Is the pendulum swinging in a different direction?

[MennoSota]

Not at all ,all the historic confessions of faith were clear that the gifts had ceased and based it on scripture.
There are no Apostles or prophets on earth today....none

Again, we're Phillips daughters prophetesses? Did their prophesies get placed in the canon of scripture?
Prophesy does not have to be foretelling of the future.

It doesn't bother me if you choose to believe the gifts of tongues and prophecy have ceased, however, you can't make a solid argument from scripture, by manufacturing the canon of scripture theory from 1 Corinthians 13.

 

[righteousdude2]

As I have said, I've never experienced speaking in tongues but I have experienced the gift you describe of the interceding work of the Spirit.

I've never said I was a skeptic. I said that I never spoke in tongues. There is a
difference. Why, earlier in your life, did you feel the need to be hostile to those who "spoke in tongues"?

Thank you for your answers. I suppose in a way you have answered my question. I am left with the notion that the benefit you derive from praying in tongues is the same benefit I derive without the tongues part.

I wasn't as hosile as maybe judgmental. I went around looking to argue that the gift was not for today. I was even on a denomiation committee that went to churches that had tongue speaking pastors, and helped to remove the men from the conference.

Then one day, on the road to .... I was struck with a supernatural revelation, and though I was vehemently against the gift, I was hit with undeniable evidence that I was wrong, or, in err.

God does seem to have a sense of humor.

 

[MennoSota]

The Apostles were to be guided into all truth...not some...that promise was fulfilled...we have been given all that pertains to life and godliness...in scripture.

This does not mean that God doesn't give the gift of tongues and prophesy. It just means that you can't fathom how God could give those gifts today.

 

[righteousdude2]

No, you do.

Yes, groaning which CANNOT be uttered. Not jibber jabber where you don't have a clue what you are saying. You could be praying that all your loved ones get cancer for all you know! If you can understand it you don't need it, if you can't understand it does not edify you. Take Paul's advice in 1 Corinthians 14:19 I would rather speak five words with my understanding, that I might instruct others also, than ten thousand words in another language.

I did take his advice, and followed his example. Show me in scripture where Paul ceased speaking in tongues. And please don't give me your interpretation of the scripture. I can only assume that your vehement protests, are based on your own lack of experience of anything beyond book knowledge.

I serve a living God. A God that changes to meet the needs of the people in the time they live, not some time 2,000 years ago. If God could, and that is a big could, remove tongues from the package of gifts for the church to use, what says He can't and won't give the gift AGAIN. Just because it isn't for you bro, doesn't mean it isn't for others.

In fact, while I don't judge you, and haven't since this thread began, it is apparent that you have set yourself up as judge and jury. You may ask yourself why that is???

I am not trying to be provocative, just would like to share what's on my heart. You've referred to the use of tongues as being for stupid folks (because don't need tongues, He.speaks English), mentally ill folks, etc. If that isn't judging, what is.

Can't you just agree to disagree? I can live with that, and wonder why you can't?

BTW - did you even bother to read the links attached to this OP. There is a growing number of Baptist using tongues, and prayer languages. Why is that? Could the times be a changin'?

 

[Iconoclast]

This does not mean that God doesn't give the gift of tongues and prophesy. It just means that you can't fathom how God could give those gifts today.

There is no more new revelation....that is what i can fathom....there is no need or point to new revelation that does not give new revelation.

 

[JonC]

I wasn't as hosile as maybe judgmental. I went around looking to argue that the gift was not for today. I was even on a denomiation committee that went to churches that had tongue speaking pastors, and helped to remove the men from the conference.

Then one day, on the road to .... I was struck with a supernatural revelation, and though I was vehemently against the gift, I was hit with undeniable evidence that I was wrong, or, in err.

God does seem to have a sense of humor.

So the scales fell from your eyes .

What denomination, if you don't mind the question (if you do that's fine), did you belong to? I had never heard of a committee removing tongue speaking pastors....but then again, I've never been a member of a church that practiced "speaking in tongues".

 

[Iconoclast]

I did take his advice, and followed his example. Show me in scripture where Paul ceased speaking in tongues. And please don't give me your interpretation of the scripture. I can only assume that your vehement protests, are based on your own lack of experience of anything beyond book knowledge.

I serve a living God. A God that changes to meet the needs of the people in the time they live, not some time 2,000 years ago. If God could, and that is a big could, remove tongues from the package of gifts for the church to use, what says He can't and won't give the gift AGAIN. Just because it isn't for you bro, doesn't mean it isn't for others.

In fact, while I don't judge you, and haven't since this thread began, it is apparent that you have set yourself up as judge and jury. You may ask yourself why that is???

I am not trying to be provocative, just would like to share what's on my heart. You've referred to the use of tongues as being for stupid folks (because don't need tongues, He.speaks English), mentally ill folks, etc. If that isn't judging, what is.

Can't you just agree to disagree? I can live with that, and wonder why you can't?

BTW - did you even bother to read the links attached to this OP. There is a growing number of Baptist using tongues, and prayer languages. Why is that? Could the times be a changin'?

No one speaks in tongues.....the rhyming noises are nonsense...This is a poor substitute for real spiritual service to God, it lets people feel they are doing spiritual things when in fact it is carnal to the max.

 

[JonC]

There is no more new revelation....that is what i can fathom....there is no need or point to new revelation that does not give new revelation.

Not speaking for them, but from what I gather they seem to be pointing to an unveiling rather than divine special revelation (i.e., God revealing the truth of what has already been revealed in Scripture in terms of divine revelation).

It'd be like me speaking Yankee to yous guys.

Sorry....went to a Roger Waters concert this weekend. Still getting over inhaling all of those second hand bengay fumes.

 

[Iconoclast]

We live in a day when all kind of things are claimed. When the foolishness is pointed out, the defense becomes all the foolish ones are of course not real....but the one the deceived person has is the real McCoy sure...thousands are shown doing foolish things...they are wrong...but somehow the person claiming their personal experience, or outer body experience....was the Spirit moving....if the truth be known if you followed these people you would see them mumbling those foolish rhyming sounds and vain repetitive sounds arms swaying over their heads...just the same as the ones who are called false on the youtube videos.

 

[MennoSota]

There is no more new revelation....that is what i can fathom....there is no need or point to new revelation that does not give new revelation.

You are struggling with this.
Was Nathan acting as a prophet when he told David he had sinned by killing Uriah? The revelation was not something new, David had hidden his sin, but the revelation revealed his sin.
I see no reason why God cannot do such things in the church today, especially with the many sins in the church.

 

[TCassidy]

He is the Perfect Word and when He returns the perfect will come. One day tongues and prophecy will cease. It just isn't at the time the canon of scripture was established.

So what is now incomplete about Christ? What is a "partial" Christ?

 

[TCassidy]

Show me in scripture where Paul ceased speaking in tongues.

When he died. Which I have said at least three times in this thread.

 

[TCassidy]

Can't you just agree to disagree?

I never agree with false doctrine.

 

[MennoSota]

So what is now incomplete about Christ? What is a "partial" Christ?

Our understanding is incomplete. We see in a mirror darkly.
This isn't difficult, yet you play like you are ignorant. Anymore pretzels you care to twist, TC? [emoji41]

 

[MennoSota]

When he died. Which I have said at least three times in this thread.

LOL, the more you share the more it becomes clear that you write in tongues. [emoji56]

 

[MennoSota]

I never agree with false doctrine.

You must battle with yourself daily. [emoji41]

 

[righteousdude2]

So the scales fell from your eyes .

What denomination, if you don't mind the question (if you do that's fine), did you belong to? I had never heard of a committee removing tongue speaking pastors....but then again, I've never been a member of a church that practiced "speaking in tongues".

It was the church I was brought into the ministry with, the church of God, Anderson, IN. Some big names in music came out of that denomination. Bill and Gloria Gaither, Sandy Patty.

To be honest though, because of my divorce, they dropped my credentials. I found myself attending a large SBC church, and they moved in tongues. Of course, I didn't think this was the right thing to do, and the conference removed the pastor! I was the youth minister for him for over a year, and had a large group of teens. But, the interim pastor and church board decided to fire me, wanting a clean slate.

I wandered into another SBC. and they also spoke and practiced tongues, and that is where I saw the light, so to speak. This is the same church that Ordained and licensed me. I still see folks from both churches, and the huge church which grew to 10,000 strong, and changed their name, for all the road blocks to the pastor I worked under, converted to tongues and is now a charismatic SBC church! Times they are a changing'!

 

[righteousdude2]

I never agree with false doctrine.

Well, I admire your stance. And right or wrong (you and your views), I still see you as a brother.We will both praise and worship the Father in heaven one day, so get used to that. LOL

 

[Reformed]

I have no problem with people praying in tongues. Nor do I have a problem with people praying lying down prostrate on the floor. Or praying looking to the sky. I don’t even have a problem with someone literally going into their closet to pray.

I believe that our experience of God may be unique and subjective – but the God we are experiencing is immutable and objective. The man praying on his knee is no more or less experiencing God because of his physical position than the woman praying as she drives down the road.

If praying in tongues is legitimate, and I believe it may be, then it is no more or less than anyone else experiencing the intercession of the Holy Spirit without such expression. It is simply not my business how a man or woman expresses themselves to God in the privacy of their own home.

But it never stays just in the home. I believe that evidence is clear that the Charismatic and Pentecostal movements have done more to spread falsehood into the modern evangelical church than anything else. I made the point earlier that there is no spiritual benefit a person gets from praying in tongues than they get from praying in their native language. It does not bring them closer to God. They are not more spiritually attuned. God does not hear them more than any other Christian. I can go on. Also, why limit the sign gifts to just tongues? Why not healing and casting out demons? Once you open the door a crack you have to let everything it. You do not get to set up arbitrary rules to keep the other things out. Once you do that you are full blown Pentecostal.

 

[Squire Robertsson]

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