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NO, I don't think so!Earlier I said Acts is a transitional book.Several times there are accounts of Ot believers being transitioned into the Nt....like this
They believed as did OT saints, then were brought into the nt reality.
NO, I don't think so!
John's baptism was before the cross.
Phillips preaching and baptizing was after the cross...big difference.
Philip preached Christ
John preached repentance...again different.
The ones in chapter 19 were not baptized in the name of Jesus until Paul baptized them.
Philip baptized them in the name of Jesus.
Yet....NONE had received the Holy Spirit!
Acts 8:19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.Are you still hung up on tongues? DId I say tongues were the manifestation?
If Simeon just saw it in the preaching..then he would not have wanted what the others had. You are grasping at straws here!
THat is another thread about Simeons salvation! The point that you keep avoiding is that they did not receive the Holy Spirit when they believed and were baptized. WHY?Acts 8:19 Saying, Give me also this power, that on whomsoever I lay hands, he may receive the Holy Ghost.
Simeon was not saved.
He wanted what Philip and the Apostles had.
Oh, I saw it and addressed it!They only knew Johns baptism....repent the kingdom of heaven is at hand....they were ot believers in the nt time.....read it again, although you will not see it if you are still angling for the error.There are several times in Acts where it is seen....if anyone wants to see it.
Now you claim that these believers were not saved??THat is another thread about Simeons salvation! The point that you keep avoiding is that they did not receive the Holy Spirit when they believed and were baptized. WHY?
The way you believe contradicts too many scriptures about the baptism in the Holy Spirit. Too many unanswered questions!
Back to the same old tricks....Read my post earlier I said THEY WERE SAVED AND BAPTIZED.Now you claim that these believers were not saved??
Nice try...but it said they did not receive the Holy Spirit until after they believed the word and was baptized. Read vs. 16!The entire point of the passage is to demonstrate that they did receive the Holy Spirit. It is a difficult passage for Charismatics to swallow.
No, you just did not read my post with understanding! Go back and read them!Acts 8:8 There was great joy in that city.
--Why was there great joy?
Acts 8:12 But when they believed Philip preaching good news concerning the Kingdom of God and the name of Jesus Christ, they were baptized, both men and women.
--What exactly do you think happened here? How did this differ from Pentecost? (Acts 2:41). You avoided this question.
Symbolic or not...they did not receive until the hands were laid on them...read vs 16-17.What Iconoclast has been telling you is correct. You should listen.
The church was going through a time of transition. This is a historical book.
At Pentecost, what happened:
The Jews repented,
were baptized,
received the Holy Spirit.
Here in Samaria:
The Samaritans believed,
were baptized,
had the apostles lay hands upon them and pray for them,
received the Holy Spirit.
But yet they were both saved in the exact same way.
The apostles laid hands on them symbolically, to authenticate that salvation had actually come to the Samaritans; that no one could speak against it. It strengthened the unity of the church.
We can say what the Bible says! It is clear that Simeon saw something when he saw Peter and John lay hands on them.What did Simeon see?
The Scriptures do not say that he saw anything supernatural (though it is possible). The Scriptures are silent here. Simeon could simply be referring back to the miracles and power-filled preaching of Philip. He could be referring to the praying of the Apostles which I am sure were "full of grace and power." There were no cloven tongues of fire, no mighty rushing wind, etc. They received the Holy Spirit as the Scripture says. Beyond that we can say nothing.
Simon wanting to buy the power of the Holy Spirit was wrong, this I will agree with!From the desire of Simeon to gain power through monetary means comes the word "simony," the definition of which is just that--gaining some religious office, or any sacred gain, through monetary means. It includes the sale of indulgences and all forms of supposed spiritual benefits that come as a result of money.
And the only proper and honest thing to do is:But He still saw something when Peter and John laid hands on them!
But the question goes unanswered....And the only proper and honest thing to do is:
Where the Bible is silent, I am silent also.
Do not read any more into the Bible then what is already there.
Maybe he saw a two-headed elephant with five horns protruding.
You can read anything you want into the Scriptures. So don't.
Don't read anything into the Bible. Where the Bible is silent, then be silent.
I do believe we can get it all at conversion (The Gentiles are a good example of this). But the answer to the question still goes unanswered about Acts 8.In answer to the OP: Yes -- and it happens at conversion.
I do believe we can get it all at conversion (The Gentiles are a good example of this). But the answer to the question still goes unanswered about Acts 8.
Well then you don't mind sharing to help some of us understand it without contradicting other scriptures..Not to me it doesn't. This was settled for me many years ago, and I'd rather not revisit it. Suffice it to say that the way it was settled made me decisively not Pentecostal or Charismatic.
And yet I don't believe any of the gifts of the Spirit have ceased.
The question was asked and answered. I went verse by verse through the entire passage with you. If you refuse or reject the answers given I can't help you. Your unbelief is astounding.But the question goes unanswered....
IF they were saved and baptized...why didn't they receive the Holy Spirit?
YOu never answered the question...go back and read it for yourself. You side stepped it!The question was asked and answered. I went verse by verse through the entire passage with you. If you refuse or reject the answers given I can't help you. Your unbelief is astounding.
This is what I see in scriptures too! The filling comes more than once!Like most Baptist I have been asked many times "Have you been filled with the Spirit"? To which I reply, "Yes many times"? followed by "Did you speak in tongues"? When I answer no they usually look at me as if to say what a pity.