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News: Missionary couple challenges IMB's grounds for termination

Discussion in '2003 Archive' started by Sherrie, Apr 22, 2003.

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  1. Kiffin

    Kiffin New Member

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    If you are represnting the SBC and receiving CP money you should be required to sign the BF@M to insure doctrinal integrity. If one disagrees then go somewhere else. The Dills should quit their whining and either get on board or find another sponsor.
     
    #21 Kiffin, Apr 23, 2003
  2. Squire Robertsson

    Squire Robertsson Administrator
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    Lo, many moons ago (back in the first half of the last century), missionaries found themselves in the same predicament. Only these were "fundamentalists". These folks withdrew from the Northern Baptist Missionary Society (or whatever its exact name was). They could no longer serve in an organization that had changed its doctrinal stance. The brethren in question went on to found organizations like ABWE, Baptist Mid-Missions, and Baptist World Missions.

    So, what's new with the Dills? They are acting like a couple of Presbyterians. As was asked, are they not serving as representatives of a local church? Has their home church changed? And a bunch of other questions......
     
    #22 Squire Robertsson, Apr 23, 2003
  3. Speedpass

    Speedpass Active Member
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    I wonder if it's the same group who decides every time there's an election for SBC president who is going to be the only "legitimate" candidate. :confused:
     
    #23 Speedpass, Apr 23, 2003
  4. KPBAP

    KPBAP Member

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    I have been with the SBC for 40 years and have seen MANY things! The IMB has continued to restrict missionaries' freedom and that means many things. Missionaries have to keep more paperwork to justify that they are doing the "approved" ministry. And this talk about women pastors...PLEASE. The most famous SBC missionary was a woman who literally gave her life. MEN didn't want her to go but she felt God calling her to China. She would probably be denied commissioning today by the IMB.
     
    #24 KPBAP, Apr 23, 2003
  5. Sherrie

    Sherrie New Member

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    Betty, I was talking about this statement in this article:

    Why was the word Senior put there? They are implying women can serve as jr. Pastors.

    Sherrie [​IMG]
     
    #25 Sherrie, Apr 23, 2003
  6. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

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    The SBC is by no means a strict organization. The statement of faith allows for a lot of wiggle room within its statements. Consider eschatology, you could be anything by their statement.

    Also, just because she thought God called her to do something doesn't mean he actually did. Btw, he didn't.
     
    #26 Daniel David, Apr 23, 2003
  7. KPBAP

    KPBAP Member

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    Excuse me, did you say that YOU know that God did NOT call Lottie Moon to be a missionary to the Chinese people?????
     
    #27 KPBAP, Apr 23, 2003
  8. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

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    Sherrie, it is because some people consider the word pastor to include such things as the children's minister, education director, women's director, etc.

    The word pastor might include those things (and thus the usage), but the office is the same as an elder or overseer. That is why they use the term Senior Pastor.
     
    #28 Daniel David, Apr 23, 2003
  9. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

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    Yes.
     
    #29 Daniel David, Apr 23, 2003
  10. Sherrie

    Sherrie New Member

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    Oh..ok...thanks for clearing that up for me. I really thought it was odd.

    Sherrie [​IMG]
     
    #30 Sherrie, Apr 23, 2003
  11. Kiffin

    Kiffin New Member

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    I disagree with criticizing Lottie Moon. This was an aristocratic young lady who died broke because she gave all to helping the children of China. She never presumed herself to be a pastor but much like many other great women of the Bible, Mary the mother of Jesus, Mary Magdala, Priscilla and Phoebe she was a greatly used of God and certainly the Church needs women on the mission field (just not the pulpit).

    She was a selfless person who loved the Chinese and I think the zeal of Lottie Moon is something we all need and I imagine she wouldn't have a problem signing the 2000 BF@M. [​IMG]
     
    #31 Kiffin, Apr 23, 2003
  12. Daniel David

    Daniel David New Member

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    Kiffin, I have no problem with her realizing a need in China and going to meet it. There is no doubt that she did a lot of good over there.

    I was merely pointing out that she was not "called to be a missionary".
     
    #32 Daniel David, Apr 23, 2003
  13. KPBAP

    KPBAP Member

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    So, how do YOU define "being called"? She sensed God's leadership and felt the need to obey. Can women NOT be called?? It angers me, when I hear men say they know who is called and who isn't!! SO do you know who is saved and who isn't? ...and just FYI I would NEVER sign the BFM2K. It is sad to see the SBC become a papal state. Gosh, wouldn't J.Frank Norris be happy today?
     
    #33 KPBAP, Apr 23, 2003
  14. SaggyWoman

    SaggyWoman Active Member

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    Women can be children's pastors.
     
    #34 SaggyWoman, Apr 23, 2003
  15. go2church

    go2church Active Member
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    Daniel David
    Better to be thought a fool then open your mouth and remove all doubt
     
    #35 go2church, Apr 23, 2003
  16. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    The denigration of Lottie Moon is to be deplored. A woman who starved on the mission field to carry out her work deserves better.
     
    #36 rsr, Apr 23, 2003
  17. Thankful

    Thankful <img src=/BettyE.gif>

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    I still cannot find the term "Senior Pastor" in the Baptist Faith and Message 2000.
     
    #37 Thankful, Apr 23, 2003
  18. rsr

    rsr <b> 7,000 posts club</b>
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    It's not there; it's an interpretation contained in the original story, one that draws a distinction between "pastor" and "other" ministers. This is one of the few waffles left in the new BF&M, one I expect to be removed at some point.
     
    #38 rsr, Apr 24, 2003
  19. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards <img src=/Ed.gif>

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    SaggyWoman: "Women can be children's pastors."

    Apparently not, according to the 2000 BF&M.
    Women can be Minister to Children
    or even a Missionary to Children
    but not a Children's Pastor.
    BTW, Sister SaggyWoman, i pray for you every
    day that you might be a succesful
    Minister to Children.

    Article about 2000 BF&M: "That runs counter
    to the new Baptist Faith and Message's
    declaration that women may not serve
    as senior pastors."

    2000 BF&M: "While both men and women
    are gifted for service in the church,
    the office of pastor is limited
    to men as qualified by Scripture."

    IMHO the article makes an opinion of what
    the 2000 BF&M says. My opinion is that
    it means women should not serve as pastors.
    This includes Jr. Pastors, Pastors of Children,
    Pastors of Senior Citizens, Pastors of
    whatever. Oh dear, Sister SaggyWoman, are
    you going to have to change the nameplate
    on your desk or office?
     
    #39 Ed Edwards, Apr 24, 2003
  20. Ed Edwards

    Ed Edwards <img src=/Ed.gif>

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    What i was reading last month was a complaint that
    the SBC had been captured by the
    conservatives. So i'll be glad when
    the offerings my family gives are NOT going
    to fund conservatives and people who
    have too much integrity [​IMG]
     
    #40 Ed Edwards, Apr 24, 2003
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