Praise God, my sins are forgiven. Not that I have ever killed anyone, or plan on killing my token neighborhood republican or democrat, but my sins are many.

I agree with Tiny Tim. While I hope I am never put under that trial, I do not know.

Final point. NO one knows who is saved and who is not except the person and God. I saw a post from an Arcangel on the thread about the spoof on Calvin. He said the person was not a Christian. He does not know that. He only thinks it is likely.

The mind of God is so far above our finite minds, why waste time trying to figure out things we are not told. It is called faith.

 

[canadyjd]

canady,

Show me scripture where someone was suffering from a chemical imbalance in the Word of God? show me where one suffered from mental illness?

I can show many that point to people who were possessed or oppressed by devils.

Christ never once said 'This person has a bi-polar disorder,' or 'This person is mentally unstable.' No, He recognized it was devil oppression and possession that caused these things, not chemical imbalances.

Matt 4:24, as Rex77 said. Whether you translate the word as lunatics or epileptics, or "moonstruck" you still have reference to a mental disease in direct contrast with demonic oppression.

peace to youraise:

 

[tinytim]

How about these verses?

We are troubled on every side, yet not distressed; we are perplexed, but not in despair; (2 Corinthians 4:8)

Persecuted, but not forsaken; cast down, but not destroyed; (2 Corinthians 4:9)

Always bearing about in the body the dying of the Lord Jesus, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our body. (2 Corinthians 4:10)

Are they ministers of Christ? (I speak as a fool) I am more; in labours more abundant, in stripes above measure, in prisons more frequent, in deaths oft. (2 Corinthians 11:23)

Of the Jews five times received I forty stripes save one. (2 Corinthians 11:24)

Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep; (2 Corinthians 11:25)

In journeyings often, in perils of waters, in perils of robbers, in perils by mine own countrymen, in perils by the heathen, in perils in the city, in perils in the wilderness, in perils in the sea, in perils among false brethren; (2 Corinthians 11:26)

In weariness and painfulness, in watchings often, in hunger and thirst, in fastings often, in cold and nakedness. (2 Corinthians 11:27)

Beside those things that are without, that which cometh upon me daily, the care of all the churches. (2 Corinthians 11:28)

Who is weak, and I am not weak? who is offended, and I burn not? (2 Corinthians 11:29)

If I must needs glory, I will glory of the things which concern mine infirmities. (2 Corinthians 11:30)

And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. (2 Corinthians 12:9)

Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong. (2 Corinthians 12:10)

These trials of Paul were not simply "temptations"--Paul went through alot of "suffering" for the Gospel. In all of his suffering, God's grace was sufficient for Paul, as it is for us.

OK. but God allows stuff to come upon a person to force that person to turn to Him.

I just wanted to point that out.

 

[standingfirminChrist]

1 Corinthians 10:13 tells us,

1 Corinthians 10:13 There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, who will not suffer you to be tempted above that ye are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape, that ye may be able to bear it.

tinytim,
Notice that word 'temptation'. It does not say 'burdens.' We will have burdens. The Bible says many are the afflictions of the righteous, but the Lord delivereth them out of them all.'

Now, that being said, suicide is not a burden, it is a temptation. People are tempted to commit suicide, not burdened by it. 1 Corinthians says that the Lord will make a way of escape that we may be able to bear the tribulation, not give in to it.

canady and rex,

Notice one thing about that verse that speaks of lunaticks? Jesus did not prescribe drugs, nor did He send them to a psychiatrist to be analyzed. He healed them then and there.

Drugs are not needed for depression.

 

[lgpruitt]

Clinical depression is not a joke. It runs in families. I am quite offended by your statement.
:tear:

The unpardonable sin is blasphemy of the Holy Ghost. Rejecting Christ can be considered to fall in that category since the Holy Spirit does not testify of Himself, but of Christ.

Having said that, if one commits suicide, that one cannot have been 'in Christ.' If that one was in Christ, that one would have a peace that passes all understanding even in the darkest storms of life.

Why do you think Paul never spoke of committing suicide? Because the Lord assured Him that no matter the trial, He was there with him.

Clinical depression? That is a joke. Man tries to treat demon oppression with drugs and psychological babble. Christ treated it with the Word of God. No wonder many times the 'drugs do not work'... they are not meant to. There is only one cure for the mind tormented by satan and that is Christ, not drugs, psychobabble, or suicide.

Christ's true sheep will not listen to a false shepherd telling them life is worthless, telling them no one loves them, no one cares. One is not going to commit suicide when one is a christian, because the Father chastens and disciplines those that He loves. He does not turn His back on them and say 'Go ahead, and I'll see you when you get here.'

 

[lgpruitt]

There is much left unstated in the
bible. If you've not been clinically depressed, count your blessings. But for those of us that have family members or have been there ourselves....it is real. Show me in the bible where it talks of tooth decay or ovarian cancer.....
:Fish:

canady,

Show me scripture where someone was suffering from a chemical imbalance in the Word of God? show me where one suffered from mental illness?

I can show many that point to people who were possessed or oppressed by devils.

Christ never once said 'This person has a bi-polar disorder,' or 'This person is mentally unstable.' No, He recognized it was devil oppression and possession that caused these things, not chemical imbalances.

 

[Deacon]

Notice one thing about that verse that speaks of lunaticks? Jesus did not prescribe drugs, nor did He send them to a psychiatrist to be analyzed. He healed them then and there.

Drugs are not needed for depression.

Seems to me that Christ also healed the blind.
Why dont you follow your own advice and stop wearing glasses or going to eye doctors?

Rob

 

[bapmom]

Thing is, there's a difference between "clinical depression" and just being "down in the dumps".

SFIC, you've had trials, yes, but trials are not what cause clinical depression.

I think its a good idea for a Christian to first search their heart and be sure they are not hiding some sin from God and/or from themselves. However, a person who is depressed because of sin in their life KNOWS that there is sin in their life. This is a person who is living in direct conflict with clear laws of God and they KNOW it. They KNOW they are not doing what God wants them to do in some way. Yeah, that will cause a depression. But that's not clinical depression.

You can become clinically depressed even when you are doing right and everything's going well.

 

[tinytim]

1 Corinthians 10:13 tells us,



tinytim,
Notice that word 'temptation'. It does not say 'burdens.' We will have burdens. The Bible says many are the afflictions of the righteous, but the Lord delivereth them out of them all.'

Now, that being said, suicide is not a burden, it is a temptation. People are tempted to commit suicide, not burdened by it. 1 Corinthians says that the Lord will make a way of escape that we may be able to bear the tribulation, not give in to it.

canady and rex,

Notice one thing about that verse that speaks of lunaticks? Jesus did not prescribe drugs, nor did He send them to a psychiatrist to be analyzed. He healed them then and there.

Drugs are not needed for depression.

Sir, I feel you have crossed the line.

You are not a Dr. There are a lot of things that God has revealed to man through the ages that have helped mankind. Drugs that cure illnesses are one of them... Depression can be caused by a chemical inbalance. It is as much an illness as any other.

I'm sure you have taken medicine in the past for certain things... Maybe even are on some prescription drug now.

I know that what I am about say could be construed as mean spirited, but I don't want to come off that way. I mean this with the utmost respect for you. We have debated in the past, and have agreed in the past, so please don't be offended by this statement:

I notice you wear glasses... Jesus never prescribed glasses for anyone either... he healed them.

Now, that said, I wear them too.
YOu said he never prescribed drugs, he healed them. To be consistent, then let's both throw away our glasses, go see benny hinn and be healed.

We both know that is ridiculous, but so is the statement that depression cannot be treated with drugs.

SFIC, I truly feel you are a man of God, your wife also. (well she is a woman of God) So please analyze what you said. There are many Christians that are suffering from depression, and you are slamming your brothers and sisters in Christ, by saying they are that way because of demons.

That is dangerous. I plead with you to reconsider what you believe, or maybe talk to some professional people that are aware of clinical depression.

Again, I mean no offense, I just hurt for all the depressed that may read your posts.

 

[canadyjd]

canady and rex,

Notice one thing about that verse that speaks of lunaticks? Jesus did not prescribe drugs, nor did He send them to a psychiatrist to be analyzed. He healed them then and there.

Drugs are not needed for depression.

So Rex77 finds a verse that you ask for, and you find a way to dismiss it? Let's follow your logic...

The people in v.23 who had "every kind of disease and every kind of sickness", were healed without medicine as well. Since that pretty much covers everything, to be consistent, you must believe all medicine should be done away with, as well as the doctors, nurses, and hospitals (since Jesus didn't use doctors, nurses, or hospitals). Nor should the paralytics get therapy, since Jesus didn't use therapists...and so on.

Is that what you are saying, or are you making a distinction concerning mental illness that is not found in the text? Yes, you are making a distinction concerning mental illness that is not found in the text, trying to make the text conform to what you already believe.

peace to youraise: