Negativism at Home Could Produce Defeat Of U.S. Policy in Iraq

[KenH]

June 28, 2005
Negativism at Home Could Produce Defeat Of U.S. Policy in Iraq
By Mort Kondracke

Unless they can't help themselves, it strikes me as political madness for Democrats to declare that the Iraq war is an "intractable quagmire" or a "grotesque mistake."

If the war turns out to be a disaster - and let's pray it doesn't - then voters will repudiate Republican foreign policy in 2006 and 2008, and Democrats will be the beneficiaries.

So why should some Democrats now be acting as though they want to see their country lose a war? Why should they say things that may undermine the morale of U.S. forces and our Iraqi allies and contribute to a U.S. defeat?

And why should they reinforce the image of their party as being so hopelessly force-averse that it can't be trusted to lead on foreign policy?...


There are three explanations, not mutually exclusive, for what Democrats are doing in stepping up attacks on Bush's Iraq policy now.

One is that they are taking advantage of polls showing that the public has turned sharply negative on the war.Another is that they want to claim vindication amid rising casualty rates.And a third is that they just want to keep saying what they think - that the war is a loser....
The danger is that defeatism at home will create a defeatist dynamic in Iraq. As Gen. John Abizaid, commander of U.S. forces in the Persian Gulf, told the committee that among "our troops and the troops we're training in the Iraqi and Afghan security forces, I never sensed the level of their confidence higher."

"And when I look back here at what I see is happening in Washington, within the Beltway, I've never seen the lack of confidence greater."

He added that, "when my soldiers ... ask me the question whether or not they've got the support from the American people, that worries me. And they're starting to do that.

"And when the people that we're training, Iraqis and Afghans, start asking me whether we have the staying power to stick with them, that worries me, too."...


A thick book came out this spring, "Vietnam Chronicles: the Abrams Tapes," recounting the dismay of U.S. commander Gen. Creighton Abrams as his and South Vietnamese forces won battle after battle against Communist troops from 1968 to 1972, but lost the war on the home front.

After the 1968 Tet offensive - an allied military victory, but a psychological defeat -the media and the Democratic Congress decided that the war was "unwinnable" and it gradually became so.

Abrams complained that it was impossible to get beyond "the umpires" - the media bureau chiefs in Saigon and the Congress - who wouldn't listen to reports of military progress.

"Whenever this command goes out to explain how it did something well, they're calling you out before the throw is made to the plate. That's the game we're in."...

- entire column at SOURCE

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by KenH:
June 28, 2005
Negativism at Home Could Produce Defeat Of U.S. Policy in Iraq
By Mort Kondracke

Unless they can't help themselves, it strikes me as political madness for Democrats to declare that the Iraq war is an "intractable quagmire" or a "grotesque mistake."

If the war turns out to be a disaster - and let's pray it doesn't - then voters will repudiate Republican foreign policy in 2006 and 2008, and Democrats will be the beneficiaries.

This is what the Dems are counting on. They are hoping and praying for every loss and tragedy in the war. It is as if they are standing on the sidelines cheering on the enemy. They want us to lose this war. This is why their claims of being patriotic are hollow and phony. I can see right through it. So could the majority of Americans last November. That is why the anti-war losers lost their election last November.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[ASLANSPAL]

Here we go again Readers digest version

1. Republicans are in power and it is a growing
number of them that are putting their 2 cents
worth into questioning the war yeah ignore
William F. Buckley and Chuck Hagel!

2. Bush *ya know the buck really does not stop
with me...its over there....no! its over there!
It is their fault! not mine!

3. Americans are united on the real War on Terrorism but from rove *lets divide Americans
anyway by calling them un patriotic.

4. Lets roll out the Vietnam analogies even if they don't apply.

5. Lets get paranoid because I just know that
person over there is less patriotic than I am.
I just feel it in my bones , my trombone can
pick up the negative waves!


6. Don't you dare question mistakes by the
bush culture..how dare! you! ..you are endangering
Haliburton contracts.

bush better see his narrow opportunity and claim
victory and bring troops home with honor instead
of providing the same sound bites but I doubt
it he will be surrounded at this staged event
with those who bobble head agree with him and in
his pride he will think he wears the Kings clothes
when in fact he is very naked.

In a nutshell the loyal opposistion is looking
for competence.

Can people be fooled and vote against their interests...you betcha!

We are still waiting for bush to go on the
MARRIAGE AMENDMENT TOUR and get that done or
is he thinking more about his body fat ratio
going up...my..my..we cannot interupt his work
out addiction ..he must have structure.

Oh Mort Kondracke another coincidenceal story
coming out the same day as the bush staged event!
Oh Mort ..Fred Barnes is calling he does not
need you anymore he actually wants debate and
not an echo chamber.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by ASLANSPAL:
Here we go again Readers digest version

4. Lets roll out the Vietnam analogies even if they don't apply.

I agree. I think the Democrats should end their whole Vietnam comparison stupidity and stop using the word quagmire.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[billwald]

Turned out that the Viet Nam protestors were correct in their evaluation. We lost the war and the rest of Asia didn't go commie.

 

[KenH]

And the South Vietnamese people paid the price and are paying the price as did the Cambodians. And the Left is largely responsible for their suffering.

 

[KenH]

Originally posted by ASLANSPAL:
Chuck Hagel

Maybe Hagel should join the Democrat Party. He would fit in better with you losers on the Left, ASLANSPAL.

 

[LadyEagle]

To defray the tide of public opinion going against the war in Iraq is one reason why even the liberal media are not showing us pictures of flag-draped coffins coming home daily. The WH learned a valuable lesson from Vietnam. We haven't seen flag-draped coffins en masse since then, have we?

However, even with the so-called liberal media, we are seeing a controlled press this time around. So much for first amendment rights. The powerful pull the strings and even the liberal media dances the puppet dance.

 

[LadyEagle]

It's time to brush off your old DVD copies of Behind Enemy Lines. The good guys become the bad guys and vice versa depending on where the $$ is.

 

[Enoch]

Unless they can't help themselves, it strikes me as political madness for Democrats to declare that the Iraq war is an "intractable quagmire" or a "grotesque mistake."

I see right through them as well and their calculated ways. Most do not know Jesus (pray for them), some are naïve and have no clue their party no longer resembles what it did in the past. I think the left cannot help themselves from their intense negativity. It is madness! They are so miserable and full of angry and hate that nothing else can flow from their hearts. They can continue to spread their venom to destroy America but they will never reach their goal. They are the minority and their anti-American ways are more and more evident to the American people.


We will WIN the war in Iraq. We will WIN the war at home with the left. I laugh in the face of any liberal who thinks otherwise.

 

[OCC]

"Maybe Hagel should join the Democrat Party. He would fit in better with you losers on the Left, ASLANSPAL.
Is THAT a personal attack?

"And the South Vietnamese people paid the price and are paying the price as did the Cambodians. And the Left is largely responsible for their suffering."
Sure...blame the other side. Maybe you should have won the war!

 

[LadyEagle]

What about conservatives or realists, enoch? Or those of us who believe the war on terror should begin at home by putting the military on our borders and deporting illegal aliens? Did you know the President refused to deport around 30,000 Middle Eastern male illegal aliens after 09/11?

 

[Travelsong]

We've had our chance for success in Iraq. We walked all over them and removed Saddam within a month. Since then we've done squat with no end in sight.

Oh wait, we've created the relatively secure "green zone" to house and protect the appointed leadership while the general populace continually gets blown to bits.

Poor judgement will be our defeat. We should have never gone to Iraq, period. This is a war we simply have no chance of winning.

You can't blame liberals for dissent any longer, so give it up. Conservatives are getting just as sick of all the lies and deception of this administration.

 

[LadyEagle]

Maybe you should have won the war!

We would have won it if the politicians had stayed out of it and let the military do it's job. Same as in Iraq. We lost the momentum when the politicians decided to negotiate.

 

[OCC]

"I think the left cannot help themselves from their intense negativity. It is madness! They are so miserable and full of angry and hate that nothing else can flow from their hearts. They can continue to spread their venom to destroy America but they will never reach their goal. They are the minority and their anti-American ways are more and more evident to the American people."

I think you are wrong. Conservatives fit in that picture just as neatly. Liberals are the minority eh? Funny...almost half the country VOTED for them! And since when does majority make right? Would that make Muslims in the Middle East right?

Anti-American? You sound foolish. My girlfriend's grandfather fought in Vietnam and he is a Democrat and he is probably more patriotic than you are. You should listen to yourself. So against others having the freedom to believe as they choose. Who is ANTI-AMERICAN here???

 

[church mouse guy]

Oh, let's see pictures of the flag-draped coffins. Let's send the press to every American and allied funeral. Let's have a body count again on tv. The press is so sensitive and so balanced. Let's let them do what they comes natural to them. They agree with the CP.

Let's capitulate. Let's don't win. We capitulated in Korea and the only drawback was atomic bombs in the north. We capitulated in Viet Nam and the only drawback was that some non-Americans were murdered by the communists by the millions. If we capitulate in Iraq, the only drawback with be an Arab bloothbath in Iraq but it will be a while before the next Nine Eleven and we can be rich and happy again.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Oh wait, and then there was this little election thing...no big deal, right? And then there are the schools that have been built, electricity provided, and water...but, who really cares about the suffering that has been lessened for the Iraqi people, right? What about the Iraqi security forces we have trained which are starting to take control of their own country's destiny and giving them more and more soveriegnty all the time? None of that really matters.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[OCC]

Originally posted by LadyEagle:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Maybe you should have won the war!

We would have won it if the politicians had stayed out of it and let the military do it's job. Same as in Iraq. We lost the momentum when the politicians decided to negotiate. </font>[/QUOTE]Do you realize how that sounds? Wars come to an end because of "negotiation". And you can't be telling me your huge military didn't beat little old Vietnam because of a bunch of politicians??? You have to realize how that sounds.

I think you lost the war because your military commanders were prideful. They thought Vietnam was no match. Well...the war was fought on their land. They knew it. That war should never have happened and I feel awful for anyone who lost family. I would be extremely angry to this day if I were American and lost my dad over that. Now...this is my opinion and I won't tolerate anyone mocking me or attacking me over it.

 

[Travelsong]

Go pick up a gun and head over there. Send your own kids. This is your war, not mine.

 

[OCC]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Oh wait, and then there was this little election thing...no big deal, right? And then there are the schools that have been built, electricity provided, and water...but, who really cares about the suffering that has been lessened for the Iraqi people, right? What about the Iraqi security forces we have trained which are starting to take control of their own country's destiny and giving them more and more soveriegnty all the time? None of that really matters.

Joseph Botwinick

No...it doesn't matter. Because that was not the reason you went there. It was vengeance over what was done to you guys. It's simple...just be honest. No need to hide behind doing "nice things".