It's a Sin to Disrespect the President and to not Submit to his Authority

[Zaac]

13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor. Romans 13:1-7

We don't have to like some of his decisions but we are called to honor, respect and submit to his authority as God allowed him to be placed there.

How different the Christian testimony would be if rather than disrespecting the President and calling him names at every given opportunity, the people of God chose to look beyond their situation and to Christ and eternity and prayed for the man any time they wanted to get heated about one of the decisions made by him or his administration?

Shouldn't the Body of Christ be setting the example?

 

[Bro. Curtis]

The logical outcome of that thought line is Rosa Parks sits in the back of the bus, and shuts up about it.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

And african-americans needed to accept that they were slaves.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Women should have accepted their status in the work place.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Jesus should not have performed miracles on the sabbath.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Respecting the office of the President, or any leader, does not mean that one can never point out the wrongdoings of any official. That is really what you're complaining about, and you can forget it.

We have ample examples from the Bible.

• The prophet Nathan had to approach King David with a very bad report about his wrongdoing with Bathsheba.
• Shadrach, Meshach, and Abed-Nego told the King, "We have no need to answer you on this matter."
• Jesus himself said of Herod, "Go and tell that fox, 'Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal' " (Luke 13:32; and by the way, calling Herod a "fox" was not exactly a term of endearment; the Greek alopex means sly or devious).
• Peter and John told the Elders of Jerusalem, “"Whether it is right in the sight of God to give heed to you rather than to God, you be the judge;for we cannot stop speaking about what we have seen and heard" ” (Acts 4:19-20).

So, Zaac, drop it. We're not going to stop criticizing this president, nor am I going to stop calling him the "Great Pretender" because, quite honestly, I can't stand to type his name. He is indeed alopex. Makes Herod look like a choir boy.

 

[poncho]

For at least the past half-century Christian pastors and churches have been all but neutered. On the whole, they have ignored Christ’s admonition to be the “salt of the earth,” and as a result, have failed to do much of anything to preserve freedom’s Biblical Natural Law principles in this great land. In fact, the average church is so sugary sweet that it is downright sickening!

And the two main reasons for this dereliction of duty by America’s pastors and churches are the IRS 501c3 non-profit tax status, which turns the Lord’s church into a government corporation; and the erroneous, fallacious interpretation of Romans chapter 13 that teaches Christians are obligated to submit to government regardless of whether government acts within the confines and jurisdiction of God’s law or not. In reality, the American church today, on the whole, is not even a church. It is a government corporation whose loyalty is offered first to Caesar, not to Christ, and whose message is first politically correct before it is Biblically correct.

It is more than interesting that some 95% of the 14,000 evangelical churches that graced the German landscape during Hitler’s rise to power bought into the identical misinterpretation of Romans 13 that the vast majority (probably at least 95%) of the 300,000 evangelical churches that grace America’s landscape have bought into today.

http://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/320/Romans-13-Setting-It-Straight.aspx

First you condemn us for being evil then you condemn us for not following evil. Make up your mind Zaac.

 

[JohnDeereFan]

We don't have to like some of his decisions but we are called to honor, respect and submit to his authority as God allowed him to be placed there.

How different the Christian testimony would be if rather than disrespecting the President and calling him names at every given opportunity, the people of God chose to look beyond their situation and to Christ and eternity and prayed for the man any time they wanted to get heated about one of the decisions made by him or his administration?

Shouldn't the Body of Christ be setting the example?

A couple of problems with your defense of Obama.

The first and most obvious is that the president's authority is valid only inasmuch as he adheres to the Constitution. Virtually NOTHING this guy does is consistent with the Constitution. Therefore, he is acting outside his legal authority.

The second is that, while we are obligated to respect the office, we are under no obligation to respect the man, particularly not when the man has set himself up as an enemy of God.

Do we obey God or man?

 

[Zaac]

The logical outcome of that thought line is Rosa Parks sits in the back of the bus, and shuts up about it.

Or that the slaves brought to America allow themselves to remain in chains as their husbands were hung and scourged and their wives and daughters were raped and used. How dare they complain?

Or why not have Southern Baptists shut up about abortions and Roe vs Wade too?

Good ole Southern Baptists.

Let's not be stupid here. Nobody has said to submit to sin. Racism of the type encountered by Rosa Parks is clearly sinful.

 

[Zaac]

Respecting the office of the President, or any leader, does not mean that one can never point out the wrongdoings of any official. That is really what you're complaining about, and you can forget it.


So, Zaac, drop it. We're not going to stop criticizing this president, nor am I going to stop calling him the "Great Pretender" because, quite honestly, I can't stand to type his name. He is indeed alopex. Makes Herod look like a choir boy.

Yep, perhaps this is why God continues to give folks more of what they don't want? Forever trying to justify sin. It's such a liberal concept.

 

[Zaac]

For at least the past half-century Christian pastors and churches have been all but neutered. On the whole, they have ignored Christ’s admonition to be the “salt of the earth,” and as a result, have failed to do much of anything to preserve freedom’s Biblical Natural Law principles in this great land. In fact, the average church is so sugary sweet that it is downright sickening!

I agree. But God has not called the Church to sin in order to be salt of the earth. In preaching the Gospel, the Church can take a stand against every evil perpetrated by this world. But we've been to stuck on issues instead of the Gospel.

And the two main reasons for this dereliction of duty by America’s pastors and churches are the IRS 501c3 non-profit tax status, which turns the Lord’s church into a government corporation; and the erroneous, fallacious interpretation of Romans chapter 13 that teaches Christians are obligated to submit to government regardless of whether government acts within the confines and jurisdiction of God’s law or not.

That certainly is nothing that I said.

In reality, the American church today, on the whole, is not even a church. It is a government corporation whose loyalty is offered first to Caesar, not to Christ, and whose message is first politically correct before it is Biblically correct.

Definitely some, not all.

It is more than interesting that some 95% of the 14,000 evangelical churches that graced the German landscape during Hitler’s rise to power bought into the identical misinterpretation of Romans 13 that the vast majority (probably at least 95%) of the 300,000 evangelical churches that grace America’s landscape have bought into today.

http://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Articles/tabid/109/ID/320/Romans-13-Setting-It-Straight.aspx

First you condemn us for being evil then you condemn us for not following evil. Make up your mind Zaac.

That's your nice attempt at a lie as I haven't told you to follow evil.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Or that the slaves brought to America allow themselves to remain in chains as their husbands were hung and scourged and their wives and daughters were raped and used. How dare they complain?

Or why not have Southern Baptists shut up about abortions and Roe vs Wade too?

Good ole Southern Baptists.

Let's not be stupid here. Nobody has said to submit to sin. Racism of the type encountered by Rosa Parks is clearly sinful.

I'm not the one being stupid. Authority is authority.

And the baptists SHOULD shut up about abortion, already. The republicans they are counting on to end it don't have the spine. It is a 20-year project, and we can't get them to fight for two weeks. But that's another thread.

I reject the premise in it's entirety.

 

[poncho]

I tell you the truth: Christians in persecuted lands are not enamored with entertainment, recreation, and irrelevant Bible exposition. You don’t have to bring in some big-name rock band to entice them to fellowship. You don’t have to give their teenagers a big gymnasium. You don’t have to give their young adults coffee shops and espresso machines. You don’t have to shy away from criticisms of tyrannical government. And you certainly are not going to score any points with your fallacious “obey-the-government-no-matter-what” interpretation of Romans 13.

http://chuckbaldwinlive.com/Article...-Entertainment-And-Irrelevant-Exposition.aspx

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Yep, perhaps this is why God continues to give folks more of what they don't want? Forever trying to justify sin. It's such a liberal concept.

Truly it is said, ignorance is bliss, and you must be the most blissful person on the face of the earth.

Enjoy your life, Zaac. Someone has to.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Martin Luther needed to respect his Catholic authority, after all, God put it there.

 

[Zaac]

A couple of problems with your defense of Obama.

The first and most obvious is that the president's authority is valid only inasmuch as he adheres to the Constitution. Virtually NOTHING this guy does is consistent with the Constitution. Therefore, he is acting outside his legal authority.

Just another attempt to justify sin. Breaking the law does not invalidate his authority as President. It might get him removed from office and then that authority ceases. But his operating outside the lines of the Constitution certainly doesn't repeal his position of authority from God.

The second is that, while we are obligated to respect the office, we are under no obligation to respect the man, particularly not when the man has set himself up as an enemy of God.

Just another way to try and justify sin. The MAN is in the office. The OFFICE was not placed in authority over you. The MAN was.

Do we obey God or man?

You seemed to have fashioned a nice way to obey yourself. So I'll ask you, "do we obey God or man"?

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Justiin Martyr should have honored the prefect who threatened him with death unless he and his disciples stopped preaching the gospel.

Maybe he should have grown tomatoes instead.

 

[Bro. Curtis]

Did Joseph and Mary defy Herod in their flight ? Pretty disrespectful.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Maybe John the Baptist could have offered to wait tables at Herod's party to atone for his "criticism" of the king's illicit affair with his sister-in-law.

 

[Zaac]

I'm not the one being stupid. Authority is authority.

And as Poncho pointed out, we are not called to ignore the admonition of Christ in lieu of authority.

And the baptists SHOULD shut up about abortion, already. The republicans they are counting on to end it don't have the spine. It is a 20-year project, and we can't get them to fight for two weeks. But that's another thread.

Ummm. They are the Republicans.

I reject the premise in it's entirety.

The premise is Scriptural. It doesn't surprise me that folks reject it when it doesn't suit their need to be angry and upset that they aren't politically getting their way.