Obama appeals for tolerance on 9/11

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

What do the advocates of tolerance think should be done with Christianity in America?

Hmm, I notice you could not answer my question - that is, after all, the topic of this thread, is it not?

 

[Gold Dragon]

It is the will and command of God that, since the coming of His Son, the Lord Jesus, a permission of the most Paganish, Jewish, Turkish or anti-Christian consciences and worship be granted to all men, in all nations and countries; and they are only to be fought against with that sword which is only, in Soul matters able to conquer, to wit; the sword of the Spirit--the Word of God. . . . God requireth not an uniformity of religion to be enacted and enforced in any civil state; which enforced uniformity, sooner or later, is the greatest occasion of civil war, ravishing consciences, persecution of Christ Jesus in His servants, and of the hypocrisy and destruction of millions of souls. . . . An enforced uniformity of religion throughout a nation or civil state confounds the civil and religious, denies the principles of Christianity and civility, and that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh.

The Founders Constitution - Roger Williams, The Bloody Tenent, Of Persecution for Cause of Conscience

I wonder how Roger Williams would respond to Baptists in the United States making a thread like this.

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

The Founders Constitution - Roger Williams, The Bloody Tenent, Of Persecution for Cause of Conscience

I wonder how Roger Williams would respond to Baptists in the United States making a thread like this.

Excellent find. I had a vague memory of it but could not put it together.

Then again, not every Baptist holds to our traditional heritage.

 

[Dragoon68]

Hmm, I notice you could not answer my question - that is, after all, the topic of this thread, is it not?

Nope, you just didn't understand the answer which was totally predictable.

 

[Gold Dragon]

Excellent find. I had a vague memory of it but could not put it together.

Then again, not every Baptist holds to our traditional heritage.

This Roger Williams quote is not only a pivotal part of baptist heritage but also American heritage because of its place in helping to establish the 1st amendment.

 

[Matt Black]

"First they came for the Muslims...."

 

[NaasPreacher (C4K)]

This Roger Williams quote is not only a pivotal part of baptist heritage but also American heritage because of its place in helping to establish the 1st amendment.

Of course, that is my point. Religious freedom, which has been integral for Americans and Baptists for hundreds of years now seems to have been thrown out the window in the current State of Fear.

 

[Crabtownboy]

Of course, that is my point. Religious freedom, which has been integral for Americans and Baptists for hundreds of years now seems to have been thrown out the window in the current State of Fear.

Benjamin Franklin said it very well .................

“Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security”

 

[Gold Dragon]

Of course, that is my point. Religious freedom, which has been integral for Americans and Baptists for hundreds of years now seems to have been thrown out the window in the current State of Fear.

Yes, I just wanted to explicitly state what you implied.

I agree with your observation. The very human emotional responses of fear and self-preservation allow people to turn against their most prized spiritual, ideological and nationalistic principles. It is an unfortunate reality of human nature made very evident in this thread.

Christ however, suggests alternatives which we don't seem to have a lot of faith in.

But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies,
do good to those who hate you,
bless those who curse you,
pray for those who mistreat you.

If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also.
If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic.
Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back.
Do to others as you would have them do to you.
If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you?
Even 'sinners' love those who love them.
And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' do that.
And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you?
Even 'sinners' lend to 'sinners,' expecting to be repaid in full.
But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back.
Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked.
Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

 

[targus]

"First they came for the Muslims...."

Who is coming for the Muslims?

What "intolerance" other than the idiotic actions of a few are we talking about here?

I can find you isolated examples of the same sort of intolerance against any group that you would care to identify.

I think that the "intolerance" card will soon be replacing the "racist" card.

 

[targus]

"First they came for the Muslims...."

Matt, where do you stand on polygamy as practiced by Muslims in your country?

Are you ok with it?

Or should it be illegal for Muslims as it is for the rest of the population in the UK?

 

[NiteShift]

Who is coming for the Muslims?

That's the point isn't it. Nobody is coming for the Muslims, and people (mostly living overseas, or in the White House) cant tell the difference between citizens expressing strong opinion and threats. It's not happening.

 

[Gold Dragon]

That's the point isn't it. Nobody is coming for the Muslims, and people (mostly living overseas, or in the White House) cant tell the difference between citizens expressing strong opinion and threats. It's not happening.

Are you saying it is ok for Americans to express strong opinion that opposes the 1st amendment and Baptists to express strong opinions that opposes a core baptist distinctive because people are too chicken to actually carry through on their strong opinion with action?

Why is ok for Americans and Baptists to express these opinions that oppose the U.S. constitution and baptist distinctives?

 

[targus]

Are you saying it is ok for Americans to express strong opinion that opposes the 1st amendment and Baptists to express strong opinions that opposes a core baptist distinctive because people are too chicken to actually carry through on their strong opinion with action?

Why is ok for Americans and Baptists to express these opinions that oppose the U.S. constitution and baptist distinctives?

What opinions are those exactly?

Are you expressing an opinion against freedom of speech?

You seem to opposing the U.S. Constitution yourself.

 

[HankD]

A relevant and important question for the president concerning tolerance on the part of all Americans (and also the question "should moslems be allowed to worship their deity in America?") is "to what extent Mr. president?"

Sharia Law?
To what extent should we tolerate the imposition of Sharia law where the Constitution is either silent or actually supports it per "freedom of religion" so-called?

Obviously polygamy is against the law in America,
Obviously the death penalty for Adultery and other forms of carnality are against the law in America.
Obviously the total prohibition of the sale of pork products is against the law in America.

but here is an example of "how far?".

How tolerant should we be concerning for instance the "call to prayer" (Azan) which is a very important part of muslim worship?

Should muslims be free to have the Azan chanted out over a loud speaker five times a day whenever and wherever they wish in America?

After all Christians chime out church bells.

So be tolerant!

Christian merchants are free to have Christmas Carols sending out the message of the Christ Child over loud speakers at Christmas time.

Be tolerant!

How about - be honest!

How about it everyone for freedom of worship? Is it really that simple?
Do you really want the Azan chanted out 5 times a day in your neigborhood?

Twice in the prayer is a statement that there is no deity but theirs and there is no prophet but theirs.

Ok you can ignore it because it's in arabic.

But do you really want to be tolerant enough to allow it in your neighborhood?

How about in the neighborhood of the White House?

HankD

 

[Matt Black]

Who is coming for the Muslims?

Some of the posters here seem to be advocating that; I'd be happy to be disabused of that.

 

[Matt Black]

Matt, where do you stand on polygamy as practiced by Muslims in your country?

Are you ok with it?

No, it's against the law of the land and Muslims are bound by that law as much as everyone else. Same with forced marriages.

 

[targus]

Some of the posters here seem to be advocating that; I'd be happy to be disabused of that.

Can you point to any post in particular?

Or any poster in particular?

I really don't recall seeing anyone advocating rounding up the Muslims.

 

[Alcott]

Benjamin Franklin said it very well .................

“Anyone who trades liberty for security deserves neither liberty nor security”

So anyone who is not in favor of removing ALL metal detectors and other security devices at airports is absolutely undeserving of liberty?

 

[Alcott]

"First they came for the Muslims...."

"They" didn't do too good a job; there's a billion of them.