More edu.- less snake handlers!

[Luke2427]

It is often remarked that Peter and some of the other Apostles were not educated men. From that people argue that we don't have to be educated either.

But what is often TOTALLY missed by these people is...

PETER SPOKE GREEK AND HEBREW!!!

He did not HAVE to learn it.

PETER LIVED THE HISTORICAL BACKGROUNDS OF THE NEW TESTAMENT!!

He did not have to go to school to learn the historical context of the New Testament books.

Peter knew all too well about Antiochus Epiphanes, Roman occupation of the land of Israel, the Maccabes, the Zealots, etc...

I have taken NUMEROUS classes on nothing more than Backgrounds of the New Testament.

Peter KNEW the Gnostics FIRST HAND!!

Of course he did not have to be educated. His own LIFE was his education. We do not have that benefit.

We have to go to school for YEARS just to SCRATCH the SURFACE of the knowledge that Peter had as a fisherman.

This is why ALL clergy ought to seek education.

Stupidity in the pulpit is the NUMBER ONE problem of this age.

We have absolute backwater, fundamentalist, MORONS filling so many pulpits today!! And that has created churches filled with arrogant idiots who do not know up from down.

We don't need LESS education. We need MORE of it. More and more and more of it.

We need less snake handling morons and more well educated clergy in our pulpits today.

And quite frankly, most fundy churches today are not a much higher step above the stupid level of mountain snake handlers.

 

[SolaSaint]

Luke,

Don't hold back brother, say what you mean....LOL

You must have been watching too much of Snake Salvation lately.

 

[preachinjesus]

Anyone who states the early apostles lacked education, and thus justifies their own anti-intellectualism, proves they don't know what they're talking about. The basic higher religious education of the day was following a rabbi.

They got their BA/MDiv from the Master and their PhD from their wounds.

Likewise, the early church sought out educated leaders. I don't have time for those who claim less religious education is a good thing.

 

[Luke2427]

Luke,

Don't hold back brother, say what you mean....LOL

You must have been watching too much of Snake Salvation lately.

As a matter of fact... :laugh:

 

[SolaSaint]

I believe one who stands in the pulpit can never have too much education.

 

[salzer mtn]

How much education does it take to preach the gospel ? I am one that is persuaded that one has to be saved and called of God to start with and if one only has the bible and nothing else he can be led and taught by the Holy Spirit unto all truth. I have nothing against education, I believe those minister's that are called of God are studious people, but only the Holy Spirit can teach a person about the deep things of God.

 

[Earth Wind and Fire]

How much education does it take to preach the gospel ? I am one that is persuaded that one has to be saved and called of God to start with and if one only has the bible and nothing else he can be led and taught by the Holy Spirit unto all truth. I have nothing against education, I believe those minister's that are called of God are studious people, but only the Holy Spirit can teach a person about the deep things of God.

Amen:thumbsup:

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

How much education does it take to preach the gospel ? I am one that is persuaded that one has to be saved and called of God to start with and if one only has the bible and nothing else he can be led and taught by the Holy Spirit unto all truth. I have nothing against education, I believe those minister's that are called of God are studious people, but only the Holy Spirit can teach a person about the deep things of God.

More often than not, the method the Holy Spirit uses is a good seminary.

 

[HAMel]

How much education does it take to preach the gospel ? I am one that is persuaded that one has to be saved and called of God to start with and if one only has the bible and nothing else he can be led and taught by the Holy Spirit unto all truth. I have nothing against education, I believe those minister's that are called of God are studious people, but only the Holy Spirit can teach a person about the deep things of God.

...well said!

"The goal of education is the advancement of knowledge and the dissemination of truth." (John F. Kennedy)

Way too many institutions of higher learning revolve around their agenda. Not much truth left anymore with very little being presented. Whereas the Holy Spirit teaches nothing but truth but only to those who seek it absent an agenda.

 

[just-want-peace]

Education w/o the accompanying WISDOM of God is not only wasted (from a spiritual standpoint), but dangerous when applied to spiritual matters.

IOW, the unsaved/carnal PHD is no more creditable than the snake handler - from a spiritual standpoint, and possibly even more dangerous because of those who feel his education makes him "virtually infallible" in spiritual matters.

 

[Winman]

The whole argument is a strawman. Because someone does not go to seminary does not mean he will be ignorant like a snake handler.

Your very argument does not show much intelligence, it is a fallacy.

 

[Revmitchell]

The whole argument is a strawman. Because someone does not go to seminary does not mean he will be ignorant like a snake handler.

Your very argument does not show much intelligence, it is a fallacy.

Education does not seem to help some folks make better arguments.

 

[Luke2427]

How much education does it take to preach the gospel ? I am one that is persuaded that one has to be saved and called of God to start with and if one only has the bible and nothing else he can be led and taught by the Holy Spirit unto all truth. I have nothing against education, I believe those minister's that are called of God are studious people, but only the Holy Spirit can teach a person about the deep things of God.

The Holy Spirit does not teach original languages, historical backgrounds, contemporary theological ideas, etc...

 

[Luke2427]

The whole argument is a strawman. Because someone does not go to seminary does not mean he will be ignorant like a snake handler.

Your very argument does not show much intelligence, it is a fallacy.

Where did I say seminary?

A good seminary is an excellent way to get an education, but it is not the only way.

Charles Spurgeon was a vociferous reader of great books. He had no seminary education but because he read after so many that had extraordinary education, Spurgeon was one of the best educated baptists in history.

Not everyone who is uneducated is as ignorant as the preachers on the Snake Salvation show- but they are more often than not a whole lot closer to that level than ought to be found in the pulpit.

For example, no truly educated person could believe KJVO.

That's why no decent seminaries teach that nonsense.

Once you learn certain things, then you know immediately that KJVO is utterly ridiculous.

Education will cure a lot of the warts in the church today.

 

[JonC]

Tozer is another example.

IMHO, churches have relinquished much of their responsibility to the seminaries (much is taught there that should be taught in the local church).

 

[USN2Pulpit]

Where did I say seminary?

A good seminary is an excellent way to get an education, but it is not the only way.

This statement went a long way toward clarifying your position. I do not have a complete seminary education - although I have taken seminary classes as I am able. I read a lot about original languages and cultural context and find it very enriching and meaningful toward my own understanding.

On the other hand, most of the time I can tell by listening when a preacher is a seminary grad. In their sermon, there is one "Terminal Objective or Main Point", three "Enabling Objectives or Supporting Points" and sub-points. A standard formula delivered in the same manner and style as pleased their professors.

This observation doesn't apply to all of course, but several that I have observed - most of the time those who are newly out of seminary. This is good for some congregations, but doesn't reach others. We need all styles of preaching for all styles of churches - as long as those churches are active followers of Christ. In other words, it's good when the personality of the pastor is a match with the personality of the church.

 

[Revmitchell]

On the other hand, most of the time I can tell by listening when a preacher is a seminary grad. In their sermon, there is one "Terminal Objective or Main Point", three "Enabling Objectives or Supporting Points" and sub-points. A standard formula delivered in the same manner and style as pleased their professors.

This form is used by pastors, not to please their professors but, to enable the listeners to follow with clarity.

 

[thisnumbersdisconnected]

Education w/o the accompanying WISDOM of God is not only wasted (from a spiritual standpoint), but dangerous when applied to spiritual matters.

A man or woman who enters seminary without such wisdom wouldn't pass muster with the seminary leadership. There is a constant watch among Bible colleges and seminaries for students who show no evidence of the Holy Spirit. They don't challenge the student's salvation, just his/her motivation for seeking to serve God when they don't evidently have a calling to do so. So your premise that such a person could get through a Bible college or seminary degree program without being challenged does not hold up to inspection.

 

[USN2Pulpit]

This form is used by pastors, not to please their professors but, to enable the listeners to follow with clarity.

Good afternoon Rev...please don't assume that I speak AGAINST this form. Just saying that I recognize it as something that is taught in seminary. And whether or not someone likes that form, I'm just saying I recognize it - I've even used it myself.

I would say this though - I'm not handcuffed to that particular form though. I used to be. I used to keep a death grip on the pulpit too.

 

[Winman]

Where did I say seminary?

Right here;

We have to go to school for YEARS just to SCRATCH the SURFACE of the knowledge that Peter had as a fisherman.

If you did not mean seminary here, then pray tell what type of school were you saying preachers need to attend?

By the way, I am not a preacher.

A good seminary is an excellent way to get an education, but it is not the only way.

Now you change your tune.

Charles Spurgeon was a vociferous reader of great books. He had no seminary education but because he read after so many that had extraordinary education, Spurgeon was one of the best educated baptists in history.

As Ronald Reagan said, you can't knock success.

Not everyone who is uneducated is as ignorant as the preachers on the Snake Salvation show- but they are more often than not a whole lot closer to that level than ought to be found in the pulpit.

You must see a lot of that down your way.

For example, no truly educated person could believe KJVO.

Now, that is a ridiculous statement, because there are highly educated men who are KJO like D.A. Waite.

That's why no decent seminaries teach that nonsense.

There might be many reasons seminaries do not teach KJO.

Once you learn certain things, then you know immediately that KJVO is utterly ridiculous.

I think the proper word would be "convinced" or "persuaded" that KJO is ridiculous.

Education will cure a lot of the warts in the church today.

Then why do statistics prove that the more education a person has, the more likely they are to be an atheist? The more educated a person is, the more likely they are to be liberal?