I think you have to be blind not to see who is prospering from the prosperity gospel... Who has the fancy expensive homes (excuse me million dollar mansions)?.. Who drives the expensive cars and owns many more?.. Whose families and themselves are dressed in the finest clothes?... Who flies and owns their own private jet?... Whose bank account is in the millions of dollars and sometimes multi-millions?... WHO IS REALLY benefiting from their so called prosperity gospel?... It's not the sheep but the false shepherd that is fleecing them from their hard earned money... Don't take my word for it check it out for yourselves... Brother Glen
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Megachurches and the Prosperity Gospel....
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I think you have to be blind not to see who is prospering from the prosperity gospel... Who has the fancy expensive homes (excuse me million dollar mansions)?.. Who drives the expensive cars and owns many more?.. Whose families and themselves are dressed in the finest clothes?... Who flies and owns their own private jet?... Whose bank account is in the millions of dollars and sometimes multi-millions?... WHO IS REALLY benefiting from their so called prosperity gospel?... It's not the sheep but the false shepherd that is fleecing them from their hard earned money... Don't take my word for it check it out for yourselves... Brother Glen
Reading this article says it all - Joel Osteen: Moses Saw Sun Stand Still for Joshua, Hebrews Thrown in Fiery Furnace
I am very leary of megachurches. So many of them are prupose driven or seeker churches. There may be some that are truly Christ-centered, but how can a shepherd lead his flock when he doesn't even know who they are?
I am very leary of megachurches. So many of them are prupose driven or seeker churches. There may be some that are truly Christ-centered, but how can a shepherd lead his flock when he doesn't even know who they are?
I'm not particularly in favor of MEGA Churches, that require big screens to see who is delivering a sermon.
While I have no doubt that if I ask anything of my Heavenly Father, he'll grant it, it must be according to His will and not mine or anybody else's.
What the prosperity ministry teaches in essence however is basically this: "If you aren't prospering, you're probably not in Gods will". That's utter hogwash. Tell me that the poor widow in Luke 21:2 and in Mark 12:42 wasn't in God's will. She was poor indeed. As a matter of fact this woman typified her pleasing God in her poverty. Please don't try to tell me she wasn't in God's will. And there are many more examples I can give you if you want.
This doctrine is only leading folks into greed and lust of the heart. Nothing more.
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YEAH!... Who can forget the immortal words of Reverend Ike... "You can't lose with what I use because what I use is MIND POWER!... On TV along time agoooooooooo!... You are showing your age... Me too!... Brother Glen
There are good big churches that are teaching the real gospel and Bible, and there are also many big ioes teaching the heresies of the Charasmatic chaos movement!
I have another thread in which I would classify Mega-churches and prosperity gospel teaching as Laodicean...
Have we all become Laodicean?
I believe that most of these ministers live to become public figures and to profit from the exposure. Past preachers worried about false prophets, today's ministers worry more about false profits! They want their ministry to become cash ATM's that will enable them to build for themselves vast empires!
Have we all become Laodicean?
I believe that most of these ministers live to become public figures and to profit from the exposure. Past preachers worried about false prophets, today's ministers worry more about false profits! They want their ministry to become cash ATM's that will enable them to build for themselves vast empires!
Grace finds fellowship in all different sizes, just as legalism and bully preaching is found in all different sizes.
It is not the size of the congregation that matters, it is the glory and adoration given to the King of grace that matters.
The prosperity Gospel is having a very baneful effect on many churches in the Third World, particularly Africa. When I was in Lesotho in 2015, I found that many very poor people still had access to satellite T.V. and were accessing Prosperity Gospel stuff from America and Nigeria. When they find that becoming a Christian does not make them materially rich, they either become disillusioned with Christianity as a whole, or become corrupt themselves so as to give God a 'helping hand.' The Zambian Baptist leader Conrad Mbewe has written quite a lot about it.
LOL! Being from the metro NYC area i saw him on the tube from the get go. I was astonished by his audacity.
How about hebrews 11, and all of the Apostles, who experienced trials and tribulations, and the prosperity Gospel?
One can be against him based on his theology, but at least Billy graham did 2 things that are rare in certain Charasmatic circles, as he never was caught in an affair, never traveled by himselfto places, always a man with him from staff, and only took the 85,000 annual salary his board decided he should have!
And Osteen has openly endorsed some of these - specifically Che Ahn of California. I had been following what I call the hyper-charismatic movement for quite a while. I've written about it on my own blog.
Those hypers would be the same had in Corinth, who were the "super apostles", while the real ones were suffering for sake of Christ!
It is a sin to build such congregations. I have a study on this here House Assemblies, and the Breaking of Bread | Wisdom of God .
Osteen has denied the money aspect of "prosperity" and said that prosperity to him is "God wants people to be blessed and healthy and have good relationships". We may still denounce that as too much of a "feel good" message, but it is basically an extension of the "abundant life" message even critics themselves teach.
Like this all too common sentiment:
assigning some of the blame to the poor themselves, because their lack of prosperity is supposedly from God Himself and they want relief from it (which others take advantage of). Meanwhile, people teaching this, whether in books or from behind pulpits are usually prosperous themselves , or at least having their basic needs met, since that's the way churches and ministries are set up; figuring God has not "ordained"/"allowed" those things for them, or they are to be materially "rewarded" for their church/ministry "service". (With a couple scriptures cited to suggest that).
So it's like that same "prosperity gospel" is only supposed to work for themselves; the leaders. Osteen and others' error then is extending this to the laity, whom God has supposedly assigned a lower standing.
So what ends up happening, is that the critics of prosperity holding these views, end up just as much focusing on a kind of "prosperity" message; as how can those poor deal with what God has "ordained" for them add find "peace"? That's when they start talking about "faith" and "victory" and "abundant life", and the "steps" to achieve those things. It then sounds a lot like the "faith" message, including if it doesn't work, then it's your own fault; you didn't do something right, such as not having enough "faith" (which is the dark side of this so-called "feel good" message; it's really not all "sunshine and a bowl of cherries", since nothing is ever as easy as "name it and claim it", though it sometimes looks like it in the proof-texts used to support it). The only difference with the critics, is that it's not about gaining money or health, but rather how to gain a proper "attitude" to cope with the lack of those things.
Even some accused of "prosperity", such as Joyce Meyers, etc. are always talking about how God "brings" some disappointment to us to make us "grow" and develop the right attitude, in complete agreement with those criticizing them. (So again, it's not all "feel good", and we shouldn't generalize so much, especially when we're teaching ultimately many of the same things, in different ways. This, from the most "conservative" on down, such as the Biblical Counseling Movement, and the IFB types who say even the BCM has "compromised", etc. They all teach the same things about "attitude" and "steps to growth", making that the focus of "faith").
And as we see people using scripture's account of "suffering" to counter prosperity, but these are taken out of their original context of the actual persecution the early church faced (which is what the oft used scriptures are addressing) and applied to mundane economic and health problems people have today.
So we end up dismissing people's suffering, because "God ordained it" (and thus become like Job's friends), and then criticizing them for following leaders who promise it to them (in an "easier" way, because God wants it to be "hard", because "that's how we grow", which is more conventional 'practical' philosophy than any real sound biblical exposition). They will then more likely flock to those who say "no, God wants you happy and healthy now".
Like this all too common sentiment:
assigning some of the blame to the poor themselves, because their lack of prosperity is supposedly from God Himself and they want relief from it (which others take advantage of). Meanwhile, people teaching this, whether in books or from behind pulpits are usually prosperous themselves , or at least having their basic needs met, since that's the way churches and ministries are set up; figuring God has not "ordained"/"allowed" those things for them, or they are to be materially "rewarded" for their church/ministry "service". (With a couple scriptures cited to suggest that).
So it's like that same "prosperity gospel" is only supposed to work for themselves; the leaders. Osteen and others' error then is extending this to the laity, whom God has supposedly assigned a lower standing.
So what ends up happening, is that the critics of prosperity holding these views, end up just as much focusing on a kind of "prosperity" message; as how can those poor deal with what God has "ordained" for them add find "peace"? That's when they start talking about "faith" and "victory" and "abundant life", and the "steps" to achieve those things. It then sounds a lot like the "faith" message, including if it doesn't work, then it's your own fault; you didn't do something right, such as not having enough "faith" (which is the dark side of this so-called "feel good" message; it's really not all "sunshine and a bowl of cherries", since nothing is ever as easy as "name it and claim it", though it sometimes looks like it in the proof-texts used to support it). The only difference with the critics, is that it's not about gaining money or health, but rather how to gain a proper "attitude" to cope with the lack of those things.
Even some accused of "prosperity", such as Joyce Meyers, etc. are always talking about how God "brings" some disappointment to us to make us "grow" and develop the right attitude, in complete agreement with those criticizing them. (So again, it's not all "feel good", and we shouldn't generalize so much, especially when we're teaching ultimately many of the same things, in different ways. This, from the most "conservative" on down, such as the Biblical Counseling Movement, and the IFB types who say even the BCM has "compromised", etc. They all teach the same things about "attitude" and "steps to growth", making that the focus of "faith").
And as we see people using scripture's account of "suffering" to counter prosperity, but these are taken out of their original context of the actual persecution the early church faced (which is what the oft used scriptures are addressing) and applied to mundane economic and health problems people have today.
So we end up dismissing people's suffering, because "God ordained it" (and thus become like Job's friends), and then criticizing them for following leaders who promise it to them (in an "easier" way, because God wants it to be "hard", because "that's how we grow", which is more conventional 'practical' philosophy than any real sound biblical exposition). They will then more likely flock to those who say "no, God wants you happy and healthy now".
They would equate how spiritual we are by how materially blessed we are, and yet Jesus and His Apostles never saw it in that way!
I was at a prayer breakfast with Billy Graham - in Atlanta (1987) He told us when he did a revival many years previously -, (probably 1950) after the revival ended- the Atlanta newspaper had a political cartoon - showing Billy leaving Atlanta with bags of money. Graham said that is when he got with the board and requested he be put on a salary.
I regard the Prosperity Gospel as a false gospel. Jesus never promised wealth to his followers. In fact, He did quite the opposite. He told His disciples to expect a difficult life filled with challenges. There's nothing inherently wrong about wealth but it tends to isolate the wealthy from many basic issues that the poor encounter like food, housing and medical care. Jesus said that it is difficult for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of Heaven. This was illustrated in the story about the rich young ruler. They tend to feel superior to the poor. In Christ's true gospel message it's turned upside down. The last shall be first and the first shall be last. Preachers like Osteen emphasize what people can achieve through their own attitudes and efforts rather than what God can do through them and for them. They emphasize wealth and material things as life's major objectives rather than following Jesus. It basically comes down to who or what is the master of your life. If the answer is anything other than our Savior you do not have a saving faith.