Israel and the Fig Tree

[1689Dave]

Prior to the return of Christ, theScriptures present two Israels.

Those Gentiles redeemed are called Israel because they are grafted into those redeemed of Israel. Then there is the national/political social geographical larger grouping.

The Scriptures teach in the OT program presentation by the prophets and in the NT as shown in my post of the national return of the national Israel.

Just because some future scheme of human conjuring in which the racial bias against Jews obliged ignoring, disregarding, discrediting, displacing, and gerrymandering the Scriptures to remove the Jewish influence and presence in the last times does not oblige me to agree.

The single scheme that is not ultimately racist and biased against Jews is the premillennial return of Christ. That from all noteworthy historians is also the teaching of the early church. This scheme is not “Darby dispensation” but the oldest and the one most conformed to Scriptures.

God removed the unbelievers from Israel in Romans 11. If they are Israel to whom are they reattached upon having faith in Christ? “And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.” Romans 11:23 (NASB95)

 

[agedman]

Roy,
As far as Jesus Returning, I believe every Passage in The Bible Teaches Jesus is Coming, and that Jesus'Return is The End of Time and This Present World.

Good thing I know the Bible teaches FAR more than your limited presentation.

The Lord Jesus Christ’s return IS NOT the end, but the end of the beginning that ultimately concludes in the end a millennium later.

How sad it is that whole prophecy’s of greater portions than spoken of His first advent and yet still unfulfilled are disregarded in your view presented.

 

[1689Dave]

Good thing I know the Bible teaches FAR more than your limited presentation.

The Lord Jesus Christ’s return IS NOT the end, but the end of the beginning that ultimately concludes in the end a millennium later.

How sad it is that whole prophecy’s of greater portions than spoken of His first advent and yet still unfulfilled are disregarded in your view presented.

Jesus taught against a physical Kingdom Millennium. He said his kingdom comes without observation. And only the born again can see it. He said it is not of this world.

 

[agedman]

God removed the unbelievers from Israel in Romans 11. If they are Israel to whom are they reattached upon having faith in Christ? “And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.” Romans 11:23 (NASB95)

Again
Argue with this Scripture:

25Lest you be wise in your own sight (Speaking to Gentiles) I do not want you (Gentiles) to be unaware of this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
he will banish ungodliness from Jacob”; (that is the national ungodly Israel)
27“and this will be my covenant with them (national ungodly Israel)
when I take away their sins.”


28As regards the gospel, they (national ungodly Israel) are enemies for your (Gentile) sake. But as regards election, they (Israel) are beloved for the sake of their (Israel) forefathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For just as you (Gentiles) were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience, 31so they (Israel) too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you(Gentiles) they (Israel) also may now receive mercy. 32For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all.

33Oh, the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and how inscrutable his ways!
34“For who has known the mind of the Lord,
or who has been his counselor?”
35“Or who has given a gift to him
that he might be repaid?”
36For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen.

The currently ungodly Israel people have been given an “irrevocable trust” from God.

Any scheme that removes a gathering and ultimate redemption of the currently national ungodly Israel, is just heretically unScriptural.

The OT and NT statements are not diminished just because some monk decides they want to conjure up a scheme in which Jews are no part.

Throughout the centuries, the gentile church has hated the Jews.

Why do you think they developed post millennial , a-millennial, and preterist thinking? Every one of them is a lie from the ungodly bias toward both Jews and the very unbiased right teaching of Scriptures.

 

[agedman]

Jesus taught against a physical Kingdom Millennium. He said his kingdom comes without observation. And only the born again can see it. He said it is not of this world.

Are you really proclaiming The Apostle John was in some manner delusional?

 

[agedman]

For those who want a term for what I hold, it is chiliasm.

It is the teaching that the physical return of Christ as King of Kings is the beginning of the never ending rule. That rule continues on (as John summarizes in Revelation 19 to the end of his book and the Bible). The millennial end doesn’t end the rule of Christ. Every knee will bow, even those long dead.

Some declare the Nicene creed disavowed the Chiliasm. That is misinterpretation of “whose kingdom shall have no end.”

From the point of the physical return of Christ, and the established rule of the millennium, there is no ceasing, not even a pause.

How can one pause and cease when time is no more?

 

[robycop3]

Jesus taught against a physical Kingdom Millennium. He said his kingdom comes without observation. And only the born again can see it. He said it is not of this world.

RIGHT NOW, the PHYSICAL KOG is not of this world, but when Jesus returns, it WILL be, FOR EVER.

 

[robycop3]

"This generation" will be the one that sees the beginning of the ACTUAL signs that Jesus' physical return is imminent. All those signs will occur in short order of each other. I believe the next one will be either the Jews' building a new temple in Jerusalem, or the 'beast's' coming to power.

 

[Alan Gross]

Mark 13:28; "Now learn a parable of the fig tree; When her branch is yet tender, and putteth forth leaves, ye know that summer is near:

29."So ye in like manner, when ye shall see these things come to pass, know that it is nigh, even at the doors.

30" Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done.

31 "Heaven and earth shall pass away: but my words shall not pass away."

Mark 13:28 mentions a Fig Tree, a branch, leaves, & summer, in a Parable.

JESUS Said, in verse 29, that The Parable of The Fig Tree is a sign to watch for "it" and in verse 30 that "all these things" would take place within that Generation.

Verse 31 Says Jesus' Words Will Last Forever.

Why is anyone talking about, "Israel"?

 

[1689Dave]

RIGHT NOW, the PHYSICAL KOG is not of this world, but when Jesus returns, it WILL be, FOR EVER.

But not as the "Millennium" people look for today. It will be a spiritual kingdom completed in the new heavens and earth.

 

[1689Dave]

Are you really proclaiming The Apostle John was in some manner delusional?

No, Jesus said the kingdom is spiritual and not of this world. Are you adding to Revelation saying it is?

 

[1689Dave]

Again
Argue with this Scripture:

25Lest you be wise in your own sight (Speaking to Gentiles) I do not want you (Gentiles) to be unaware of this mystery, brothers: a partial hardening has come upon Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. 26And in this way all Israel will be saved, as it is written,

“The Deliverer will come from Zion,
he will banish ungodliness from Jacob”; (that is the national ungodly Israel)
27“and this will be my covenant with them (national ungodly Israel)
when I take away their sins.”


28As regards the gospel, they (national ungodly Israel) are enemies for your (Gentile) sake. But as regards election, they (Israel) are beloved for the sake of their (Israel) forefathers. 29For the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable. 30For just as you (Gentiles) were at one time disobedient to God but now have received mercy because of their disobedience, 31so they (Israel) too have now been disobedient in order that by the mercy shown to you(Gentiles) they (Israel) also may now receive mercy. 32For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all.

33Oh, the depth of the riches and wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are his judgments and how inscrutable his ways!
34“For who has known the mind of the Lord,
or who has been his counselor?”
35“Or who has given a gift to him
that he might be repaid?”
36For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen.

The currently ungodly Israel people have been given an “irrevocable trust” from God.

Any scheme that removes a gathering and ultimate redemption of the currently national ungodly Israel, is just heretically unScriptural.

The OT and NT statements are not diminished just because some monk decides they want to conjure up a scheme in which Jews are no part.

Throughout the centuries, the gentile church has hated the Jews.

Why do you think they developed post millennial , a-millennial, and preterist thinking? Every one of them is a lie from the ungodly bias toward both Jews and the very unbiased right teaching of Scriptures.

“And they also, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.” Romans 11:23 (NASB95) If they are Israel, to whom are the believers grafted into?

 

[Alan Gross]

On the 6 "Jesus is Coming" threads that I have posted, so far, noone has pointed out:

1.) Bible scholars use the above scripture as proof positive that our Lord will return within a generation of the year 1948, the year of modern Israel's founding.

Or 2.) "how many years are in a generation"

Or, 3.) "The currently ungodly Israel people have been given an “irrevocable trust” from God."

Or 4.) what The Nicene Creed did, or did not Avow.

Or, 5.) a Spriritual Kingdom,

Or, 6.) a Physical Kingdom,

Or, 7.) Any scheme that removes a gathering and ultimate redemption of the currently national ungodly Israel, is just heretically unScriptural.

Or, 8.) The OT and NT statements are not diminished just because some monk decides they want to conjure up a scheme in which Jews are no part.

I'm glad.

A Fig Tree caused enough wild, rash guesswork.

 

[robycop3]

But not as the "Millennium" people look for today. It will be a spiritual kingdom completed in the new heavens and earth.

Scripture plainly says Jesus will return, take control of the earth, & rule the nations with a rod of iron. That's a PHYSICAL kingdom, any way ya look at it.

 

[robycop3]

No, Jesus said the kingdom is spiritual and not of this world. Are you adding to Revelation saying it is?

And RIGHT NOW, it IS spiritual. We are part of it, even though it's invisible now. But Jesus is returning to make it PHYSICAL. Thus says Scripture.

 

[1689Dave]

Scripture plainly says Jesus will return, take control of the earth, & rule the nations with a rod of iron. That's a PHYSICAL kingdom, any way ya look at it.

Jesus presently rules the nations with a rod of iron from David's throne from heavenly Jerusalem. When he returns, it will be earth's last day where the resurrection, followed by the rapture takes place. This followed by the conflagration of the heavens and earth and the creation of the new heavens and earth. There is no physical millennium in the future.

 

[1689Dave]

And RIGHT NOW, it IS spiritual. We are part of it, even though it's invisible now. But Jesus is returning to make it PHYSICAL. Thus says Scripture.

No millennium, instead, a new heavens and earth.

 

[robycop3]

Jesus presently rules the nations with a rod of iron from David's throne from heavenly Jerusalem.

Oh, REALLY????????????????????????????????
Then, why is SIN so prevalent?

When he returns, it will be earth's last day where the resurrection, followed by the rapture takes place. This followed by the conflagration of the heavens and earth and the creation of the new heavens and earth. There is no physical millennium in the future.

Sir, I strongly recommend you read the Revelation CLOSELY, beginning with Ch. 19. The sequence of coming events laid out beginning in that chapter is Jesus returning to rule the nations with a rod of iron. The beast sends his army to fight Him, but he destroys it with the power of His spoken word, then the beast & false prophet are cast alive into the lake of fire. Then, Satan is bound & cast into "the abyss" where he can't affect anything on earth. Then. Jesus & His saints rule THE EARTH for 1k years.

When the 1k years are over, Satan is released from the abyss, & incites the nations to rebel against Jesus; they gather an army that surrounds His "camp" in Jerusalem, but fire comes from heaven & destroys that army. Satan is then cast into the LOF, Jesus sets up the "Great White Throne" judgment,

You may see those facts by READING THE REVELATION in any valid Bible version you wish. I believe SCRIPTURE over the semi-pret nonsense you've been posting.

 

[robycop3]

No millennium, instead, a new heavens and earth.

As succintly as I can put it, Sir - According to the Revelation, YOU ARE WRONG !

 

[1689Dave]

Oh, REALLY????????????????????????????????
Then, why is SIN so prevalent?



Sir, I strongly recommend you read the Revelation CLOSELY, beginning with Ch. 19. The sequence of coming events laid out beginning in that chapter is Jesus returning to rule the nations with a rod of iron. The beast sends his army to fight Him, but he destroys it with the power of His spoken word, then the beast & false prophet are cast alive into the lake of fire. Then, Satan is bound & cast into "the abyss" where he can't affect anything on earth. Then. Jesus & His saints rule THE EARTH for 1k years.

When the 1k years are over, Satan is released from the abyss, & incites the nations to rebel against Jesus; they gather an army that surrounds His "camp" in Jerusalem, but fire comes from heaven & destroys that army. Satan is then cast into the LOF, Jesus sets up the "Great White Throne" judgment,

You may see those facts by READING THE REVELATION in any valid Bible version you wish. I believe SCRIPTURE over the semi-pret nonsense you've been posting.

If you add a physical kingdom to Revelation 20, you add to Revelation something that Jesus refutes in the gospels.