Let's have a Testimony!

[steaver]

(Joh 3:6) That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
(Joh 3:7) Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.

There are two kinds of birth; one is of the flesh--that is how we all got into the world; one is of the Spirit. That is why Jesus said in verse 7 "You must be born again; you must be born of the Spirit.
Everyone is born of the flesh; but not everyone is born of the Spirit.

(Joh 3:5) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

What then does "the water mean" in this verse?
--not baptism.

Nicodemus was a ruler of the Jews, a Rabbi. He knew the OT well. He had often been to the Temple. In fact this conversation may have taken place in sight of the Temple where they could see ceremonial washings take place.
--What is the most common use of water?
Water is commonly used for washing. The Jews used it often for washing. They had many, many ceremonial washings as is demonstrated by the Temple washings alone. Knowing the OT Scriptures well perhaps Psalm 119:9 would have come to Nicodemus' mind:

"Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? By taking heed thereto according to they word.

What did Jesus say?
(Joh 15:3) Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
--Water is a symbol of the Word. Note that there are only two agents by which a person is born again: water and the Spirit. Water is a cleansing agent, represented by the Word which cleanses our soul, as Jesus says.

What does James say:
(Jas 1:18) Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.
--Here it becomes more clear. The word "begat" is another word for "born"
We are born or born again with the word of truth or the Word of God.

What does Peter say:
(1Pe 1:23) Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
--It is very clear here.
We are born again by the Word of God.
Now remember there are only two agents by which a person is born again:
One is water and the other is the Holy Spirit.
The Bible makes it clear that water represents the Word of God.

One cannot be saved without the Word of God, that is the message of the Gospel; nor can he be saved without the Holy Spirit of God. It is the Holy Spirit working through the Word of God that brings a person to Christ. That is how a person is born again. He puts his faith in the finished work of Christ, believes on Him who died for him and receives him as his Savior.

(Joh 1:12) But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
--When one becomes born again they become a son of God or a child of God.

You are spot on DHK :thumbs: Good exposition!

We must take into consideration the FULL counsel we have in God's Word. It is with absolute certainty we can elimminate water baptism, I can't see how anyone can hold that view in light of scripture. Amniotic fluid? Doubt it.

It is most definitly representing the Word of God.

(Eph 5:26) "That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, "

The Holy Spirit, which is the catalyist for regeneration is called the "Living Water" as well.

The water in this passage can only be the word of God according to supporting text.

 

[Thinkingstuff]

(Joh 3:5) Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

What then does "the water mean" in this verse?
--not baptism.

UH yes it does What does Paul say?

In him you were also circumcised, in the putting off of the sinful nature,[a] not with a circumcision done by the hands of men but with the circumcision done by Christ, 12 having been buried with him in baptism and raised with him through your faith in the power of God, who raised him from the dead.

Baptism is that circumcision done by Christ. What does Mark say

And so John came, baptizing in the desert region and preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness

What does Paul again say?

We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

How about Peter

and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge[e] of a good conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ

Thus Peter compares the water of flood to the baptism (water). Because God saved 8 pepole through the flood waters. And Paul again to titus

He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit

thus saved us through the same washing of rebirth as peter speaks of ie baptism.

 

[steaver]

>Well, since no one can be perfect, where do you think your denomination is in error?


There is an inferred exclusivism in the Christian Reformed Church that God can (may/will) only regenerate people who claim to be Christians.

This is your church?

I'm not sure I understand what this doctrine is. This basically sounds like the aspect of Calvinism that teaches God regenerates first so that one becomes a child, this being apart from any choice by the receiver. Is this what you mean?

 

[Thinkingstuff]

Jesus said you must be born of water and of the Spirit.
It says nothing of baptism in the entire passage.

According to first Peter water means baptism

 

[Walter]

Just keeping the OP fresh! Still waiting for that testimony........:smilewinkgrin:

I cannot say I have ever stopped believing since becoming a Christian but I recently heard a lecture -on Youtube- by Professor Bart D. Ehrman, a former Baptist pastor and teacher, who now considers himself an agnostic. Are you familiar with him?

 

[billwald]

Ehrman is a credentialed historian who make good sense.

 

[DHK]

UH yes it does What does Paul say?

1. Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved.
2. (Rom 10:9) That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
3. (Rom 10:13) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.
4. (Rom 5:1) Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
5. (Rom 1:16) For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.
(Rom 1:17) For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Baptism is that circumcision done by Christ.

Baptism and circumcision have nothing in common. Circumcision is a Jewish rite and has no place in Christianity. Baptism does not replace it.

What does Mark say

(Mar 16:15) And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
--Preaching the gospel, and then believing it is what saves.
(Mar 16:16) He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
--He that believes is saved.
--He that believes not is damned. Notice that it does not say: He that is not baptized is damned.

How about Peter

(1Pe 1:23) Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Thus Peter compares the water of flood to the baptism (water). Because God saved 8 pepole through the flood waters. And Paul again to titus thus saved us through the same washing of rebirth as peter speaks of ie baptism.

(1Pe 3:20) Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.
1. Notice that the water did not save; it destroyed. It destroyed everyone in the world. It never saved anyone.
2. God saved, not by water, but by an Ark.
3. The Ark was a type of Christ. It is Christ that saves; not water. That is the lesson that Peter was giving.

 

[webdog]

Ehrman is a credentialed historian who make good sense.

In what parallel universe is going from teaching the true gospel to agnostic "good sense"

 

[Amy.G]

In what parallel universe is going from teaching the true gospel to agnostic "good sense"

In billwald land.

 

[Moriah]

So what else must I do to be saved!?

Believe in Jesus with certainty, no doubting. Get Jesus’ teachings, from the Bible, and do what he says to do, even if you do not understand why you are to do something, just do it. Jesus says he will reveal himself to those who obey him. Jesus says the Father and he will make their home with those who obey him. Jesus says those who obey him are the ones who love him.

Consider carefully John 17:8, Proverbs 3:5-6, and John 14:23.

 

[Moriah]

JarJo,

Maybe you will like to read something I wrote about the saved...

The scriptures tell us that before God made the world and all creation, he made the plan for salvation through Jesus Christ (Acts 2:23; 1 Pet 1:20). From the scriptures, we also learn that God made us with the ability to choose right and wrong, and that he knew we would sin (Eph 1:4; Jere 1:5; Psalm 139:1-6). God also knew that we who do want to obey would not be able to stop sinning against him without sending us our Savior Jesus, and the indwelling of the Holy Spirit (Isa 64:5; Roma 5:6; 7:18, 19; 8:9).

The Bible tells us why God saves those he saves and not others. Those who God saves want to know him more than they want anything else (Jere 29:13; Deut 4:29; 1 Chr 28:9; John 12:25; Mark 8:35; Luke 14:26). Those saved humbled themselves and admit they are sinners, and they forgive others (2 Chr 7:14; James 4:10; Acts 26:20; Matt 5:7; 6:14, 15). They love God, they believe, obey, confess and repent (John 14:23; Roma 10:10; Acts 2:38; Acts 5:32; 10:44; 11:14; 19:2). They called out to the Lord to save them (Roma 10:13). They hear the truth and want to be reconciled to God so much so that they get forceful about it. They do not give up, give out, or give in. They stop doubting. They submit to God. They resist the devil (Matt 11:12; Luke 8:4-15; 11:7-8; 16:16; John 14:9; 20:27; James 4:7). They trust God and are perfected in his love (Psalm 118:6; Prov 3:5; Jere 17:7; 1 John 4:12; 4:18; Roma 5:5; 8:15). They live on every word of God (Matt 4:4; 2 Pet 1:5; 3:18). They overcome this world by faith in Jesus (Gene 32:28; 1 John 5:5; Reve 21:7).

He is your praise, he is your God (Deut 10:21). God wants all to turn to him; he wants all saved. God wants men to seek him, and he is not far from each one of us (Acts 17:27; 2 Pet 3:9; John 3:17; Ezek 18:23; 1 Tim 2:3, 4; 4:10; Titus 2:11; 1 John 2:2). The Spirit and the bride say, "Come!” And let him who hears say, "Come!” Whoever is thirsty, let him come; and whoever wishes, let him take the free gift of the water of life (Reve 22:17).

 

[JarJo]

Believe in Jesus with certainty, no doubting. Get Jesus’ teachings, from the Bible, and do what he says to do, even if you do not understand why you are to do something, just do it. Jesus says he will reveal himself to those who obey him. Jesus says the Father and he will make their home with those who obey him. Jesus says those who obey him are the ones who love him.

Consider carefully John 17:8, Proverbs 3:5-6, and John 14:23.

Thank you for the guidance. Sounds like I'm on the right path, but need to keep working on doing what God says and increasing faith.

 

[justmichael]

Soon after I got out of the Army, I was lost. My life had no meaning or direction. I was living home with mom, drinking, smoking dope and chasing every girl I could find. I had a friend named Mike who was every bit like me, we were best friends at the time and even had almost matching cars, He had a Trans Am and I had a Firebird. We were Mike and Mike.
On this day, it was a wonder spring day in Georgia and for whatever reason we did not take one of our cars to go wondering, we took his motorcycle. We decided to go to this girls house out in the country. We rode on back country roads without helmets to get there and after we took care of our business we left and headed back into town.
Griffin back in that day was a pretty busy town at night. There was nothing for young ones to do. Everyone would cruise the strip and hang out at business parking lots after they had closed and the strip was very congested with cruising teens. Teens from other counties would come and partake in the activities and social life of cruising and the hangouts.
As Mike and I were getting closer to town, I was on the back of the bike as Mike drove, We decided it would be a good idea to put helmets on our heads in case we ran into any police so we would not get ticketed. This was at the intersection of Taylor and 6th street.
At the very next intersection, the oncoming traffic had already had a green light and the turn signal. As we approached we got the green light. But who would have thought that a teenage boy would be in that turning lane and turned directly in front of us. We hit him head on. The impact created enough force to put Mike into the window and I was shot up like a catapult throwing a rock. I was flying through the air with the greatest of ease, That daring young man on the flying trapeze.
I went over 3 lanes of traffic and one row of parallel parking spaces and landed ever so softly on my back on the sidewalk in front of First baptist Church. I was lucky not to have landed into oncoming traffic. It was like at the apex of my fall that something had a hold on me and gently sat me down. I'm not sure if I was knocked out or dazed, everything happened so fast. Immediately there were 3 strangers over me asking if I was OK. I sprang to my feet as nothing had happened and I seen a pick up truck with Mike in the back and they were saying, “Get in! We are going to the Hospital!”. As we were riding to the Hospital in back of this pick up truck, the free flowing blood from where Mike's face had been introduced to the windshield of the CRX, was landing on me from the wind blowing it.
At the Emergency Room, they placed us into separate rooms. The Doctors examined me and released me, they could find nothing wrong with me. But Mike was not so fortunate, he had a deep cut they went almost the entire length of his face and required numerous stitches.
The following day as I had a chance to go back to the site of the accident and to the collision yard. I realized how lucky I was. My helmet was crushed like a hard boiled egged that had been dropped on the ground and the vehicles were totaled.
As I begin to think about what had happened, something super natural was there to protect me and it was the Angels of God that had caught me in mid air and gently laid me onto the sidewalk in front of the Church. He had something more in store for me.
A few years later, I got married and had Children of my own and would you believe, I was Baptized, raised my kids there, taught 6th Grade Sunday School at that very same Church where God's Angels had placed me.

 

[justmichael]

The Bird Man

When my youngest daughter was a toddler around the age of 4, she would play in her room. She would often run into the living room or the bedroom where my wife or myself would be and be all excited about the “Bird Man”. She would say the “Bird Man! The Bird Man!”, all excited and pointing to her room. We would go and check her room and never saw anything and passed it off as the vivid imagination of a child and really never gave a second thought about it.
Her room she shared with her brother at the time and had a bunk bed, TV, Book shelf and a toy box. One evening while everyone was gathered in the bedroom and sitting on the bottom bunk watching some kids show on TV. My daughter got all excited and started pointing to the top bunk screaming, “The Bird Man! The Bird Man!” No one else seen the bird man except for her. But at that moment I thought, “This must be her guardian angel”. How else would a toddler describe an Angel.
My daughter does not remember that time but it's something that I remember like it was yesterday and probably will never forget. The story of the Man with Wings, The Bird Man.
“See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.” Matthew 18:10
Angels are actually commanded by God to “encamp all around us” and keep us from falling, getting hurt, who have been with us and will be with us.
“Keep on loving one another as brothers and sisters. Do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by so doing some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it.” Hebrews 13:1-2
Who knows, your Bird man might be the very next person you meet.

 

[Moriah]

Thank you for the guidance. Sounds like I'm on the right path, but need to keep working on doing what God says and increasing faith.

Thank you, JarJo. I do not hear those words often it means a lot. I sure think you are on the right path. I believe God will increase your faith. Never give up.

 

[Moriah]

When my youngest daughter was a toddler around the age of 4, she would play in her room. She would often run into the living room or the bedroom where my wife or myself would be and be all excited about the “Bird Man”. She would say the “Bird Man! The Bird Man!”, all excited and pointing to her room. We would go and check her room and never saw anything and passed it off as the vivid imagination of a child and really never gave a second thought about it.
Her room she shared with her brother at the time and had a bunk bed, TV, Book shelf and a toy box. One evening while everyone was gathered in the bedroom and sitting on the bottom bunk watching some kids show on TV. My daughter got all excited and started pointing to the top bunk screaming, “The Bird Man! The Bird Man!” No one else seen the bird man except for her. But at that moment I thought, “This must be her guardian angel”. How else would a toddler describe an Angel.
My daughter does not remember that time but it's something that I remember like it was yesterday and probably will never forget. The story of the Man with Wings, The Bird Man.
“See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven.” Matthew 18:10
Angels are actually commanded by God to “encamp all around us” and keep us from falling, getting hurt, who have been with us and will be with us.
“Keep on loving one another as brothers and sisters. Do not forget to show hospitality to strangers, for by so doing some people have shown hospitality to angels without knowing it.” Hebrews 13:1-2
Who knows, your Bird man might be the very next person you meet.

I really enjoy hearing others testimonies. Thanks for telling yours.