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"Left vs Right" - Politics is a farce.

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InTheLight

Well-Known Member
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I'd rather someone without experience who sincerely wants to change things back to the way things are supposed to be get the job, rather than someone with tons of experience who wants nothing to change get the job.

The key phrase is "get the job". The Democrat candidate is one-termer Amy Kloubuchar, who is eminently beatable. She hasn't distinguished herself in 6 years in the Senate. Yes, I know that freshman senators usually keep quiet, but she hasn't found an issue to champion or built many connections in the Senate.

http://www.amyklobuchar.com/

The Minnesota GOP should have selected someone else. While I find Kurt Bills fresh, charismatic and likable, I wonder if he can get fundraising support from the GOP core. If he wins it would be a major upset.
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
To get back on topic....

Left vs. Right, Farce?

Consider the position the party platform take on the issues and I cannot see how you can claim there is no difference.

Abortion
Gay marriage
Stem cell research
Taxes
Health care
Gun control
Government spending
Energy and oil
Military spending
 

Ceegen

New Member
The Minnesota GOP should have selected someone else. While I find Kurt Bills fresh, charismatic and likable, I wonder if he can get fundraising support from the GOP core. If he wins it would be a major upset.

If getting financial support from the establishment GOP is his only problem, then do you not see the problem that itself presents?
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
If getting financial support from the establishment GOP is his only problem, then do you not see the problem that itself presents?

Could you rephrase your statement, I can't make sense of it.

Kurt Bills main problem is that no one knows who he is. There is an election in 3 1/2 months and he's not even a phosphor ghost of a blip on the radar screen of Minnesota voters. You need money to get the word out. If he can't raise money, he's dead in the water.
 

mandym

New Member
I think it's pretty obvious, but if you still don't get it, then I understand why it is that you don't understand the rest of my posts.

I see you did not really have a point.



No, you don't. You think Fox News is "fair and balanced"? Even when Roger Ailes, (Chairman and CEO of Fox News), is a member of the Council on Foreign Relations? As well as members of other "respected" journalistic personalities from "left-leaning" news agencies?

Keep ignoring the blatently obvious...

More infowars propganda



My dad was an Illinois state trooper for 20 years, and a US Marshall for 5. I've met and talked with Susan Collins and Olympia Snowe. My drafting instructor was mayor, and is now treasurer, of the city I live in. I have a coin from a 3-star general who was part of a bunch of congress critters that visited the unit I was at. I'm friends with a policeman in my area, and he is married to my wife's cousin.

How many of "them" do you personally know? Does it really matter? Are we here to boast about what kind of connections we have? This is so pointless. It doesn't matter who you personally know, look at what they are doing. By their fruits, ye shall know them.

You are making broad brush judgments about who is wanting power and then condemning them all. If you do not know them you do not know that is their motivation. I know some of them and it is not. The broad brush you use helps your propaganda but it is not honest.


If you live in America, you have. The TSA was created thanks to the PATRIOT Act. Why do we have TSA checkpoints, and why is the government trying to expand the scope and power of the TSA? Why did Bush feel it necessary to "protect the homeland" - Something reminiscent of Nazi Germany. Don't think something like that can't happen here in the USA. Plenty of psychological studies were done which prove that it wouldn't be any different here, and I could cite them here, but you wouldn't care because your mind is already made up.

No, the Patriot Act has not effected me. And I am not sure it has to many Americans other than kept us safer.



Bush, a "Republican", passed the PATRIOT Act. Obama, a "Democrat", passed the ACA. When Romney gets elected next, he inherrits both pieces of legislation. He gets all the power of all the previous presidents, in the form of executive privilege. That is why it doesn't matter who gets elected, it is just a continuation of the "game" these people play with the government.

It does matter. It always matters. Far more than one or two pieces of legislation.

Executive orders will be signed to enhance/enforce laws already on the books, which is how they will justify putting you and your family into a "relocation facility". All they need is the right crisis to manipulate... But they will not wait for one to happen, they will manufacture a crisis (again).

Good grief someone get this guy a tinfoil hat. He deserves it.

lol, says you.

"

And you continue to prove my point.
 

Ceegen

New Member
To get back on topic....

Left vs. Right, Farce?

Key to this is that "left" is left, and "right" is right. It is not.

Consider the position the party platform take on the issues and I cannot see how you can claim there is no difference.

Abortion
Gay marriage
Stem cell research

The GOP doesn't really care about these issues. They only make these things an issue to get votes from people. "Party platform" is just a buzzword to get you to take sides in an illusionary war of ideals. Romney clearly doesn't care what he says, he flip-flops on everything just so you'll vote for him.


The income tax is illegal. It should be abolished. A graduated income tax is one of the "planks" of Communism.

The only way an income tax could be legal, is if it is a flat rate for everyone, but even then income is defined as profit. Income is not wages and labor.

Health care

Many Republicans support a national health care system of some type. It would only be a stone's throw away from making it completely government controlled. If Democrats got complete control of the system, like they did when the ACA passed in the first place, they could make it 100% government controlled via amendment/ratification.

As it stands now though, if government got out of the way of health care, prices would go down. Anyone could afford health insurance if they would allow companies to sell health insurance across state lines.

Gun control

Romney supported the Brady Act. Plenty of "Republicans" support some form of government regulation of firearms, even though the constitution is clear that no regulation of firearms should exist.

Government spending

The problem isn't government spending, it is how we get our money in the first place. Congress has pawned off its responsibility to a PRIVATE BANK that we know as the "Federal" Reserve bank system.

Section 8 of the US Constitution (Powers of Congress):
"To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

The "Fed" prints money out of nothing, and then "buys" government bonds that are also printed out of nothing. This exchange makes "Federal Reserve Notes" legal fiat money. They also do this with immediate debt attached to these notes, by "lending" to the US government with interest.

Why are we borrowing money from a private bank, at cost to us, when congress could print it themselves without the immediate debt attached to it? How do we expect to get out of debt, by continually borrowing money?

It doesn't matter how much we spend, it's all debt-induced fiat currency in the first place: It has no value!

Energy and oil

Both sides are being played like fools on this one. The same people that support "energy and oil" externally, are the same ones working behind the scenes to stifle it simply to make money.

The United States has massive oil reserves, but they're not being used. Petroleum products could very well be a natural process that replenishes over time, rather than a one-time "fossil fuel" event that most believe it to be. They want to make you think it's a limited supply, so they can make money off of it. (Lots of disinformation on this topic, so be careful if you ever do a search on this one).

And big oil is subsidized, which is supported by Republicans! Not only are you paying at the pump, but in taxes! They're doubble-dipping the profits!

Military spending

We don't need to be the world's police force. I'm sick and tired of this rhetoric being used as an arguement for big government, which Republicans advocate. If we cut back military spending, as it relates to foreign campaigns, then we could then use that money to turn this country around for the better.

Defense spending? Yeah I'm all for that, but we don't need to maintain hundreds bases overseas. Rome tried to do the same thing, look where that got them. We need to worry about ourselves. We could have a very, very powerful military force, and not have to use it every time a problem breaks out. Even if asked to help, some times we shouldn't for the simple fact that it is not our responsibility to ensure the safety of other people. I would even go so far as to say that, we should only help when refugees are in danger. We should open our arms to people, and help them escape, and if they don't want to... Well, sucks to be them. But why should anyone have to die for someone else's war?

Trying to save everyone in the world with the promise of a Republican-oriented government structure, even if they don't want it, hasn't worked. The United States is guilty of installing puppet governments in an attempt to project power overseas. It is getting us into troubble, and the world hates us for this reason.
 

mandym

New Member
Key to this is that "left" is left, and "right" is right. It is not.



The GOP doesn't really care about these issues. They only make these things an issue to get votes from people. "Party platform" is just a buzzword to get you to take sides in an illusionary war of ideals. Romney clearly doesn't care what he says, he flip-flops on everything just so you'll vote for him.



The income tax is illegal. It should be abolished. A graduated income tax is one of the "planks" of Communism.

The only way an income tax could be legal, is if it is a flat rate for everyone, but even then income is defined as profit. Income is not wages and labor.



Many Republicans support a national health care system of some type. It would only be a stone's throw away from making it completely government controlled. If Democrats got complete control of the system, like they did when the ACA passed in the first place, they could make it 100% government controlled via amendment/ratification.

As it stands now though, if government got out of the way of health care, prices would go down. Anyone could afford health insurance if they would allow companies to sell health insurance across state lines.



Romney supported the Brady Act. Plenty of "Republicans" support some form of government regulation of firearms, even though the constitution is clear that no regulation of firearms should exist.



The problem isn't government spending, it is how we get our money in the first place. Congress has pawned off its responsibility to a PRIVATE BANK that we know as the "Federal" Reserve bank system.

Section 8 of the US Constitution (Powers of Congress):
"To coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;

The "Fed" prints money out of nothing, and then "buys" government bonds that are also printed out of nothing. This exchange makes "Federal Reserve Notes" legal fiat money. They also do this with immediate debt attached to these notes, by "lending" to the US government with interest.

Why are we borrowing money from a private bank, at cost to us, when congress could print it themselves without the immediate debt attached to it? How do we expect to get out of debt, by continually borrowing money?

It doesn't matter how much we spend, it's all debt-induced fiat currency in the first place: It has no value!



Both sides are being played like fools on this one. The same people that support "energy and oil" externally, are the same ones working behind the scenes to stifle it simply to make money.

The United States has massive oil reserves, but they're not being used. Petroleum products could very well be a natural process that replenishes over time, rather than a one-time "fossil fuel" event that most believe it to be. They want to make you think it's a limited supply, so they can make money off of it. (Lots of disinformation on this topic, so be careful if you ever do a search on this one).

And big oil is subsidized, which is supported by Republicans! Not only are you paying at the pump, but in taxes! They're doubble-dipping the profits!



We don't need to be the world's police force. I'm sick and tired of this rhetoric being used as an arguement for big government, which Republicans advocate. If we cut back military spending, as it relates to foreign campaigns, then we could then use that money to turn this country around for the better.

Defense spending? Yeah I'm all for that, but we don't need to maintain hundreds bases overseas. Rome tried to do the same thing, look where that got them. We need to worry about ourselves. We could have a very, very powerful military force, and not have to use it every time a problem breaks out. Even if asked to help, some times we shouldn't for the simple fact that it is not our responsibility to ensure the safety of other people. I would even go so far as to say that, we should only help when refugees are in danger. We should open our arms to people, and help them escape, and if they don't want to... Well, sucks to be them. But why should anyone have to die for someone else's war?

Trying to save everyone in the world with the promise of a Republican-oriented government structure, even if they don't want it, hasn't worked. The United States is guilty of installing puppet governments in an attempt to project power overseas. It is getting us into troubble, and the world hates us for this reason.

And there we have it everyone. Take a good look at what infowars does to your brain.
 

saturneptune

New Member
And there we have it everyone. Take a good look at what infowars does to your brain.
I totally agree in the sense that Mitt Romney is the only hope we have this year of ridding the United States of Obama. It is not a really good chance at that. The time for getting a better candidate was months and years ago, from after the nomination of Bush in 1988, through the McCain nomination, and most recently, the Republican primaries. We just keep on that constant slide downward to the left. The only positive thing that can be said about Romney is that he will cause less damage than Obama.

The only difference between you and I is that you saw Romney as the only hope several months before I did. Maybe in the final analysis, you were right with what we had to work with. I hope and pray that first, Romney wins, and secondly, that he in fact has changed his mind on abortion and gay rights. Another thing about Romney that puts him a notch above Obama is that Romney has actually met a payroll and created jobs.

The time for analyzing the exact meaning of the Constutition is when we are choosing a candidate or laying the ground work for one, not when we have two major party candidates that are not going to follow the Constitution. That is the period of time we are in now.

If Romney happens to lose, we will be back to square one in picking a nominee for 2016. If that is the case, it would be a really good idea for us all to listen to the post you just quoted.
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
CeeGen said:
(Lots of disinformation on this topic, so be careful if you ever do a search on this one.)

34oon4g.gif
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
Key to this is that "left" is left, and "right" is right. It is not.



The GOP doesn't really care about these issues.

The income tax is illegal. It should be abolished.


Plenty of "Republicans" support some form of government regulation of firearms



The problem isn't government spending,

It doesn't matter how much we spend,

Both sides are being played like fools on this one. The same people that support "energy and oil" externally, are the same ones working behind the scenes to stifle

We don't need to be the world's police force.

You did not acknowledge that there are differences between the left and right on these issues, you merely launched into a diatribe.

Should I simplify if for you?

Taxes: Generally speaking this group wants to lower taxes. Is it the right or left?

Military Spending: This group wants to slash defense spending. Left or right?

Abortion: This group is pro-life. Left or right?

I could go on, but let's start with these three.
 

Ceegen

New Member
I see you did not really have a point.

Because you don't want to see it.

Accepting what I say as truth, is the same reason people deny that Jesus is Messiah, or preach the good news to total strangers: They are afraid of being an outcast of society, on the fringe, crazy.

More infowars propganda

Okay.

You are making broad brush judgments about who is wanting power and then condemning them all. If you do not know them you do not know that is their motivation. I know some of them and it is not. The broad brush you use helps your propaganda but it is not honest.

You don't really know them, that's the problem. You don't know the hearts of men, like God does. It doesn't matter how much they profess their virtues if they're lying, and you'd never know because you can't read minds.

And even if they are telling the truth, will they follow through with their promises? Will they eventually cave in?

No, the Patriot Act has not effected me. And I am not sure it has to many Americans other than kept us safer.

If you really believe it makes us safer... lol.

Secret detentions and trials, with or without evidence? Siezure of of property or information without warrants? Yeah, that isn't suspicious at all. Why does the government suddenly need this broad police power, when it was doing fine without it?

It does matter. It always matters. Far more than one or two pieces of legislation.

You don't get it. Let me show you a hypothetical example of what I mean:

1. Democrat passes legislation to restrict religious freedoms.
2. People get upset, revolt, Republican takes power.
3. Republican then uses that same legislation, to restrict only certain groups of people, ie, Muslims, through ratification.
4. Democrat gets put into office, uses same piece of legislation to restrict Christians, and cites the Republican's abuse of power as justification to persecute Christians.

Make more sense?

Good grief someone get this guy a tinfoil hat. He deserves it.

It has happened, and will happen again. During WWII, Japanese Americans were put into internment camps. For their safety, of course. How long before Christians will need to be put in camps for their own safety?

And you continue to prove my point.

Your only point is that I'm wrong and crazy, but offer absolutely no proof to the contrary. Seriously think about what I'm trying to tell you, and not just the appearance of the message. You're essentially programmed to think that conspiracies and people who believe them are crazy, the imaginations of the mentally ill. I can tell you that, if I were mentally ill, I wouldn't have been able to join the US Army, nor would I wouldn't have held a "Secret" security clearance from the DOD for 10 years.

Truth is stranger than fiction.
 
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Ceegen

New Member
You did not acknowledge that there are differences between the left and right on these issues, you merely launched into a diatribe.

Should I simplify if for you?

Taxes: Generally speaking this group wants to lower taxes. Is it the right or left?

My point is: What difference does it make to lower the tax rate, when the tax itself is illegal?

Military Spending: This group wants to slash defense spending. Left or right?

It doesn't matter. Real Christians don't vote for war. Sorry if that's too blunt for you, but it has nothing to do with Democrats or Republicans. Our nation could have a strong military, used to defend our borders in the event of an attack, but that should be the extent of it.

Abortion: This group is pro-life. Left or right?

Did Romney flip-flop on this issue (like many others), or not? Do Republicans support/vote on bills that promote the "right to choose", or not (like Olympia Snowe)? Because it doesn't matter what they say, ye shall know them by their fruits.

I could go on, but let's start with these three.

You don't get it. I already said that they only appear to be different, and that's what I am talking about.

They both want more power, more control, over every aspect of our lives. You can't see that, because you refuse to see the hypocrisy within the political party that you identify yourself with.
 

InTheLight

Well-Known Member
Site Supporter
My point is: What difference does it make to lower the tax rate, when the tax itself is illegal?

See, you keep dodging the issues. The question is this: Is there a difference in the policy positions between the left and the right?

I don't want your opinion of the legality of the income tax (which BTW has been ruled constitutional by the Supreme Court), your opinion on military spending, etc. Just answer the question.
 

mandym

New Member
Because you don't want to see it.

Accepting what I say as truth, is the same reason people deny that Jesus is Messiah, or preach the good news to total strangers: They are afraid of being an outcast of society, on the fringe, crazy.



Okay.



You don't really know them, that's the problem. You don't know the hearts of men, like God does. It doesn't matter how much they profess their virtues if they're lying, and you'd never know because you can't read minds.

And even if they are telling the truth, will they follow through with their promises? Will they eventually cave in?



If you really believe it makes us safer... lol.

Secret detentions and trials, with or without evidence? Siezure of of property or information without warrants? Yeah, that isn't suspicious at all. Why does the government suddenly need this broad police power, when it was doing fine without it?



You don't get it. Let me show you a hypothetical example of what I mean:

1. Democrat passes legislation to restrict religious freedoms.
2. People get upset, revolt, Republican takes power.
3. Republican then uses that same legislation, to restrict only certain groups of people, ie, Muslims, through ratification.
4. Democrat gets put into office, uses same piece of legislation to restrict Christians, and cites the Republican's abuse of power as justification to persecute Christians.

Make more sense?



It has happened, and will happen again. During WWII, Japanese Americans were put into internment camps. For their safety, of course. How long before Christians will need to be put in camps for their own safety?



Your only point is that I'm wrong and crazy, but offer absolutely no proof to the contrary. Seriously think about what I'm trying to tell you, and not just the appearance of the message. You're essentially programmed to think that conspiracies and people who believe them are crazy, the imaginations of the mentally ill. I can tell you that, if I were mentally ill, I wouldn't have been able to join the US Army, nor would I wouldn't have held a "Secret" security clearance from the DOD for 10 years.

Truth is stranger than fiction.

Be careful, your interest in politics continues to show.
 

Arbo

Active Member
Site Supporter
Did you ever find the assassination of JFK, odd? That maybe the official explanation of things, didn't sit well? What if I told you about another assassination that had parallels to JFK's? Do you know who Congressman Louis T. McFadden is? He had two previous attempts on his life before he was poisoned to death the third time. No investigation ever took place! But what do JFK and McFadden have in common? They both tried to do something about the Federal Reserve system, and they were both killed for it.

They run both parties and they controll the government, because they controll the money of the government. There is absolutely no real difference between the two parties. It doesn't matter who wins, until we get people into office who actually care and will do something about it. But even then, they usually get killed or threatened to be killed, and so nothing changes. And you don't see these things, because they own the media corporations too.

They either own them directly or through proxies. They all attend the Council on Foreign Relations, Trilateral Comission, Bilderberger Group, or any number of other groups that are all either founded by or entirely run by, rich international bankers. Is it a coincidence?

Interesting...in a Ripley's kind of way.
 

Ceegen

New Member
See, you keep dodging the issues. The question is this: Is there a difference in the policy positions between the left and the right?

Only the appearance of difference in policy. That's it. Both parties are "left of center" in that they vie for more government power/authority.

I don't want your opinion of the legality of the income tax (which BTW has been ruled constitutional by the Supreme Court),

The supreme court has also ruled that the 16th amendment does not give congress any new powers of taxation. The only tax on labor and wages that can be collected is from foreign (outside the United States borders) sources, or in the District of Columbia. A graduated income tax is illegal, as it is not apportioned. If Republicans really cared, they'd be trying to eliminate the tax alltogether.

your opinion on military spending, etc. Just answer the question.

The questions themselves have flaws which assume that either party really wants to change the status quo, which is why I answer your questions in the manner that I do.
 
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