In my post - I comment that in your OP you do not address the actual texts that refute OSAS - such as Matt 18 (forgiveness revoked) - Ezek 18 (salvation revoked), Gal 5:4 (Fallen from Grace, Severed from Christ) etc.
In fact your OP rich in name-calling (which we see almost all the time on certain Baptist threads - without end) but totally absent when it comes to dealing with the texts that expose the flaws in OSAS>
Those scriptures have been thoroughly vetted here between us and others,
That is yet another excuse for avoiding the texts that expose the flaws in OSAS.
As I asked before -what false doctrine could not be propped up by simply using excuses to avoid the texts that reveal that doctrine to be false?
What is so fascinating about a Law Keeper pointing to Galatians 5
Interesting phrasing given that 1John 2 says that those who do not keep Christ's commandments and yet claim to know Christ - do not know what they are talking about.
I find it odd that you would go there.
Your not actually quoting Gal 5 - just taking it out of context AS IF Paul never said "
what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of God" 1Cor 7:19 or Christ never said "
IF you Love Me KEEP My Commandments" John 14:15
or John had never said that the saints "
KEEP the Commandments of God AND their faith in Jesus" Rev 14:12
Even your own "Baptist Confession of Faith" and your own D.L Moody and C.H. Spurgeon argue for keeping the Commandments of God - the very thing you are claiming to be at war with in your comment above.
Surely you cannot spin this a "just me alone"...
In all this you still do not deal with the Gal 5:4 problem for OSAS "you have been SEVERED FROM Christ you have fallen FROM Grace".
You and you alone Bob is the only one I ever seen say God revokes forgiveness.
Is it "numbers" you are concerned with?
Didn't we already go over the point that the Seventh-day Baptists are one of the groups that influenced the early Adventists to become Seventh-day Adventists - and that the Southern Baptists are much more numerous than the Seventh-day Baptists -- and that the Seventh-day Adventists are larger than both of them combined!! (Not to mention John Wesley and the Methodists and other groups that admit to the Bible fact that OSAS is not biblical.)
I don't see why you think this numbers game would be the right way to go.
... Seventh Day Adventist focus mainly on keeping their congregation living in fear...
Here again - instead of addressing the texts that are so fully debunking OSAS - your solution is to invent stories about this or that denomination.
But your story telling is not the same thing as actual Bible study - doing actual exegesis of Ezek 18, Matt 18, Gal 5:4 etc. It is just a continued example of avoiding it.
Yet here we have a favorite passage for anti-OSAS folks, who believe that Law breaking will send you to hell, saying "you stand ONLY by your FAITH".
Indeed we do - and when we quote the Bible in complete sentences (as opposed to your method above) and indeed in complete verses and paragraphs your argument from Romans 11 falls flat. Which is why when I quoted it I include the words "around that little lifted sentence fragment you are holding up" to show how it destroys OSAS.
The very passage identified totally destroys OSAS.
Read it "again" - BEYOND your 5 or 6 word sentence "Fragment".
9 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well
said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and
you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but
fear.
21 For
if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either.
22 Therefore consider the
goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in
His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.
23 And they also,
if they do not continue in unbelief, will be grafted in, for God is able to graft them in again.
In Romans 11 Paul points out that believing Jews AND believing Gentiles make up what God calls "Israel" (just as Paul states at the end of Romans 2). The promises of God given to Israel - then continue in true irrevocable fashion because they are not for "Children of the flesh - but children of the promise" as Paul tells us in Romans 9.
This is the accurate Romans 11 and Romans 9 and Romans 2 context for the sentence "fragment" --
"for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable"
Not to mention 11:29, when it states " "for the gifts and the calling of God are irrevocable" -
Indeed - a great sentence "fragment" but as I noted above it works better when you are willing to read all of Romans 11 - because then the context for that "fragment" comes through.
but just wait, another thread will be started about OSAS and lo and behold, you will post yet again these passages
Indeed - because as we see in this thread - you refuse to deal with the actual texts - beyond at most a tiny 6 word sentence fragment.
And who can blame you if your goal is to cling to OSAS no matter what the Bible says to the contrary in the very chapter you are referencing?
Is it my fault that it is so easy to point to where the Bible refutes OSAS in the very Romans 11 chapter that you raised here?
Really? Seriously?
The last two or three posts are perfect for illustrating the point I am making about the OSAS guys not actually engaging in exegesis but rather running from the chapters that so fully debunk OSAS. Why wouldn't I want to quote this very sort of exchange to any unbiased objective reader and ask them to make up their own mind seeing how the two sides are presenting their case from scripture alone or from name-calling alone - take your pick of the method you want to use.
in Christ,
Bob
