News: SARS, the fake and manufactured epidemic?

[Helen]

Why did I think that you might be past mocking, Joseph?

Here, from http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/flu/fluinfo.htm

Influenza (the flu)

Influenza Viruses

Influenza, also known as the flu, is a contagious disease that is caused by the influenza virus. It attacks the respiratory tract in humans (nose, throat, and lungs). The flu is different from a cold. Influenza usually comes on suddenly and may include these symptoms:

Fever
Headache
Tiredness (can be extreme)
Dry cough
Sore throat
Nasal congestion
Body aches
These symptoms are usually referred to as "flu-like symptoms."


Anyone Can Get the Flu, But the Disease Is More Severe for Some People
Most people who get influenza will recover in one to two weeks, but some people will develop life-threatening complications (such as pneumonia) as a result of the flu. Millions of people in the United States — about 10% to 20% of U.S. residents — will get influenza each year. An average of about 36,000 people per year in the United States die from influenza, and 114,000 per year have to be admitted to the hospital as a result of influenza. Anyone can get the flu (even healthy people), and serious problems from influenza can happen at any age. People age 65 years and older, people of any age with chronic medical conditions, and very young children are more likely to get complications from influenza. Pneumonia, bronchitis, and sinus and ear infections are three examples of complications from flu. The flu can make chronic health problems worse. For example, people with asthma may experience asthma attacks while they have the flu, and people with chronic congestive heart failure may have worsening of this condition that is triggered by the flu.

For a list of groups that are at high risk for complications from influenza, see: Who Should Get a Flu Shot

How the Influenza Virus Is Passed Around

The flu is spread, or transmitted, when a person who has the flu coughs, sneezes, or speaks and sends flu virus into the air, and other people inhale the virus. The virus enters the nose, throat, or lungs of a person and begins to multiply, causing symptoms of influenza. Influenza may, less often, be spread when a person touches a surface that has flu viruses on it – a door handle, for instance – and then touches his or her nose or mouth.

The Flu Is Contagious

A person can spread the flu starting one day before he or she feels sick. Adults can continue to pass the flu virus to others for another three to seven days after symptoms start. Children can pass the virus for longer than seven days. Symptoms start one to four days after the virus enters the body. Some persons can be infected with the flu virus but have no symptoms. During this time, those persons can still spread the virus to others.

How To Know if You Have the Flu

Your respiratory illness might be the flu if you have sudden onset of body aches, fever, and respiratory symptoms, and your illness occurs during November through April (the usual flu season in the Northern Hemisphere). However, during this time, other respiratory illnesses can cause similar symptoms and flu can be caught at any time of the year. It is impossible to tell for sure if you have the flu based on symptoms alone. Doctors can perform tests to see if you have the flu if you are in the first few days of your illness.


What You Should Do If You Get the Flu

Rest
Drink plenty of liquids
Avoid using alcohol and tobacco
Take medication to relieve the symptoms of flu
Influenza is caused by a virus, so antibiotics (like penicillin) don’t work to cure it. The best way to prevent the flu is to get an influenza vaccine (flu shot) each fall, before flu season.

Do Not Give Aspirin To a Child or Teenager Who Has the Flu

Never give aspirin to children or teenagers who have flu-like symptoms – and particularly fever – without first speaking to your doctor. Giving aspirin to children and teenagers who have influenza can cause a rare but serious illness called Reye syndrome. Children or teenagers with the flu should get plenty of rest, drink lots of liquids, and take medicines that contain no aspirin to relieve symptoms.

The Myth of the "Stomach Flu”

Many people use the term "stomach flu” to describe illnesses with nausea, vomiting, or diarrhea. These symptoms can be caused by many different viruses, bacteria, or even parasites. While vomiting, diarrhea, and being nauseous or “sick to your stomach” can sometimes be related to the flu — particularly in children — these problems are rarely the main symptoms of influenza. The flu is a respiratory disease and not a stomach or intestinal disease.

Now, would anyone care to tell me how SARS is different from flu?

Types of influenze viruses -- including the fact that they are transmissable in some cases from animals: http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/flu/viruses.htm

Please note the four myths in the chart at the bottom of this page: http://www.cdc.gov/ncidod/diseases/flu/facts.htm

From here: http://familydoctor.org/handouts/477.html

If I get a flu shot, can I still get the flu?

Yes. Even with a flu shot, you aren't 100% protected. Each year, the flu vaccine contains 3 different strains (kinds) of the virus. The strains chosen are those that scientists believe are most likely to show up in the United States that year. If the choice is right, the vaccine is 70 to 90% effective in preventing the flu in healthy people under 65 years of age. If you're older than 65, the vaccine is less likely to prevent the flu. Even if you get the flu after the vaccine, your flu symptoms should be milder than if you didn't get the vaccine. You'll also be less likely to get complications from the flu.

The vaccine contains three different influenza strains. These are chosen during the previous season based upon which strains were most prevalent during the preceding year, which strains are circulating in other areas of the world (e.g. China), and which strains can be easily incorporated into the new vaccine.
http://www.canadianchiropractor.ca/Past_Issues.htm?ID=720

Influenza virus strains mutate, necessitating a new vaccine each year. Technicians affiliated with the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) collect influenza viruses from pigs and people in foreign lands, e.g., China.

CDC personnel then attempt to predict which viruses will infect people in the United States the following year-the CDC crystal ball. These CDC-selected viruses are distributed to vaccine manufacturers early in the year for influenza vaccine production for administration that autumn.

Predicting which influenza viruses from China, for instance, will infect people in Dayton, Ohio, a year later involves a fair amount of guesswork. Flu shot history is replete with examples of poor matches between influenza viruses in the vaccine and those actually infecting people.
http://www.vaccineinfo.net/immunization/vaccine/influenza/flu_vaccine_facts.shtml

(I keep finding the references to China and the Orient, but am running out of the time I alot myself for web searches to give you the definitive reference I would like to on this)

Man O man O man! This one does it for me! SARS was not only predicted, but predicted exactly as a flu outbreak a couple of years ago! Here you go:
http://www.fluwatch.com/output_news_1.cfm?pageid=65&ID=37

Monto is one of a group of experts on infectious diseases who agree that someday an especially infectious version of this deadly illness will emerge, resulting in a global catastrophe. There is ample reason to believe that this will happen, they say, because three such pandemics already have occurred in this century alone, including one in 1918 that resulted in more than 20 million deaths. Contributing to their certainty is the fact that this scenario does not involve some unknown foreign invader, such as the Ebola virus, but rather something that already happens every year -- an outbreak of the flu.

This disaster basically will begin with a small, but severe, outbreak of respiratory illness in South China, they say. Soon afterward, these outbreaks will be reported in Hong Kong, Singapore, South Korea, and Japan.

Joseph, in short, I do my homework. I have also raised six kids, cared for dozens of fosters, and know for sure that flu is NOT stomach upset! If your doctor thinks it is, please print this off and give it to him. Thank you.

 

[Helen]

Peter, cut the hot air and give me some references for your claims, please.

 

[Peter101]

>>>>>Flu kills. It kills primarily the older, the already sick, and the very young.

Is SARS simply another strain of flu?<<<<<
..........................................
The key point Helen, that you have missed, is that the death rate from SARS is more than 50 times the death rate from ordinary flu. Does it have symptoms very similar to flu? Yes, sure it does and the symptoms are similar to other types of illnesses. But the death rate is not similar and there is strong evidence that this virus is far more deadly than other flu causing viruses.

As for profit motive, you might want to consider that Steve Ransom also has a profit motive. He sells books and apparently one can make a living by lying about AIDS and other diseases, as he has done.

 

[Helen]

Please reference your statistic for "50 times more", Peter.

 

[Peter101]

>>>>>>Joseph, in short, I do my homework. I have also raised six kids, cared for dozens of fosters, and know for sure that flu is NOT stomach upset! If your doctor thinks it is, please print this off and give it to him. Thank you.<<<<<<

You are misrepresenting what Joseph said. He only said that he gets flu frequently. What is frequently? Well the medical authorities say that about 10 to 20 percent of the population get it each year, so that is not inconsistent with what Joseph said. He never said that he was talking about stomach upsets. I don't think you are in position to give advice to medical doctors, as you seem to suggest in the above.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:

Did he drop out in Kindergarten? OK, you say he makes some good and solid points. What are they? I didn't really see any. BTW, are you two friends by any chance? I notice that he is also a person who writes about YEC, and I know that seems to be your thing. So I am wondering if there is a reason you are promoting and defending this guys silliness so ardently.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by Helen:
Why did I think that you might be past mocking, Joseph?

I think you are assuming too much, Helen. Just asking some honest questions. I think you are getting cynical in your old age...

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Helen]

never met or corresponded with the guy. Have no idea who he is at all. I just recognized some intelligent questions and observations.

edit: Peter, unless you give some references for your claims, there is no reason at all anyone should believe what you are saying. Who are you to make your claims?

IN addition -- anyone who gets real influenza 'frequently' should be hospitalized just as often -- he has a compromised immune system and will probably be dead soon.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

What good points did he make? I just didn't see any.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Helen]

Then read my posts for my questions, Joseph. Is SARS simply a fancy name for another flu outbreak? Have you actually read any of the references I have posted? Do you REALLY think you get the real flu 'frequently'?

Isn't it time you educated yourself a little instead of trying to bait me?

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

I might ask the same question of you. Speaking of which, I know you are a very intelligent person. But for the record, would you please state what your educational background is?

Thanks,

Joseph Botwinick

PS: Generally, when one cannot continue defending their position, they resort to personal attacks as you have done. Interesting.

 

[Helen]

I am not depending on my educational background, which is not in medicine. I have educated myself in this particular subject for this particular thread by looking things up on the web, which I referenced for you. If you would like to check the credentials of the authors of those articles, please feel free.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by Helen:
I am not depending on my educational background, which is not in medicine.

OK. I understand.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Just curious. What, exactly, is your educational background?

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Helen]

This is the third page, which means this will be closed soon. In the meantime, not one of my questions has been answered. I have been challenged, baited and mocked, but no questions have been answered by anyone and no references given for some questionable claims.

The more I am looking into this, the more I am beginning to suspect that the very name "SARS" was made up to make this thing sound new and thus help manufacture panic.

There is plenty to be worried about with a flu outbreak, and one which seems to spread quickly as this may be doing. That is enough for concern. But what the press and someone or some group behind the press is doing seems irresponsible to me. My suspician is growing that something is going on here that we don't know about.

And why attack me for asking questions? That is an interesting phenomenon, too. Is it that the press, God bless all their ink, is to be believed no matter what they print? Is it that whatever news the networks choose to share is God's total truth?

I doubt both of those things highly.

Why are people afraid of questions? Why am I getting mocked regarding my doubts about this SARS thing being something 'new'?

Why are people afraid to educate themselves? Are we now so afraid of the 'experts' that we think we have no brains with which to think for ourselves?

 

[Helen]

Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Just curious. What, exactly, is your educational background?

Joseph Botwinick

Enough to teach for almost 30 years and then go into science editing. Enough to be a guest lecturer in some nearby colleges. Enough to read and write and think.

 

[Joseph_Botwinick]

Originally posted by Helen:
</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Joseph_Botwinick:
Just curious. What, exactly, is your educational background?

Joseph Botwinick

Enough to teach for almost 30 years and then go into science editing. Enough to be a guest lecturer in some nearby colleges. Enough to read and write and think. </font>[/QUOTE]Exactly, how much education is that? Just curious. Where did you teach for almost 30 years? Honestly, you just don't look that old in your picture. Is that picture not current? Which nearby colleges have you been a guest lecturer for? What were the topics? Never questioned that you could read and write.

Joseph Botwinick

 

[Peter101]

&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Please reference your statistic for "50 times more", Peter. &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

I calculated it from information readily available on the Internet. You can do the same if you wish, and if you come up with something different, post it here. I don't think you do your homework at all. Otherwise you would have known that many of the answers to your questions about SARS are available on the Internet. I am not going to spoon feed you though. You can find them with just a slight amount of searching.

 

[Peter101]

&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;Enough to teach for almost 30 years and then go into science editing. &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;

Seems to me that you are inflating your resume a little here with regard to "science editing".

 

[Helen]

Disregard it if you like. It makes no difference to me. Where are your references for your claims?

Joseph, I'm 55. I was born at 4:08 a.m. the morning of February 29, 1948. I graduated from high school in the famous year of 1965 (near Berkeley, even!), and from college in 1972 (I took a couple of years off in the middle and worked with horses in Lancaster, California). I started teaching at 22 but there were some gaps, so I just say 'about 30' years. I have taught in both the public and private venues. My first job was private, teaching young men incarcerated after the Watts riots of the 60's who were supposed to be both retarded and delinquent. Of the 22 in that class, I think about three were honestly retarded; the others had simply chosen to specialize in things other than academics.

I put in my stint as a sub after that, quit when I had Scott, went back later, and it continued pretty steadily after that despite a move across the state, until I took time off for a couple of years when my oldest daughter was diagnosed with RSD (Reflex sympathetic dystrophy) and then finished by teaching a number of classes at the county level for both charter families and kids who were not able to be in the public school classrooms for one reason or another (two actors, two on chemotherapy, several with deaf parents -- English is their second language and the school system often misses that -- and that sort of thing). I'm not going to put down my CV here, and this kind of personal challenge is exactly what is NOT supposed to be part of these threads. But there is all the answer I feel like taking the time for.

Now, what is the problem with the questions asked about SARS and why are you avoiding them and concentrating on me?