Men Hitting Women: Why I Can't Tell Them To Stick It Out!

[thegospelgeek]

Seeing pictures has nothing to do with what the biblical answer would be, but there is a difference between "staying" (and accepting) abuse and divorcing. Scriptural guidelines are clear. I would counsel a woman dealing with abuse to separate herself/leave/seek safety....in hopes the man will repent, recieve help and reconcile the relationship, but divorce (at least) is not the option.

Correct!!!!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

So how bout if the wife is the abuser.....perhaps a drug addict and/or an alcoholic & she is way out of control & just beats on the husband. Now the tables are turned. Now answer the question :smilewinkgrin:

 

[Scarlett O.]

So how bout if the wife is the abuser.....perhaps a drug addict and/or an alcoholic & she is way out of control & just beats on the husband. Now the tables are turned. Now answer the question :smilewinkgrin:

My mother has a couple in her church and the wife is an alcoholic. She didn't start drinking until she was in her early 40's. Now, over ten years later, it has taken it's toll on her marriage obviously. I don't know if she is abusive to her husband or not but her sister had told my mother that she is a both a mean and morose drunk.

She has been in and out of rehabs and does well for several months at a time.

Her husband loves her very much, but when she is off the wagon, he will not live with her - and I agree with that. He helps her find medical attention, but will not cohabitate with her when she is on a binge.

It's very, very hard on him and he has wanted to divorce her many times over the past decade. I would not criticize him if he did nor would anyone judge him. And we all pray for him as he tries to help her.

However, as I said, I have no concrete evidence that she is a physically abusive drunk.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

My mother has a couple in her church and the wife is an alcoholic. She didn't start drinking until she was in her early 40's. Now, over ten years later, it has taken it's toll on her marriage obviously. I don't know if she is abusive to her husband or not but her sister had told my mother that she is a both a mean and morose drunk.

She has been in and out of rehabs and does well for several months at a time.

Her husband loves her very much, but when she is off the wagon, he will not live with her - and I agree with that. He helps her find medical attention, but will not cohabitate with her when she is on a binge.

It's very, very hard on him and he has wanted to divorce her many times over the past decade. I would not criticize him if he did nor would anyone judge him. And we all pray for him as he tries to help her.

However, as I said, I have no concrete evidence that she is a physically abusive drunk.

Yes but it does happen....Ive had my recovering Alcoholic Wife hit me with blunt objects in the face & then dare me to use my body to restrain her. Then she would say, " who will the cops believe....me or you?" Im the woman, Im only 5ft 4 in & your a man over 6 foot. And I couldnt leave the house.... I had an infant son & I was afraid of what she would do to him in that state. When the cops finally came they saw my face, all red & bloody & then they saw her & put two & two together. Yea, I could have popped her but what would that have proven?

 

[Scarlett O.]

Yes but it does happen....Ive had my recovering Alcoholic Wife hit me with blunt objects in the face & then dare me to use my body to restrain her. Then she would say, " who will the cops believe....me or you?" Im the woman, Im only 5ft 4 in & your a man over 6 foot. And I couldnt leave the house.... I had an infant son & I was afraid of what she would do to him in that state. When the cops finally came they saw my face, all red & bloody & then they saw her & put two & two together. Yea, I could have popped her but what would that have proven?

I am sorry.

I haven't chimed in this thread until now because I don't believe there is a pat answer here. No one can broadbrush an answer that fits everyone's situation.

IS divorce an option? Of course it is. Should the church encourage it? Not in my opinion. The church and qualified church counselors should encourage reconciliation even if the parties involved live apart. The church could even encourage living apart permanently.

But divorce is always an option. I just supported the decision of a dear friend to divorce her husband. He was having an affair and was addicted to pornography and after two years of going to counseling together and him privately seeking help from pastors and getting counsel from men who had overcome the same problems, he told her that he wasn't going to stop and that she would just going to have to love him like he was.

She couldn't do it. I don't think she should have done it. There was a teenage boy in the home who had to be a witness to all of this.

Her divorce was final a few months ago. No one celebrated it. She didn't consider it a victory.

I believe in marital restoration and reconciliation in almost all situations. But there are some situation in which I relunctantly have to admit that divorce is the only option.

This is why I encourage my students - whether they be my math students or science students - to decide early that they will not get involved in a relationship with anyone unless this person displays superior characterisitics of selflessness, integrity, and Godliness.

We can't always see down the road into the future of our relationships, but we should become quick studies in picking up on tell-tale signs of people who will bring us pain and/or harm.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Easier said than done. easier said than done!

 

[Scarlett O.]

Easier said than done. easier said than done!

Yes, that is very true. Human nature being what it is and all..... :flower:

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

Yes, that is very true. Human nature being what it is and all..... :flower:

We all have sin natures Scarlett. We are all commanded to both turn the other cheek & to love even our enemies. I know this because my sin nature (even after regeneration) still operates, however I now have a conscience & its very surprising to me that I ever even got to the level of having empathy for others....to me it was always weakness. "Greater love has no one than this, that someone lays down his life for his friends" ( john 15:13)

 

[fortytworc]

I strongly disagree with John Piper's statement. Most women who have been abused will tell you that the pain and damage done from verbal, psychological abuse are much deeper and last much longer(even a lifetime) than physical abuse. While acknowledging that there are cases where the abused party is the man, I contend that the reason attitudes such as Pipers are common is because men are not the ones on the receiving end. No woman should tolerate being abused.


I got the url and tried to attach just the photos to the post with no success. After spending some time on this, and viewing them for awhile it 'felt' and looked like something wasn't quite right. The photos actually look to me as though they were something one would see in some of your more "specialized" very sick and depraved pornographic material. Some people actually get their kicks viewing this sort of thing. Having said that, whether they were staged or real, they do depict the physical abuse that women who stay in such relationships deal with.



I have known couples in your type of circumstance. I agree with the need to fully investigate. I must say that no matter the cause, cowardice or otherwise, no one should stay in a the same house with an abusive person (no matter who is being abusive, or abused) spouse, parent, child, sibling, anyone! During the investigation and the remedy-healing process the victims must be protected.

So how bout if the wife is the abuser.....perhaps a drug addict and/or an alcoholic & she is way out of control & just beats on the husband. Now the tables are turned. Now answer the question :smilewinkgrin:

I believe the above post addressed this:...acknowledging that there are cases where the abused party is the man...
...no matter the cause, cowardice or otherwise, no one should stay in a the same house with an abusive person (no matter who is being abusive, or abused) spouse, parent, child, sibling, anyone!

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

...no matter the cause, cowardice or otherwise, no one should stay in a the same house with an abusive person (no matter who is being abusive, or abused) spouse, parent, child, sibling, anyone!

Then who would be there to protect & care for the child in the event of a spouse (wife in this case) getting drunk & either hitting the kid and or passing out & leaving the child unattended. Remember that most states always rule for the mother being the care giver over the father. Its most likely that even if I had divorced that my wife would have been given custody.....what a nightmare for my son that would have been. And where are you posting cowardice....LOL, I am a decorated Marine. Your implying it was cowardice to not having walked out.......nope, that would have been selfishness in not protecting my kid....thats what kept me there.

 

[saturneptune]

My wife has always bruised easily from hitting something as she passed it walking, falling, or once, fell in the bathroom and hit her eye. The bruises sometimes look really bad. In fact, I could not have made worse bruises if I had hit her myself. There are many times I could have been arrested just on appearance.

Getting back to the op, there is never an excuse for a man hitting a woman. No woman should ever put up with it, and the law should be the solution.

I am not a marriage behavior expert, so I am not sure if a man could ever be trusted after the first hit. If he could, it would take lots of rehabilitation and trust on the wife's part, and if it ever happened again, that would be it.

 

[fortytworc]

Then who would be there to protect & care for the child in the event of a spouse (wife in this case) getting drunk & either hitting the kid and or passing out & leaving the child unattended. Remember that most states always rule for the mother being the care giver over the father. Its most likely that even if I had divorced that my wife would have been given custody.....what a nightmare for my son that would have been. And where are you posting cowardice....LOL, I am a decorated Marine. Your implying it was cowardice to not having walked out.......nope, that would have been selfishness in not protecting my kid....thats what kept me there.

Sorry for the unclear communication. I was not trying to call anyone a coward. I was answering a point brought up by Don who was quoting another person...
"So again, in most cases, I would agree; but not all. Such things need to be fully investigated to see if it's a case of cowardice, or something else".

In most cases, I would agree with you. However, I went through a bad time after returning from overseas; I got angry a lot. I rationalized it in my head, but it was all irrational. I got so angry at points that yes, I wanted to hit my wife; but I managed to keep control. And it wasn't just my wife; it was the guy in that car who cut me off (I could have taken his head off); it was that yokel in the check-out line (would have been real easy to just beat the tar out of him); etc., etc. I got some counseling, and worked through it. Things are better.

The point being, while I managed to maintain control and fix it, I can understand others who might not, and haven't. When you get so angry that you just "lose it," it doesn't matter whether it's the wife, or the neighbor, or the kid down the street; it doesn't matter if you're 5'5" or 6'7". And afterwards, you just sit back in confusion, wondering how it was possible that you were so far gone.

So again, in most cases, I would agree; but not all. Such things need to be fully investigated to see if it's a case of cowardice, or something else.

Please don't take this as trying to make an excuse for those that beat their wives; this was a response to a particular comment, not the situation in general. I will always fall back to my response on the first page, just after the opening post.

There are so many variables that I believe if anyone thinks they have THE answer to all similar circumstances , they may think they know how everybody should respond in every situation...or they might be god...lol. You probably received suggestions and advice out the wazzu. I don't know if getting professional legal advice and guidance for your situation would have enabled you and your kids to be protected and justified in leaving or not. Also, this would make things more complicated for a wife. The kids must be protected. I have seen abused men with children navigate through the system and come out with what was the best for the kids and themselves.

 

[righteousdude2]

Mine was abusive...

So how bout if the wife is the abuser.....perhaps a drug addict and/or an alcoholic & she is way out of control & just beats on the husband. Now the tables are turned. Now answer the question :smilewinkgrin:

...and because I feared for my life after the woman attacked me twice in public places, and threatened to slice my throat open after I fell asleep.

I left and divorced her. However, she continued to stalk me for the next seven years, going as far as to move from Nebraksa to California. I couldn't show up, at most public functions (the county fair, Christian concerts, etc.) without her being there, trying to pretend it was a chance meeting, and always coming up and saying, "hello!"

She scared me preety bad, and even though I haven't seen her for at least ten years now, the thought of her showing up at a public event remains in the back of mind.

I understand abused spouse syndrome better than most, because I was not only there, it was done to me!

 

[seekingthetruth]

I have been narried twice and both of my wives hit me many times. I never, not once hit them back, even when my lip was bleeding.

thank goodness, my wife now realised that hitting me was wrong and she stopped it many years ago.

But where do we get the idea that domestic violence is always about the man?

John

 

[saturneptune]

I have been narried twice and both of my wives hit me many times. I never, not once hit them back, even when my lip was bleeding.

thank goodness, my wife now realised that hitting me was wrong and she stopped it many years ago.

But where do we get the idea that domestic violence is always about the man?

John

Maybe because 99%+ of abuse cases are a man hitting a woman. The physical size and strength alone answers the question, with rare exception. I am not advocating a man stand there if his life is in danger, but that is not usually the case.

Locally, I can remember several years ago a man checked into a half way house for battered women. He looked like a miniature Wally Cox, and his wife looked like a drill sergeant. If not tragic, it would have almost been comical. However, these are very rare cases, not the rule.

 

[Jon-Marc]

I always wonder why any woman would stay with a man who abuses her. Is she all that insecure that she can't make it on her own?

Also, why is it that a woman can hit a man who hits her, but a man can't hit a woman who hits him? She can defend herself, and everyone will be on her side. However, a man can't defend himself against a woman without being arrested and charged with spousal abuse. I don't like or believe in double standards.

 

[DiamondLady]

I always wonder why any woman would stay with a man who abuses her. Is she all that insecure that she can't make it on her own?

I've stayed quiet up til now....I can tell you exactly why a woman stays with a man who abuses her, as I stayed for 22 years.

I honored my marriage vows....for better or worse. I stayed because the one time I walked out and went to my mother-in-law's house she told me to go home that I'd done something to cause it and I must have deserved it. I stayed because I feared that if people found out I was being abused I would be thought less of, because as a Christian woman I must be doing something wrong to cause my husband to act like this. I stayed because I had two small boys who I thought needed a father....I thought any father was better than no father. (May I add that I realize that was wrong) Finally, after 22 years I discovered my husband's dirty little secret and ended our marriage, at that point caring nothing for what other people thought. (and let me add...my church treated me like a leper, like a prostitute...and embraced my ex-husband because his daddy was a deacon)

As a formerly abused wife I would tell any abused woman to find the door and walk and seek an immediate divorce. A leopard does not change it's spots. It may adapt to captivity, but it will never be tame and you can never trust it enough to turn your back on it. It's the same with an abuser. They may stop for a season but it always simmers under the surface. It takes very little to light the fuse once again. I do not believe, and you will never convince me to believe, that God would expect any woman to stay with a husband who beats her for no reason other than she is breathing. An abuser doesn't need a reason.

Am I sorry I got a divorce? No, never will be. I am, however, sorry I displeased God. I am sorry that I married that man in the first place. I should have listened to those who warned me, who saw things in him I never saw. But God....aren't those wonderful words??? But God, in his infinte grace, has forgiven me and removed any guilt I felt and any regrets I had. He sent me a wonderful, wonderful, loving husband to teach me what marriage really is.

 

[Alive in Christ]

DiamondLady....

I thought any father was better than no father. (May I add that I realize that was wrong) Finally, after 22 years I discovered my husband's dirty little secret and ended our marriage, at that point caring nothing for what other people thought. (and let me add...my church treated me like a leper, like a prostitute...and embraced my ex-husband because his daddy was a deacon)

Now that bolded part has got my blood boiling as much as the men who beat their wives.

Shame on them.

 

[DiamondLady]

DiamondLady....

[/b]

Now that bolded part has got my blood boiling as much as the men who beat their wives.

Shame on them.

took me 8 years before I could step inside a Baptist church again. But God knew me and loved me and kept drawing me back....through the Methodist Church and music. He let me be called to serve first for one year as the Children's music minister at one and then for two more years as the Minister of Music at a second Methodist Church. We were driving one day and as we passed our church the Lord spoke to me and said, "There, that's where I want you." I told my husband and we went that Sunday and have been there, serving God, ever since.

Took me a while to learn that people try to make religious rules that aren't God's rules and that man sets out standards that aren't necessarily God's and aren't how He works. God looks at us through the blood of Christ and with Grace. Man looks on others through critical eyes filled with judgment. For those things I am immensely grateful.

 

[Scarlett O.]

I've stayed quiet up til now....I can tell you exactly why a woman stays with a man who abuses her, as I stayed for 22 years.

I honored my marriage vows....for better or worse. I stayed because the one time I walked out and went to my mother-in-law's house she told me to go home that I'd done something to cause it and I must have deserved it. I stayed because I feared that if people found out I was being abused I would be thought less of, because as a Christian woman I must be doing something wrong to cause my husband to act like this. I stayed because I had two small boys who I thought needed a father....I thought any father was better than no father. (May I add that I realize that was wrong) Finally, after 22 years I discovered my husband's dirty little secret and ended our marriage, at that point caring nothing for what other people thought. (and let me add...my church treated me like a leper, like a prostitute...and embraced my ex-husband because his daddy was a deacon)

As a formerly abused wife I would tell any abused woman to find the door and walk and seek an immediate divorce. A leopard does not change it's spots. It may adapt to captivity, but it will never be tame and you can never trust it enough to turn your back on it. It's the same with an abuser. They may stop for a season but it always simmers under the surface. It takes very little to light the fuse once again. I do not believe, and you will never convince me to believe, that God would expect any woman to stay with a husband who beats her for no reason other than she is breathing. An abuser doesn't need a reason.

Am I sorry I got a divorce? No, never will be. I am, however, sorry I displeased God. I am sorry that I married that man in the first place. I should have listened to those who warned me, who saw things in him I never saw. But God....aren't those wonderful words??? But God, in his infinte grace, has forgiven me and removed any guilt I felt and any regrets I had. He sent me a wonderful, wonderful, loving husband to teach me what marriage really is.

Thank you. You just may have saved someone's life today - be they man or woman or child.