Joel Osteen Denies Christ on National TV

[Chemnitz]

I nearly drove off the road when I saw a Billboard add for Lakewood that said "Come, discover the power within you"

You have to wonder about the message that is being taught when they are advertizing about a power within you. It sounds almost New Age.

"Sounds like you had a bias before Joel Osteen was on Larry King."

Yes I already had a bias against Mr. Osteen, a bias created by hearing "if you only have enough faith/or do things to earn God's favor goodthings will happen to you sermons" and the spiritual damage he did to people in physical suffering, but I would have said the same thing about a person I do like and I would have noticed it. Let's face it this was a blatently obvious flip-flop.

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Chemnitz:
You have to wonder about the message that is being taught when they are advertizing about a power within you. It sounds almost New Age.

Whoa, slow down. "Greater is He that is in me, than he who is in the world" and "It is God at work in you...", and "He who began a good work in you..." are all scriptural teachings. I know that New Age teachings sound similar, but we shouldn't toss the healthy out because it might resemble the unhealthy.

That said, I'm not defending Osteen. I will take everyone's word for it on his WOF influence. However, if we're to chastise a person for unscripturalness, let's make sure it's something that is truly unscriptural. I've seen a few local pastors get blasted because something they said "sounded New Age", regardless of the fact that what the said was scriptural. Capiche?

 

[Chemnitz]

But God is not a power and the unbeliever doesn't have Christ dwelling with in them, so directing them to look inward in the fashion this sign implies is not scriptural.

 

[Johnv]

Originally posted by Chemnitz:
But God is not a power and the unbeliever doesn't have Christ dwelling with in them, so directing them to look inward in the fashion this sign implies is not scriptural.

Yes and no. Even in the unbeliever, that person comes to have a relationship with God via a prompting of the Holy Spirit working inside them. I'm not saying God is "a power". I'm eluding the the fact that it is the pwoer of the Lord that works inside us, as per numerous scriptures. I don't think we should jump all over a preacher if he says we should unlock the potential or power within us. We should take that in the context delivered. Ya know what they say about context.

I'm not in any way defending any type of new age belief. I'm simply pointing out that we should abandon something just because a non-christian belief also shares that same belief.

Anyhoo, I don't think we're really in disagreement here.

 

[Johnv]

Oops, I sould have said "we should NOT abandon something just because a non-christian belief also shares that same belief".

Bad fingers, bad fingers!!

 

[Marcia]

The phrase "the power within you" or "unlock the power withing you" should not be used by Christians because it implies a power that is part of our material being. Saying it like this also is taking it out of context and is a serious misrepresentation of Scripture, imo.

Also, I see Chenmitz' point that to unbelievers (and some believers) this looks like a way to make Christ just another power to tap into (which is essentially what Osteen teaches).

Believers do have the power of the HS but it's to serve and glorify God, not get what we want (which is how it's taught in WF and New Thought).

The reason to be careful is that non-Christians define words differently and will see this as saying something else -- that is misleading them.

 

[Johnv]

I suppose we can agree to disagree on that point. I have no problem telling people that there's a power within me, and that power is the Holy Spirit.

Again, I'm not defending Osteen, or supporting new age thinking, just pointing out that we shouldn't be phrasophobic.

 

[yeshua4me2]

i think the WOF movement is the most dangerous thing to the church today..the gospel they preach essentially innoculates the person to the real gospel. i have tried to share the gospel with people who have just enough knowledge about the bible to be satified that "they accepted Jesus into their heart" last year. of course they are living unregenerate live in direct opposition to what they say, but they had this hypre-emotional experiance, and that ends up trumping the truth. has anyone else had this experience?
i also find that if you show WOF'ers the truth, they (and this has happened) start saying stuf like.....
i know where your spirit comes from
or do not lay a hand on God's anointed
or are you dening my spirit?
ect....

i think a more literal understanding of Matt 24:4+5 is in order....

Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

or

#5 For many shall come in My name saying, "I am Annointed" and shall decieve many.

(if you say that line like Rod Parsley you get the full effect....hehehe)


i think the NT if completely clear, that the largest problem for the church of the "latter times" (1+2 Tim) is heresy or apostacy from WITHIN.


I really like Ray Comforts book Way of the Master explination of the parables, and i think they really apply here

thankyou and God Bless

 

[Rachel]

Originally posted by yeshua4me2:
i think the WOF movement is the most dangerous thing to the church today..the gospel they preach essentially innoculates the person to the real gospel. i have tried to share the gospel with people who have just enough knowledge about the bible to be satified that "they accepted Jesus into their heart" last year. of course they are living unregenerate live in direct opposition to what they say, but they had this hypre-emotional experiance, and that ends up trumping the truth. has anyone else had this experience?
i also find that if you show WOF'ers the truth, they (and this has happened) start saying stuf like.....
i know where your spirit comes from
or do not lay a hand on God's anointed
or are you dening my spirit?
ect....

i think a more literal understanding of Matt 24:4+5 is in order....

Mat 24:4 And Jesus answered and said unto them, Take heed that no man deceive you.
Mat 24:5 For many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and shall deceive many.

or

#5 For many shall come in My name saying, "I am Annointed" and shall decieve many.

(if you say that line like Rod Parsley you get the full effect....hehehe)


i think the NT if completely clear, that the largest problem for the church of the "latter times" (1+2 Tim) is heresy or apostacy from WITHIN.


I really like Ray Comforts book Way of the Master explination of the parables, and i think they really apply here

thankyou and God Bless

Yes, have had the same experience with WOF people. So much for searching the scriptures for themselves. It looks to me that alot of people can care less about being deceived.

 

[rc]

All seeker sensitive churchs have to disregard doctrine. Olsteen and Rick Warren and all the rest are blind following the blind.

 

[atestring]

Originally posted by shannonL:
One reason Joel is so appealing is you look at him and say : "Well he is such a nice boy" tee hee.

I like what one poster noticed. On Joel's show they make a big deal about raising their Bibles and make this big quote then after that you never have to open it. He might quote one verse then tell you this nice story. I Joel was a swimming pool he would definitly be one of those kittie pools when it comes to his message. He preaches a shallow message. He is also a Word of Faith teacher I've heard him preach on that stuff more than once.

What is your definition of a shallow messaage?