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Is the NKJV a good version of the bible?

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Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
How to get saved in the Cotton Patch Bible:

Letter to the Christians in Washington (formerly Romans 10:9-10)
{Cotton Patch Bible}:
Because if you come out in the open and say, "Jesus is Lord,"
and if you believe deep down in your heart that God raised
him from the dead, you shall be saved.
For by one’s heart one is activated into God’s program,
and by one’s mouth one makes the public declaration into salvation.

How to be saved in the NEW KING JAMES VERSION:
Romans 10:9-10 (nKJV):
that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus
and believe in your heart that God has raised
Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness,
and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
 

John of Japan

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
C4K said:
While off topic this has been a profitable thread with 2-3 good topics for reasonable discussion.

I am going to let it run, but would suggest you fellas move the topics to threads of their own so that the title may stir interest.
Roger that, C4K! :smilewinkgrin:
 

John of Japan

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Faith alone said:
Well you've been there quite awhile then. IMO that is mainly what it is. At the CBMW website they list the 900 or so places the TNIV changed the NIV which they do not agree with, and classify them. You can get an idea. My concern was grammatically changing singular to plural references, but it's difficult not to do that in modern English. You can find the TNIV website and they give examples of the kinds of changes involved. Compare them yourself. I'd be interested in your opinion.
Thanks for the info. I'll check that out when I get a chance.
http://rockhay.tripod.com/cottonpatch/index.htm

Here's an example, and yes he was serious:
Acts 1:6-23
OK, stop laughing.
Hey, what's wrong with George Jones as a disciple? Some of his music is good! :tongue3: :tongue3:
 

Ed Edwards

<img src=/Ed.gif>
John of Japan said:
...
Hey, what's wrong with George Jones as a disciple? Some of his music is good! :tongue3: :tongue3:
Uh, shouldn't music groups have names like this?

Daniel & the Lion's Din :praying:

BTW, The New King James Version (nKJV) is a GOOD Bible Version!!
 

Keith M

New Member
Ed, have you been listening to those old Jerry Clower and Grady Nutt records again???

:thumbsup: :laugh: :thumbs:

BTW, who was it that told the story about the three German police dogs? Ever heard that one?

And yes, I believe the NKJV is a good translation - I use it more often than any of the others.
 
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John of Japan

Well-Known Member
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Keith M said:
Ed, have you been listening to those old Jerry Clower and Grady Nutt records again???

BTW, who was it that told the story about the three German police dogs? Ever heard that one?

And yes, I believe the NKJV is a good translation - I use it more often than any of the others.
:laugh: :laugh:
What would a Jerry Clower version of the Bible be like?
 

Keith M

New Member
I don't know exactly, but I bet you couldn't read it without a guffaw every now and then! Jerry was really funny at times without resorting to much of the filth and degradation that masquerades as "comedy" these days. Today's worldly "comedy" is about as funny as a screen door in the tower of a submarine.
 

John of Japan

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Keith M said:
I don't know exactly, but I bet you couldn't read it without a guffaw every now and then! Jerry was really funny at times without resorting to much of the filth and degradation that masquerades as "comedy" these days. Today's worldly "comedy" is about as funny as a screen door in the tower of a submarine.
Amen! For us, culture shock is when we go back to the States after 5-6 years, turn on the boob tube and happen on a modern "situation comedy."

I'd love to see how Brother Clower translated the story of Balaam, or maybe Peter getting the tax money out of the fish's mouth, or those hornets chasing the Canaanites out of the promised land! :applause: (Have we gotten away from the OP???:saint: )
 
parsonbob said:
I enjoy reading the NKJV. Does it change the meaning or leave out verses like the NIV does.

I believe the NKJV is more accurate then the NIV because in the method the NIV uses to translate it sometimes puts in ideas that the Greek doesn't show or takes away ideas that are in the Greek. Also I like how the NKJV shows what words are not in the Greek by using italics. Also it's nice to see what the Majority, TR and Critical texts all say which the NKJV does for you but the NIV is lacking in this area as well. The NIV may have sold more then the NKJV but I certainly don't believe it is better.
 

Faith alone

New Member
MatthewDiscipleOfGod said:
I believe the NKJV is more accurate then the NIV because in the method the NIV uses to translate it sometimes puts in ideas that the Greek doesn't show or takes away ideas that are in the Greek. Also I like how the NKJV shows what words are not in the Greek by using italics. Also it's nice to see what the Majority, TR and Critical texts all say which the NKJV does for you but the NIV is lacking in this area as well. The NIV may have sold more then the NKJV but I certainly don't believe it is better.
I suppose you're referring to the "dynamic equivalent" method of translating. The question is whether or not using such a method for translating does as you say or whether or not it allows the ideas to be communicated more clearly. A Bible which is too rigid has issues as well.

FA
 
Faith alone said:
I suppose you're referring to the "dynamic equivalent" method of translating. The question is whether or not using such a method for translating does as you say or whether or not it allows the ideas to be communicated more clearly. A Bible which is too rigid has issues as well.

FA

True, a translation shouldn't be true rigid. I just wish other translations would make a better practice of letting people know what words they are using are not even in the Greek text.
 

Faith alone

New Member
MatthewDiscipleOfGod said:
True, a translation shouldn't be true rigid. I just wish other translations would make a better practice of letting people know what words they are using are not even in the Greek text.
Matthew,

I think I understand what you mean. But of course the words are in Greek, not English, and there is not a direct one-to-one correspondence. IOW, a word, phrase, etc. in Greek can be translated in different ways depending on context. Also, what we are most concerned about is that the intended meaning of the original writer (inspired by the Spirit) is communicated clearly and accurately into English.

So the question is if an idea not in the Greek text is being translated, or the reverse: an idea in the Greek text is not being translated into English. For example, in the original TNIV they translated 1 Timothy 3:11 to refer to "deaconesses," which idea was not in the Greek text. They later revised it to use "women" instead, which idea was there.

And we must remember that when translations express things which do not appear to be in the original languages that the translators are attempting to be accurate and clear, but in the process of trying to be clear, sometimes the meaning adds something or misses something which should have been retained. IOW, it is not done on purpose or with the idea of changing the intended meaning, but with a desire to make the meaning clear. Sometimes some accuracy is lost due to the desire to be clear and easy to understand.

Stick to your guns about what you expect in your Bible, but remember that for children and ESL, those translations are often quite effective with their goal to be clear and easily understood.

FA
 

Bro Tony

New Member
No parsonbob, the NKJV does not change words or meaning. As a matter of fact it is from the same Greek Text (Stephens 1550) that was used for the KJV.

Bro Tony
 

Faith alone

New Member
parsonBob said:
I enjoy reading the NKJV. Does it change the meaning or leave out verses like the NIV does.
Bro Tony said:
No parsonbob, the NKJV does not change words or meaning. As a matter of fact it is from the same Greek Text (Stephens 1550) that was used for the KJV.

Bro Tony
I agree with brother Tony. The NKJV is simply a revision of the KJV, though a significant one (which was desperately needed due to the way the language and words have changed in nearly 400 years). They are both based on the Stephanus mild revision of Erasmus' 3rd edition of his Greek text, often referred to as the textus receptus.

Though, and perhaps you are aware, many modern textual critics - almost all of them - see many problems with the textus receptus. The NIV did not change the meaning of verses (due to the Greek text) or leave out verses as some say. IMO it is more likely that the KJV added, removed or left out text - because it was not based on the oldest or most reliable Greek texts. Other areas in which they differ are due to the very old language the KJV used and the style of translation employed by the NIV - a "dynamic equivalent" one which places more value on meaning that "form."

I've had KJV-only guys list verses in which the NIV has erred, but they can all be easily addressed, usually showing the KJV instead to be amiss. It all comes down to which Greek textual family you adhere to. But what needs to be made clear is that the textus receptus was compiled by Erasmus from only 6 or 7 manuscripts, only one for Paul's letters, and only one for the gospels. The one he had for Revelation (only one again) was incomplete, so he apparently back-translated from the Latin for the last few verses of chapter 22. Also, though those who hold to the family that the textus receptus represents, called the "majority text," is actually not in the majority in older manuscripts. The vast majority of the Greek texts of the majority text are very recent (in the past few hundred years - after 1000AD). If you look at those manuscripts before say 900AD the critical text is in the majority, and the older you get very few "majority text" manuscripts are found.

So you've got to consider what the experts on such things say and then make your choice. I used to support the majority text, and I still like it. I have a few copies of it in my library. But now I hold more to the "critical text." I see advantages to both.

There are tons of websites out there which have put down the NIV. Most of them are run by amateurs, as is true on the web for most topics these days, and are running with outdated and inaccurate information which they cannot support. I am not a fan of the NIV. But most of the criticisms you read about it are not valid, IMO.

The KJV (and NKJV) strictly follow a "formal equivalent" method of translation while the NIV is more "dynamic equivalent" or "meaning based." That is what accounts for 90 - 95% of the differences between the two translations. I would say that you could pick almost any text in the NT at random and compare the KJV and the NIV. Sometimes the KJV (and NKJV) will be more accurate, and often the NIV will be closer to the original intended meaning.


But back to the original question... No, the NKJV is not based on the critical text. It is strictly textus receptus all the way.

FA
 

franklinmonroe

Active Member
parsonbob said:
I enjoy reading the NKJV. Does it change the meaning or leave out verses like the NIV does.

It seems that it depends on what is meant by "good". To some the method of translation is the utmost important thing. NKJV is rather literal; probably a "good" thing if your intention is study in depth with aids (commentary, dictionaries, etc). The reader may have a more clear opportunity to interpret the "meaning" for themself, without being lead or mislead by the translator of a less literal version.

To others, the underlying text is the most important characteristic of any translation. The NKJV is based upon the greek textus receptus (TR). The TR could be considered a "good" greek text, although some would argue it is not the best. We can say it is good because it agrees with the greek majority text (MT) and the greek critical text (CT) in about 95% of the scriptures. For the most part, other versions (the NIV would be one example) do not "leave out verses", but only translate the verses that are actually there in its underlying greek CT or MT.

Thirdly, the NKJV has been prepare carefully as to its literary features. It may or may not support your present theology... but, yes, I think its is overall a "good" translation.
 

Askjo

New Member
parsonbob said:
Does it change the meaning or leave out verses like the NIV does.
Yes, Look at some words what the NKJV changed or added or removed.

For example: The NKJV changed:

Mourning vs leviathan

Son vs Servant

Worship Him vs Kneel down Him

faults vs trespass

Condemnation vs judgment

gods VS God

And more...
 
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