Masks and Viruses

[JonC]

The virologist I watched today said the variants are the sole result of vaccinating into a pandemic. He pointed out that we have never in the history of mankind launched mass vaccination in the middle of a pandemic. He is not antivax. He is use the right vax in only the high risk.
India handled Covid the right way. The world should take notice. It's the leftists who want to shut our economy down. Just open up and run. We will be fine.

Impossible. The Delta varient was discovered December 2020 in India and the UC January 2021 in Columbia. At the time these were unvaccinated areas (for a large part, still are).

The guy could make the claim if the varients occurred after vacvinations. But since they were found (occurred before found) in Dec 2020 and Jan 2021 in unvaccinated areas (Cokumbia and India) I'd choose a better news source.

 

[Reynolds]

Impossible. The Delta varient was discovered December 2020 in India and the UC January 2021 in Columbia. At the time these were unvaccinated areas (for a large part, still are).

The guy could make the claim if the varients occurred after vacvinations. But since they were found (occurred before found) in Dec 2020 and Jan 2021 in unvaccinated areas (Cokumbia and India) I'd choose a better news source.

It only takes one vaxed or immune person to cause a variant. There was not 1 person in those areas? Seriously?

 

[JonC]

It only takes one vaxed or immune person to cause a variant. There was not 1 person in those areas? Seriously?

Yes. Vaccines in India started mid Jan 2021 and in Columbia at the first of March 2021. And it takes more than one person to produce a varient (read about mutations, varients, and strains). Varients come from unvaccinated populations. RNA viruses will mutate...always. Varients develop from continued infection in population groups.


Vaccines can contribute as well, but in the same way - in people groups via infection. Your source is way out in left field.

 

[Guvnuh]

It all depends on what science you want to believe. Which part of the science you want to believe. Who’s science you want to believe.

scientist are just that, scientist.
If scientist are not willing to listen and analyze science from another scientist then their view shouldn’t be listened to.

that’s the current problem with most of this.
It’s become politicized to the point the and doctors and research doctors are arguing among themselves and not working together. they’re listening to marching orders of politicians and $$$.
The patients are left on their own.

 

[just-want-peace]

I would like to know the rate of infection/deaths of medical personnel who have been the front-line warriors during this fiasco!
My wife is a retired nurse (hospital & home-health) so she has been exposed to virtually every bug that has visited us 1964 - 2018; her retirement. After 55+/- years of nursing she has never had any of those "communicable" diseases. Several of her nursing friends that we have sorta kept up with, have like experiences.
WHY??? My theory is that while they have always used COMMON SENSE in their work, they have been exposed just enough to various bugs that they have built up a natural immunity to most.
I don't claim to be medically proficient, but logically every one of them should have contracted at least one of the bugs at some point, so I personally believe that exposure with reasonable safety precautions is the secret.
Now if I'm correct, the best thing we could do re: this "power grab" is practice basic, BASIC , sanitation actions and this bug would be history in just a few months!!!
If I'm wrong, I'll probably get it, 'cause this is my approach.

 

[JonC]

I would like to know the rate of infection/deaths of medical personnel who have been the front-line warriors during this fiasco!
My wife is a retired nurse (hospital & home-health) so she has been exposed to virtually every bug that has visited us 1964 - 2018; her retirement. After 55+/- years of nursing she has never had any of those "communicable" diseases. Several of her nursing friends that we have sorta kept up with, have like experiences.
WHY??? My theory is that while they have always used COMMON SENSE in their work, they have been exposed just enough to various bugs that they have built up a natural immunity to most.
I don't claim to be medically proficient, but logically every one of them should have contracted at least one of the bugs at some point, so I personally believe that exposure with reasonable safety precautions is the secret.
Now if I'm correct, the best thing we could do re: this "power grab" is practice basic, BASIC , sanitation actions and this bug would be history in just a few months!!!
If I'm wrong, I'll probably get it, 'cause this is my approach.

Rate of 5.62% infection among HCW, with a mean age of 35 years and a dominance of female cases (53.5%).

Majority of infected cases were among nurses (51.3%),

Highest rate of infection was in the emergency rooms (30.6%).

5.5% were admitted to hospitals, but no reports of ICU admission.

10.3% of the cases reported transmitting the infection to family and friends.

1.6% didn't wear masks and 18.7% didn't use gloves in work environments.

COVID-19 infection among healthcare workers: a cross-sectional study in southwest Iran | Virology Journal | Full Text

 

[Reynolds]

Yes. Vaccines in India started mid Jan 2021 and in Columbia at the first of March 2021. And it takes more than one person to produce a varient (read about mutations, varients, and strains). Varients come from unvaccinated populations. RNA viruses will mutate...always. Varients develop from continued infection in population groups.


Vaccines can contribute as well, but in the same way - in people groups via infection. Your source is way out in left field.

My source was correct. Immunity drives variants.
There have been vaxed people worldwide since the rollout of the vaxes.

 

[Andre]

The unvaccinated didn’t cause any problem.

Of course they caused a problem - they are many times more likely to be hospitalized. And they thereby needlessly siphon off health care resources from other people who need them.

 

[JonC]

My source was correct. Immunity drives variants.
There have been vaxed people worldwide since the rollout of the vaxes.

Have you noticed that no varient thus far has come out of vaccinated populations?

Now, don't get me wrong. Vaccines can (and most likely will) result in varients as people who are vaccinated are infected. BUT your source is incorrect about the Delta and MU varients.

The fact is RNA viruses mutate. Always. But the fact is also that varients increase as contagen increases and this is more an issue of unvaccinated at this time.

 

[Andre]

Unvaccinated people are not responsible for variants that are making the vaccinated sick. Those developed completely independent of vaccination status.

How do you conclude this - please cite a credible source.

Here is an expert who asserts that the more unvaccinated people there are, the greater the risk that variants will emerge:

Unvaccinated people do more than merely risk their own health. They're also a risk to everyone if they become infected with coronavirus, infectious disease specialists say.

That's because the only source of new coronavirus variants is the body of an infected person.
"Unvaccinated people are potential variant factories," Dr. William Schaffner, a professor in the Division of Infectious Diseases at Vanderbilt University Medical Center, told CNN Friday.

"The more unvaccinated people there are, the more opportunities for the virus to multiply," Schaffner said

 

[Reynolds]

Have you noticed that no varient thus far has come out of vaccinated populations?

Now, don't get me wrong. Vaccines can (and most likely will) result in varients as people who are vaccinated are infected. BUT your source is incorrect about the Delta and MU varients.

The fact is RNA viruses mutate. Always. But the fact is also that varients increase as contagen increases and this is more an issue of unvaccinated at this time.

They increase as ability to infect becomes challenged. The challenge is antibodies.

 

[Andre]

Many still view the vaccines as "Trump's vaccines" and do not trust them because he says they are safe.

As you know, we agree on most things. But here, I am skeptical - what evidence do you have that there are more than a handful of people who reject the vaccine because they see it as "Trump's vaccine"?

 

[nonaeroterraqueous]

The virologist I watched today said the variants are the sole result of vaccinating into a pandemic. He pointed out that we have never in the history of mankind launched mass vaccination in the middle of a pandemic. The variants will usually first be discovered in unvaxed, but mutated in the bodies of the vaxed. The virus has no need to mutate in a person who has not either been vaccinated or previously infected. He is not antivax. He is use the right vax in only the high risk.
India handled Covid the right way. The world should take notice. It's the leftists who want to shut our economy down. Just open up and run. We will be fine.

Vanden Bossche

I wasn't sure I agreed with him several months back, but I'm coming around to his thinking, lately. It's like taking antibiotics without finishing the prescription: selective pressure that does not or cannot drive the disease away completely only drives it toward resistance. Had people been vaccinated when there was not a pandemic, then (in theory) global vaccination could have been in place to stop it at the outset. Vaccination in the middle of the pandemic means that by the time they got to everyone, they would have spent a great deal of time in that middle ground, where the vaccine was incomplete, unable to stop the disease, but instead providing selective pressure. If they could vaccinate everyone in the world, then the virus would be totally resistant to the vaccine by the time they got the vaccine to everyone.

However, considering the vaccine-induced enhancement of disease, namely for coronaviruses, I don't think any vaccine could do any good under any circumstances.

 

[Reformed1689]

I'm just saying we have known for years that masks, handwashing, and social distancing are effective tools to protect against the spread of respiratory viruses.

Not according to the CDC....

 

[percho]

Warning bad language.

Is the following and the OP relative. I know nothing about those measurements relative to paint.

Painter Proves Even Double Masking Including N95 Masks Doesn't Work Against Particulate Infiltration (bitchute.com)

 

[JonC]

They increase as ability to infect becomes challenged. The challenge is antibodies.

Virus changes are associated with three things.

First, a change in a virus is a pure error.

Another reason a virus might change is because of pressure from select cells in the body.

The creation of a vaccine for any new virus could also cause additional mutations.

Researchers say the vaccines remain our biggest tool against warding off the COVID-19 variants, including the delta variant.

Why Viruses Mutate, Explained by an Infectious Disease Expert

 

[JonC]

As you know, we agree on most things. But here, I am skeptical - what evidence do you have that there are more than a handful of people who reject the vaccine because they see it as "Trump's vaccine"?

This is just from experience. I live in a mostly Democrat area. Many here view the vaccine as rushed by Trump for political reasons and because of this it is unsafe.

 

[Reynolds]

Virus changes are associated with three things.

First, a change in a virus is a pure error.

Another reason a virus might change is because of pressure from select cells in the body.

The creation of a vaccine for any new virus could also cause additional mutations.

Researchers say the vaccines remain our biggest tool against warding off the COVID-19 variants, including the delta variant.

Why Viruses Mutate, Explained by an Infectious Disease Expert

Researchers say whatever makes the institution they work for money.

 

[JonC]

Researchers say whatever makes the institution they work for money.

But we have known this for a long time. This was taught when I was in high school (I graduated in 1986).

Had somebody pointed out the facts prior to covid-19 nobody would have objected. We know this is how varients are produced because thus has been observed for a very long time.

 

[Guvnuh]

Researchers say whatever makes the institution they work for money.

Agree.
A doctor works for a big pharma company for 20 years. The doctor resigns because he/she doesn’t agree with the vaccine approach, or the medical protocol or lack there of fir Covid patients and they are immediately labeled a quack. They’ve become irresponsible or off the rails because they disagree with the political/media narrative.
We’re told not to listen to their science, their research, their information, simply because they disagree with the current practice.
Really?

Humm?